# Plateau on cycle



## Gainsbruh (Jun 4, 2014)

Hey,
I'm 9 weeks into my Test E cycle @800mg/wk. I front loaded with dbol for 5 weeks. I've gained about 30lbs by the 7th week but now I haven't put on any more weight although my strength has increased a bit. I have thought about increasing calories but I'm already eating 4000 cals/day @ 45c/35p/20f. I have put on a little bit of fat and don't know if It's the dosage of gear that I've plateaued with, or if I should just increase calories. I've been advised to switch to T400 @ the same dosage per week and throw in EQ @ 600mg/week for an additional 10 weeks. I figure that this would be a good idea rather than upping my Test E dose to 1g+/week.
Also I do plan to compete in Men's BB next year and I am trying not to get too fat during the bulk. Just interested in any thoughts/advice/critiques.

Thanks,
*Gainsbruh*


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## nastyNate (Jun 4, 2014)

Is this your first cycle? 

I usually plateau at about 10 weeks, or better put slow down on the changes. Preferential to increasing test dose I would opt for throwing in another compound. eq sounds good to me, or tren, or deca whatever floats your boat. Actually, I'd do tren e at 4 or 600/week for 10 weeks and clean things up a bit with the body fat. If 10 weeks of tren freaks you out do the eq but run at least 10 more weeks


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## PillarofBalance (Jun 4, 2014)

Part of it is mental. The dbol puts weight on fast and when that stops it can get to your head.  What's your height weight and appx BF%?


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## losieloos (Jun 4, 2014)

You're probably losing water weight  from the dbol


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## Gainsbruh (Jun 4, 2014)

nastyNate said:


> Is this your first cycle?
> 
> I usually plateau at about 10 weeks, or better put slow down on the changes. Preferential to increasing test dose I would opt for throwing in another compound. eq sounds good to me, or tren, or deca whatever floats your boat. Actually, I'd do tren e at 4 or 600/week for 10 weeks and clean things up a bit with the body fat. If 10 weeks of tren freaks you out do the eq but run at least 10 more weeks




Yeah, it's my first cycle. I was considering tren as well.


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## Gainsbruh (Jun 4, 2014)

PillarofBalance said:


> Part of it is mental. The dbol puts weight on fast and when that stops it can get to your head.  What's your height weight and appx BF%?



That sounds right, but I figured I would have gained atleast a few pounds in 2 weeks.(EDIT) Forgot to add I'm 5'11 205lbs approx 13-15%BF


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## Gainsbruh (Jun 4, 2014)

losieloos said:


> You're probably losing water weight  from the dbol



Maybe you're right, I haven't lost any weight though. Just no increases in 2 weeks.


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## nastyNate (Jun 4, 2014)

Ok yea man don't freak out. How old are you?

Sounds like you're right where you should be. I like 20 week cycles with the idea being that the first 10 or 12 weeks is where the main bulk of the gains happen the last 10 weeks is where you solidify the gains. First cycle I ran was going to be 6 weeks of test. That turned into 24 weeks of test, then test and npp then test and tren ace. Took about 2 months off then did test and deca. Those first 8 months resulted in some serious physical changes in my physique. Lots of fun. The gains on cycle though are not linear. Things start to flatten off as you progress. Makes sense when you think about it. If you over feed you will just get fatter. You can only gain muscle so fast even with all the juice gh igf or whatever you can force into your system. If you want to do a show I would clean up what you have and see where things settle. I'm not saying starvation diet or anything but figure your tdee and settle somewhere around there. be careful paying too much attention to body weight though this will tend to screw with your head after a while. Like was mentioned, you can have some serious fluid shifts that can change your weight +/- 5% of body weight almost overnight.


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## Seeker (Jun 4, 2014)

I'm baffled here. You gained 30 lbs and you're bothered because it stopped? I don't know what you're expecting brother but you aren't gonna become Olympia ready overnight.  Even on gear you need to put in years of work, work, work.  This is your 1st cycle and you want to run like as if you've been gearing for years. Slow down bro, get some blood work and see where you're at.


