# Cash: what were you cruising at?



## BigFella (Jul 16, 2012)

I know it's in a thread somewhere, but for the benefit of others as well as me, what was your dose, and most importantly what were your tested T levels? And if they were higher than the 900 you're now producing naturally, did you feel different?

I'm trying to get dialed in. Third month on injections  My doc is fine with me self-titrating, so I'm doing 0.5ml Test E E3D, but that has taken me to 1300 (only one reading as yet at that dose). I have ZERO problem with that level - I feel absolutely fabulous, I'm not aromatising much (way, way less than on the cream), I'm having huge success getting off a whole lot of other prescription drugs (Prozac, stilnox, painkillers so far).

But I'd like to use as little external drugs as possible, and I thought you could add some of your usual words of wisdom.


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## Cashout (Jul 16, 2012)

I started my HRT at 200 mg of test cyp 1 once every 7 days.
My levels would range from 2000+ ng/dl to 900 ng/dl on that protocol.

I later split my dosage to 100 mg of test cyp every 84 hours.
My levels would range from 1100 ng/dl to 1600 ng/dl.

Later still I backed it down to about 70 mg every 84 hours.
That was were I found a "sweet spot" and ranged from 900 - 1350.

That was much more comfortable for me and allowed me to stop using the AI altogether.

My goal was to use as little drugs as possible to produce the desired effect.

As far as feeling any different, I feel just as good now as I ever did on HRT. I think some of that comes from the piece of mind in knowing that my body is running at full capacity once again just like it always did when I was younger.


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## juuced (Jul 16, 2012)

I kind of took Cashout's advice a couple months ago and went on the monday/wed/fri shot schedule of 80mg each.

I have been feeling real great on this protocol.  Also backed the Anastrozole down to .5mg 3x week instead of 1mg 3x/wk.
My ED issues have been a lot better on this program.  Actually no ED at all.  I get new blood tests in two weeks.

before the switch I was on 200mg once per every 5 days.  that had my test levels around 2000 which is too high to be cruising at.


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## BigFella (Jul 17, 2012)

You guys were more specific than me. I just mentioned the 0.5ml, not what was in it.

1 mL Primoteston Depot contains 250 mg testosterone enanthate (equivalent to approximately 180 mg testosterone) in clear, yellowish oily solution for injection.​
So I'm currently injecting 125mg Test E, equivalent to 90mg pure testosterone, E3D, which is roughly 290mg Test E, 210mg pure test per week. And that's giving me 1300ng/dl.(One assay only.)

I started with 0.5mg anastrozole E3D because when I was on AndroForte (Aussie made scrotally applied cream) I was aromatising heavily, yet getting few testosterone gains. I have now halved that with no negative side effects. (I've twice applied the cream for a mini-blast, and it definitely worked. Better pumps, best bench for thirty years.)

I've been toying with the idea of dropping it to E84H or less but I kinda like where I am right now, so I'll give it another couple of months, get re-tested and see where we go from there. As I've said in another thread my doc said he'd prescribe HGH and I'm sorta looking forward to that!


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## DF (Jul 17, 2012)

Have you discussed how many iu of hgh & schedule for taking it? I'm interested in what your doc will recommend.


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## BigFella (Jul 17, 2012)

My doc already realises I'm way ahead of him on this so it will be less a matter of him recommending to me, and more of me telling him what I need and why - in a well constructed, well argued email, referencing research papers, web sites and the like. I then follow that up with a phone consultation, we chew the fat for a while, he asks me what I want - all good.

So that's why I'm heavily researching it. What do you recommend as an information source?

For that matter what do people recommend? I'm Sargeant Schultz on this one so far.

(The only thing I'm tentatively concerned about is if he prescribes it and I can't get it in Oz, like my worthless HCG script. I'm gonna have to find a dodgy place to get HCG even though I'm legit!)


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## DF (Jul 17, 2012)

To be honest the best source of info that I have found is Zeek.  He has been taking it for decades.  Also I'd be willing to bet that Cashout has a great deal of info on the subject as well & can probably point to some studies.  I'd like to hear their take on hgh with trt.  Also I am taking a low dose of 2iu 5 on 2 off.  I'm not sure that I have seen Cashout comment on hgh, so would be interesting to get his take.


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## Cashout (Jul 17, 2012)

Dfeaton said:


> To be honest the best source of info that I have found is Zeek.  He has been taking it for decades.  Also I'd be willing to bet that Cashout has a great deal of info on the subject as well & can probably point to some studies.  I'd like to hear their take on hgh with trt.  Also I am taking a low dose of 2iu 5 on 2 off.  I'm not sure that I have seen Cashout comment on hgh, so would be interesting to get his take.



I've researched it in great detail and I am lucky to have my brother, who is chief of pediatrics at one of the best medical schools in the nation to support my efforts. He works with a lot of children with short stature conditions and prescribes hgh for that condition regularly. His insights have been very useful.

My nutshell conclusion, based on my specific goals and current physical evaluation, is the I would not personally benefit from hgh supplementation.

My serum IGF-1 level, the most common marker used to assess hgh, is already substantially higher than most folks (360+). 

I don't present any collagen synthesis issues at this time so I can't justify the cost to benefit.

Some good readings in that area are...

S. Dossong & M. Kjaer, "Growth Hormone and Connective Tissue," Scandinavian Journal of Medicine and Science in Sports, 2005, Vol 15, pp 202-210.

T. Rosen, "Supra physiological Doses of Growth Hormone: Effects on Muscle and Collagen in Healthy Active Young Adults," Hormone Research, 2006, Vol 66 Sup 1, pp 98-104.


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## DF (Jul 17, 2012)

That's great! Thank you for the info Cashout.  Do you have an opinion on effective dosage?  And also injection frequency?


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## Cashout (Jul 17, 2012)

There have been 3 specific studies conducted that I've have in front of me that were done on weight-trained/powelifter subjects and in those studies the treatments (standardized for a 200 pound male) ranged from 2.5 iu daily to 5.5 iu daily. Of these three studies, only the 5.5 iu treatment produced a net whole body increase in protein synthesis using a standard [1-C] leucine test method.


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## DF (Jul 17, 2012)

Thank you Cashout.  I'm going to look up those studies.


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## BigFella (Jul 18, 2012)

Thanks Cashout and Dfeaton. As well as providing brilliant information you're also showing how much better this forum is than the other one.

I'll research them and no doubt go down a lot of other paths. I'll post what I find out.

Zeek: if you don't chip in here I'll chase you directly!


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