# Test is Best ?



## John Ziegler (Oct 24, 2017)

Other than a fist cycle and when youve figured out the testosterone basics 

 let's hear why 

"test is best" 

Note to self ad "test is best" to buggin & illin thread 

:32 (16):


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## John Ziegler (Oct 24, 2017)

First cycle that is not what you do behind closed doors


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## stonetag (Oct 24, 2017)

My answer in my best shit kicker voice "Cuz it is"...


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## JuiceTrain (Oct 24, 2017)

I mean....as a stand alone compound, yes?
Tren is best imo but i wouldn't run that ish by itself


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## JuiceTrain (Oct 24, 2017)

And "Ish" is the censored version of the word.....Shxt


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## ECKSRATED (Oct 24, 2017)

I think people say it when the topic of choosing other compounds to do certain things. Test is the best in my opinion because it doesn't bring much sides, opposed to tren and deca and orals. You can do so much with just a simple test cycle, actually u can do anything with it. 

People tend to say it including myself when u hear guys debating over which other compounds to use. **** the other compounds what's wrong with just a trusty old test cycle?? Most guys don't need other compounds but think they need to add them because it's their second or third run.


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## Trout90 (Oct 24, 2017)

I think what most people mean when they say test is best is that they feel the best because they have virtually no sides while they are still able to make good gains and feel good to put it simply.


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## BRICKS (Oct 24, 2017)

My question back would be what's better than test for any cycle?


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## PillarofBalance (Oct 24, 2017)

It's middle of the road. It's anabolic it's androgenic, the sides are typically tolerable or easily controlled and it's a natural hormone that our body produces. 

Plus the boners are awesome.


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## jennerrator (Oct 24, 2017)

Test is fuuuking awesome...thank God my Dr. is a hormone DR. that believes in treating women for low test....best decision I ever made and not ever going to stop!


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## Flyingdragon (Oct 24, 2017)

Big PP is best!


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## Jaydub (Oct 24, 2017)

Can't beat test. Everyone has their preference, but I've just had my best gains, and best attitude, best over all experiences with test. EQ, deca, tren.. none of them matched what a good solid test cycle did for me. Over all..


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## John Ziegler (Oct 24, 2017)

so test is a very well tolerated and versatile hormone 

But let's hear about more specifically why it's the best 

In what departments 

Like is it the best for strength ? 

(mind you the best means better than everything  else)

the he best for gaining size ? 

the best for getting a hard and dry look

The best for indurance ? 

Best at for banging chicks ?


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## Seeker (Oct 24, 2017)

Zeigler said:


> so test is a very well tolerated and versatile hormone
> 
> But let's hear about more specifically why it's the best
> 
> ...



I know exactly where you're going with this. Test is test.  Steroids are steroids.


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## knightmare999 (Oct 24, 2017)

Best all around is my thought.  Several other members have given reasons and I agree with them:  minimal sides, balanced anabolic and androgenic ratio, versatile with respect to application towards various goals.  No conversion necessary in the body, avoids liver toxicity related to orals, positive effects on libido.
There is no "best in all categories," but assessing all attributes in aggregate, I believe test is best overall.  
Run tren alone for 16 weeks.  No?  Because it fails in certain areas.  If you can't run it standalone (tren, mast, app, whatever), I don't see how you could even consider it as being better.
I doubt you'll like my perspective, or any perspective that disagrees with yours, but I'm not trying to persuade you--just sharing my thoughts.


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## Seeker (Oct 24, 2017)

knightmare999 said:


> Best all around is my thought.  Several other members have given reasons and I agree with them:  minimal sides, balanced anabolic and androgenic ratio, versatile with respect to application towards various goals.  No conversion necessary in the body, avoids liver toxicity related to orals, positive effects on libido.
> There is no "best in all categories," but assessing all attributes in aggregate, I believe test is best overall.
> Run tren alone for 16 weeks.  No?  Because it fails in certain areas.  If you can't run it standalone (tren, mast, app, whatever), I don't see how you could even consider it as being better.
> I doubt you'll like my perspective, or any perspective that disagrees with yours, but I'm not trying to persuade you--just sharing my thoughts.