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## Gainsbruh (Jun 4, 2014)

nastyNate said:


> Ok yea man don't freak out. How old are you?
> 
> Sounds like you're right where you should be. I like 20 week cycles with the idea being that the first 10 or 12 weeks is where the main bulk of the gains happen the last 10 weeks is where you solidify the gains. First cycle I ran was going to be 6 weeks of test. That turned into 24 weeks of test, then test and npp then test and tren ace. Took about 2 months off then did test and deca. Those first 8 months resulted in some serious physical changes in my physique. Lots of fun. The gains on cycle though are not linear. Things start to flatten off as you progress. Makes sense when you think about it. If you over feed you will just get fatter. You can only gain muscle so fast even with all the juice gh igf or whatever you can force into your system. If you want to do a show I would clean up what you have and see where things settle. I'm not saying starvation diet or anything but figure your tdee and settle somewhere around there. be careful paying too much attention to body weight though this will tend to screw with your head after a while. Like was mentioned, you can have some serious fluid shifts that can change your weight +/- 5% of body weight almost overnight.



Thanks for the support, yeah I was freaking out a bit. Would you recommend Tren instead of EQ, or EQ and lower BF through diet? Also I am 20 years old.


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## Gainsbruh (Jun 4, 2014)

Seeker said:


> I'm baffled here. You gained 30 lbs and you're bothered because it stopped? I don't know what you're expecting brother but you aren't gonna become Olympia ready overnight.  Even on gear you need to put in years of work, work, work.  This is your 1st cycle and you want to run like as if you've been gearing for years. Slow down bro, get some blood work and see where you're at.



It's not that I'm bothered that it stopped, nor do I expect to be olympia ready overnight. I am aware of the hard work and time it takes to get there. Is it so bad that I want to maximize my results?


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## losieloos (Jun 4, 2014)

I gained 40 pounds on my first cycle, so if you don't match that then it's a failure bro.


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## Gainsbruh (Jun 4, 2014)

losieloos said:


> I gained 40 pounds on my first cycle, so if you don't match that then it's a failure bro.



Not sure if serious or troll.


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## Seeker (Jun 4, 2014)

Gainsbruh said:


> It's not that I'm bothered that it stopped, nor do I expect to be olympia ready overnight. I am aware of the hard work and time it takes to get there. Is it so bad that I want to maximize my results?



I think for your 1st cycle you've made a fine accomplishment  now the right thing to do is Get some blood work so you'll know where to go from here.


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## nastyNate (Jun 4, 2014)

^^^^damn thats young.....I'll refrain from lecturing about the risk off aas at a young age. 

Tren or eq......Given your age and the general acceptance that eq is less suppressive than tren I'll go with the eq but they are both good, tren is just better for recomps. Just know what your getting in to. After a 20 week cycle with 10 of tren (if thats the way you go) you probably will be shut down hard for a few months.


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## DreamChaser (Jun 4, 2014)

Tren is good for everything


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## Gainsbruh (Jun 4, 2014)

nastyNate said:


> ^^^^damn thats young.....I'll refrain from lecturing about the risk off aas at a young age.
> 
> Tren or eq......Given your age and the general acceptance that eq is less suppressive than tren I'll go with the eq but they are both good, tren is just better for recomps. Just know what your getting in to. After a 20 week cycle with 10 of tren (if thats the way you go) you probably will be shut down hard for a few months.



Fair enough I'll just stick with adding the EQ


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## ECKSRATED (Jun 4, 2014)

U put 30 pounds on so that means u need more food to feed those 30 pounds. 

Be happy with the gains u made and from now until the end of your cycle just train hard and let your body acclimate to those gains.


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## Gainsbruh (Jun 4, 2014)

DreamChaser said:


> Tren is good for everything


I bet, never used it yet. lol your avi though


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## Gainsbruh (Jun 4, 2014)

ECKSRATED said:


> U put 30 pounds on so that means u need more food to feed those 30 pounds.
> 
> Be happy with the gains u made and from now until the end of your cycle just train hard and let your body acclimate to those gains.



What do you think about adding the EQ though


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## Gainsbruh (Jun 4, 2014)

ECKSRATED said:


> U put 30 pounds on so that means u need more food to feed those 30 pounds.
> 
> Be happy with the gains u made and from now until the end of your cycle just train hard and let your body acclimate to those gains.



Also are you advising that I increase my calories? My maintenance calorie intake is around 3500 and I'm already in a surplus of 500. Wouldn't I just put on unnecessary fat?


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## JOMO (Jun 4, 2014)

ECKSRATED said:


> U put 30 pounds on so that means u need more food to feed those 30 pounds.
> 
> Be happy with the gains u made and from now until the end of your cycle just train hard and let your body acclimate to those gains.



This right Hurr! I would be happy with 30lbs and surprised more didn't mention upping your calories. Slowly increase your calories and go from there.


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## ECKSRATED (Jun 4, 2014)

Gainsbruh said:


> What do you think about adding the EQ though



Your first cycle I think it's unnecessary honestly. 30 lbs is alot. It's not all muscle but even even if u keep 10 solid pounds of muscle from that then it's a fantastic cycle.

Don't go crazy with adding compounds yet. Be patient. That will make your next cycle that much better after taking a break from everything. In my experience u get better gains starting fresh with different compounds rather than adding them mid cycle like u want to do. You have added a lot of size and eq for 10 weeks might not do much for youto be honest. You don't wanna be ****ing around with high rbc and BP on your first cycle. That's my opinion.


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## Gainsbruh (Jun 4, 2014)

ECKSRATED said:


> Your first cycle I think it's unnecessary honestly. 30 lbs is alot. It's not all muscle but even even if u keep 10 solid pounds of muscle from that then it's a fantastic cycle.
> 
> Don't go crazy with adding compounds yet. Be patient. That will make your next cycle that much better after taking a break from everything. In my experience u get better gains starting fresh with different compounds rather than adding them mid cycle like u want to do. You have added a lot of size and eq for 10 weeks might not do much for youto be honest. You don't wanna be ****ing around with high rbc and BP on your first cycle. That's my opinion.



Thank you.
Although I was thinking. If I donate blood and keep my BP in check, would there be no issue? Would it be so bad to strive for another 10-15 lbs by the end of cycle. Maybe it's just me, I've always been ambitious. I just feel that if I can make more gains, why not?


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## SuperBane (Jun 4, 2014)

You should be automatically banned for telling a twenty year old on his first cycle to add in tren. Then for ten weeks? On the long ester?. I'm baffled on your ****in logic. I wish village idiots earn themselves * next to o their names. So nobody took their advice seriously.

Ok he is going to compete next year.
Nobody asked if he was blasting / cruise.
Nothing.
PCT.

I mean what the **** is going on in this thread.
One of the only few smart response s I read told you to do the right thing and get bloods.

Also read GetSomes thread on first cycle.

Damn I'm not sure how any advice can be given with out more info from the OP.
Let us all just slew from thy mouth and blurt whatever comes to mind.

The old Bundy would have came through and talk a ton of shit ALREADY.

Second most note worthy post .... You gained 30 pounds ......

****in ****s. I'm going to have to go into pfm mode with the shit talk.


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## nastyNate (Jun 4, 2014)

^^^ automatically banned? sure if necessary. Like I said, I refrain from lecturing usually and stick to answering questions. There are so many reasons doing anything more than test is a bad idea for this kid. Shit, there are so many reasons doing any aas is bad at this age but its done all to often. From an endocrine standpoint I wouldn't touch anything exogenous until late 20's at the earliest. Over the years Ive become tired of saying the same thing over and over about walking the conservative line so quit. Sorry to offend your delicate sensibilities. 

op what superbane said is totally true. Its your body and you have to live with the consequences in either case.