Test is also the main culprit for most side effects. 
Aromatizes to estrogen at a high rate/ high water retention. Cause of most high blood pressure. Most acne issues are test relates. High dht conversion. 
You yourself ever just run a high anabolic with minimum Test? 

Look, i personally also love test. But I will never run it a high dose again.  What I've learned is that no matter what and how you take. Diet is king. It will make all the difference in how you progress. Diet, bulk, maintain. It comes down to diet in the end.


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## knightmare999 (Oct 25, 2017)

Seeker said:


> Test is also the main culprit for most side effects.
> Aromatizes to estrogen at a high rate/ high water retention. Cause of most high blood pressure. Most acne issues are test relates. High dht conversion.
> You yourself ever just run a high anabolic with minimum Test?
> 
> Look, i personally also love test. But I will never run it a high dose again.  What I've learned is that no matter what and how you take. Diet is king. It will make all the difference in how you progress. Diet, bulk, maintain. It comes down to diet in the end.



I have tried to run a gram twice, and both times stopped due to sides.  I get your point about aromatization, and have a better time controlling sides up to 750 mg/week.

I was thinking about liver toxicity, "deca dick," prolactin levels, high rbc, and other issues.  If we call my point on sides invalid and scratch it off, I still think test is the best all-around.  
Diet determines everything ultimately, for sure, but Z wanted to talk AAS.

Pros and cons aside, I'm sure different compounds are better are worse for different people on an individual basis, anyways.  Experience plays into results, too, so maybe I'm biased because I can control test at moderate doses better than I can , say, NPP, which I've only run once.  

Thanks for the rebuttal


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## John Ziegler (Oct 25, 2017)

knightmare999 said:


> I have tried to run a gram twice, and both times stopped due to sides.  I get your point about aromatization, and have a better time controlling sides up to 750 mg/week.
> 
> I was thinking about liver toxicity, "deca dick," prolactin levels, high rbc, and other issues.  If we call my point on sides invalid and scratch it off, I still think test is the best all-around.
> Diet determines everything ultimately, for sure, but Z wanted to talk AAS.
> ...



Ran Nandeca at 150mgs eod for 16 weeks at time several times without an AI without test 

Got much better results than with test alone cycles 

felt great too no dick issues what so ever 

had blood work done after one cycle only thing bad was my good cholesterol was low


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## BRICKS (Oct 25, 2017)

Im kinda suprised no one has mentioned that test is also legal. You can get a prescription for it and get it legally.  You can not get other AAS legally in the US, and those that are maybe getting some var or deca with a script, your docs are really stretching and bending to justify that, at their own peril.


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## John Ziegler (Oct 25, 2017)

BRICKS said:


> Im kinda suprised no one has mentioned that test is also legal. You can get a prescription for it and get it legally.  You can not get other AAS legally in the US, and those that are maybe getting some var or deca with a script, your docs are really stretching and bending to justify that, at their own peril.



For low T yes test is best 

but when someone is talking about cycle opinions 

is the "test is best" ?

or is it just another weird idea some of the guys got in their head ?

like the whole telling guys you don't steroids bit 

While the adviser of it is not only a steroid user but a steroid user on more than just test.


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## John Ziegler (Oct 25, 2017)

Zeigler said:


> For low T yes test is best
> 
> but when someone is talking about cycle opinions
> 
> ...



The whole you ought to eat and lift for a few more years before you're ready to try some steroids speal 

:32 (18):


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## ECKSRATED (Oct 25, 2017)

Zeigler said:


> The whole you ought to eat and lift for a few more years before you're ready to try some steroids speal
> 
> :32 (18):



What's wrong with that "speal"? So a guy that's never lifted a weight in his life weighs 135 pounds soaking wet should just go ahead and start a test tren deca dbol androl cycle??? 

75%, if not more, of the guys coming on here wanting to start their first cycle are not ready for it.


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## DieYoungStrong (Oct 25, 2017)

I like test


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## Yaya (Oct 25, 2017)

If ur a man u need test. If ur a woman u need boobs


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## jennerrator (Oct 25, 2017)

and if you're a real man...you need balls....


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## Seeker (Oct 25, 2017)

jennerrator50 said:


> and if you're a real man...you need balls....



Umm...test will shrink your balls. All AAS will. That's why we have hcg.