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## GreatGunz (Jun 4, 2014)

He needs to eat.... 175 at 5'11 sorry is pretty small. You should eat you self to 200lbs. Than look at training an diet .
@800 a week you should still be making slow gains that's a lot of test for 1st time use.


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## NbleSavage (Jun 4, 2014)

OP, the Bros on here are trying to look out for you. You've made tremendous progress and now its time to let your body adjust to this new mass, check your bloods to see how you are REALLY reacting to the exogenous Test (as opposed to just how you feel) and to adjust your diet / recalculate your TDEE so you can keep your new mass. 

I would 2nd reading Get Some's thread covering PCT (you DO have your PCT planned out & readily available, yea?) and focus now on cementing your gains rather than adding a new compound to your 1st cycle. Plenty of time to experiment down the road. For now, enjoy the fact that you achieved your cycle goals and learn how to come-off successfully.


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## woodswise (Jun 4, 2014)

1.  I would stick with the original plan and run the cycle for 16 to 24 weeks.

2.  Those initial 30 lbs is at least 10 lbs water and another 10 lbs of fat.  How much muscle did you gain?  Maybe 5 lbs, and maybe 10 lbs.  One of the reasons your gains have slowed is your body is reaching equilibrium and you are no longer gaining water.  What you need to do now, is stay in a Kcalorie surplus so you continue to make modest gains the rest of the cycle.  I would shoot for 1 to 2 lbs per week at the most, and maybe only 1 lb per week.

3.  Adding equipose now would be a mistake.  You need to run that for long periods to see any gains, and it raises your RBC and blood pressure.  So your gains won't be much on it even as you increase your risk of heart attack due to increased RBC.

4.  You say you are an overachiever.  By this I think you mean your goal is to maximize gains at all times.  Me too.  But what I have learned over time is you can gain only so much from the AAS in a given time.  Maybe 1 to 2 lbs of muscle per month on average.  If you try to push it, you won't increase your gains as much as you increase the negative side effects and fat gains.  It is far better to start out at low levels, take the newbie gains as they come, then start to increase on future cycles after you know what works for you and what does not.  This is because your body adapts to the AAS and metabolizes it more efficiently over time at whatever levels you become accustomed to using it.  So as a result of starting out at high levels you can easily end up needing much higher levels of AAS to make the same gains you could have made on half the amount if you had started at lower levels.  

5.  Some of the best advice I have had about AAS is to keep the dose as low as I can and still see decent results, and not to change up my plans mid cycle (i.e. to stick with the original plan).

Good luck bro and keep us posted on your progress.


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## Gainsbruh (Jun 5, 2014)

SuperBane said:


> You should be automatically banned for telling a twenty year old on his first cycle to add in tren. Then for ten weeks? On the long ester?. I'm baffled on your ****in logic. I wish village idiots earn themselves * next to o their names. So nobody took their advice seriously.
> 
> Ok he is going to compete next year.
> Nobody asked if he was blasting / cruise.
> ...



I didn't think it necessary to mention my PCT, as that is a given... I covered the majority of my information in my introduction thread, however I see now I should have included it. Although I don't think anyone would have bothered to read that much. You just seem to be frustrated with yourself to be honest, however I will look into GetSome's thread and already have planned to get my bloods done next week.


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## Gainsbruh (Jun 5, 2014)

woodswise said:


> 1.  I would stick with the original plan and run the cycle for 16 to 24 weeks.
> 
> 2.  Those initial 30 lbs is at least 10 lbs water and another 10 lbs of fat.  How much muscle did you gain?  Maybe 5 lbs, and maybe 10 lbs.  One of the reasons your gains have slowed is your body is reaching equilibrium and you are no longer gaining water.  What you need to do now, is stay in a Kcalorie surplus so you continue to make modest gains the rest of the cycle.  I would shoot for 1 to 2 lbs per week at the most, and maybe only 1 lb per week.
> 
> ...



Thanks, I appreciate the advice


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