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## jennerrator (Oct 25, 2017)

Seeker said:


> Umm...test will shrink your balls. All AAS will. That's why we have hcg.



lol it was directed to my buddy...BFF yaya...


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## Seeker (Oct 25, 2017)

jennerrator50 said:


> lol it was directed to my buddy...BFF yaya...



Ohhhh...jaajaja. ok.


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## John Ziegler (Oct 25, 2017)

ECKSRATED said:


> 75%, if not more, of the guys coming on here wanting to start their first cycle are not ready for it.



In your opinion maybe .....

Ironically I started using steroids back in 1988 at 135 pounds 

For the next 3 years you & other nay sayers recommended ought not to to be 

Was out there on  steroids looking great banging all kinds of chicks 

and I'm still breathin


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## John Ziegler (Oct 25, 2017)

The steroids are going to work and do what they were intended to do whether your ready or not


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## MrRippedZilla (Oct 26, 2017)

Zeigler said:


> In your opinion maybe .....
> Ironically I started using steroids back in 1988 at 135 pounds
> For the next 3 years you & other nay sayers recommended ought not to to be
> Was out there on  steroids looking great banging all kinds of chicks
> and I'm still breathin


Yes, I'm sure folks who look at your history are screaming "man, I want to emulate that guy". Yes, I'm sure that is exactly what is happening.

Food for thought: If you were ready, ie better training & diet knowledge, those gainz probably wouldn't have ****ed off and it wouldn't of taken you as long to get back into semi-ok shape. Something to think about


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## John Ziegler (Oct 26, 2017)

MrRippedZilla said:


> Yes, I'm sure folks who look at your history are screaming "man, I want to emulate that guy". Yes, I'm sure that is exactly what is happening.
> 
> Food for thought: If you were ready, ie better training & diet knowledge, those gainz probably wouldn't have ****ed off and it wouldn't of taken you as long to get back into semi-ok shape. Something to think about



Folks that look at my history will see I don't look nearly as good without the steroids 

And as far as gainz goes I do get big and fat if I slack off but thats if I slack off 

Didn't stop using the steroids and lose a bunch of size and strength if thats what you are implying by losing gainz

I like me, even the big and fat me so this isn't a burn on me if that;s what you're up to


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## Jin (Oct 26, 2017)

Seeker said:


> Test is also the main culprit for most side effects.
> Aromatizes to estrogen at a high rate/ high water retention. Cause of most high blood pressure. Most acne issues are test relates. High dht conversion.
> You yourself ever just run a high anabolic with minimum Test?
> 
> Look, i personally also love test. But I will never run it a high dose again.  What I've learned is that no matter what and how you take. Diet is king. It will make all the difference in how you progress. Diet, bulk, maintain. It comes down to diet in the end.






Zeigler said:


> Folks that look at my history will see I don't look nearly as good without the steroids
> 
> And as far as gainz goes I do get big and fat if I slack off but thats if I slack off
> 
> ...



I think the point here is you haven't focused on optimizing your training and don't give a shit about diet. Even though steroids help you stay in better shape, you're putting the cart before the horse. Had you learned proper diet and training the effects of the gear would be so much more evident. 

Seeker just said that at the end of the day diet is key, not AAS. So why not focus on the thing that affects your outcome more than gear does? Essentially you're relying on gear for decent results instead of having amazing results with proper diet and gear.


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## PillarofBalance (Oct 26, 2017)

Also Ziegler without picture evidence of this back in the day we  are free to assume you were banging a 4 at best. And no two 4's don't equal one 8!


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## PillarofBalance (Oct 26, 2017)

Zeigler said:


> so test is a very well tolerated and versatile hormone
> 
> But let's hear about more specifically why it's the best
> 
> ...



I think you misunderstand the statement test is best. 

It's because without it and using other steroids... Well you know what happens. It means test is REQUIRED. That is why it is king. 

Test is the steak.  Stuff like tren is the warm horseradish cream you dip each bite into.


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## John Ziegler (Oct 26, 2017)

MrRippedZilla said:


> Yes, I'm sure folks who look at your history are screaming "man, I want to emulate that guy". Yes, I'm sure that is exactly what is happening.
> 
> Food for thought: If you were ready, ie better training & diet knowledge, those gainz probably wouldn't have ****ed off and it wouldn't of taken you as long to get back into semi-ok shape. Something to think about



Semi ok shape is actually a pretty nice thing to say man thanks


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## Bro Bundy (Oct 26, 2017)

Testosterone is what makes us men... Our body knows what it is and how to use it.. I feel and train the best on just test.. Once u start adding other compounds sure the effects are greater but I usually feel like shit compared to Just test.Most of us aren't young kids and it wouldn't be to health or smart to be on tren or deca all the time even at a small dose..A person can get into incredible shape using test.. It's all diet and training aas play their part but it's just a part ..


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## Chaos501 (Oct 28, 2017)

ECKSRATED said:


> I think people say it when the topic of choosing other compounds to do certain things. Test is the best in my opinion because it doesn't bring much sides, opposed to tren and deca and orals. You can do so much with just a simple test cycle, actually u can do anything with it.
> 
> People tend to say it including myself when u hear guys debating over which other compounds to use. **** the other compounds what's wrong with just a trusty old test cycle?? Most guys don't need other compounds but think they need to add them because it's their second or third run.




After having ran several cycles with several different compund mixtures. Test is definitely the best run that shit and grow and enjoy the lack of side effects. You keep your hunger and you can eat all you want!! Other compounds come with a price! Anywhere from limp dick to anxiety to gut pains to acne and not to forget rage. So run a bad ass test cycle and run it hard and long haha!! GROW!!!


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## Jaydub (Oct 29, 2017)

My best cycle memories have been on a solid strong test e cycle. Gaining muscle just by thinking about it it seemed. Rock hard pecker non stop. Pumps in the gym that felt like my skin was gonna rip open. Feeling like superman. Tren can mess with your dick. Deca shuts you down hard and for a long time. I never saw good enough worth while gains to praise deca. And the rebound off that compound is ridiculous.  With a test cyp or e cycle it's simple. Run it, train hard, **** like a raging beast, eat, and sleep. A lot has to be said about individuality. Everyone is going to be different. But for me, I've tried pretty much everything. And nothing has had me gaining more muscle, gaining more libido (very important to me), and.. again this is my experience,  with very little sides. 750-a gram a week test and my blood pressure stayed under 135/80~ish, very little acne if any, never had terrible problems with estrogen. Sure abombs will bloat me up, ill be strong as ****. But I'll have headaches, and the day after I stop taking it , the gains already start to go.


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## John Ziegler (Oct 29, 2017)

Jaydub said:


> I never saw good enough worth while gains to praise deca



Goes to show how everyone is different 

That is exactly how I feel about test

and like I said before never ran into the dick issues with the Nandeca


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## John Ziegler (Oct 29, 2017)

If I have to pick a zombie apocalypse steroid supply it would be test 

so if that makes it the best then yes 

test is best 

but if I wanted to get as big and strong as possible 

in the next 16 weeks for a prize 

id pick the nandrolone deca


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## Beezy (Oct 29, 2017)

Jaydub said:


> My best cycle memories have been on a solid strong test e cycle. Gaining muscle just by thinking about it it seemed. Rock hard pecker non stop. Pumps in the gym that felt like my skin was gonna rip open. Feeling like superman.



On a side note... 
Just started my first cycle, test C 500/wk and this sentence made a single tear of joy run down my cheek.


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## Jaydub (Oct 30, 2017)

Beezy said:


> On a side note...
> Just started my first cycle, test C 500/wk and this sentence made a single tear of joy run down my cheek.



Yeah, my first test cycle was enanthate @ 500/wk. Old school QV stuff. It was like the blinders were taken off lol. I couldn't believe how effective it was. Best cycle I've done. Granted it was earlier in my life, was newer to the gear, but damn. Them Norma helis (however you spell it) deca was no where near it. Man, thems were the good ol days


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## Jaydub (Oct 30, 2017)

Zeigler said:


> Goes to show how everyone is different
> 
> That is exactly how I feel about test
> 
> and like I said before never ran into the dick issues with the Nandeca



I never had the deca dick with deca either. I did with tren e.. i was just saying with test it was like everything was heightened. Libido, strength, attitude.. I know other androgens can do that as well. But they mostly carry significant sides. Dbol has always made me feel like I'm invincible, but run that for 10 weeks straight and see how that blood pressure is, or how the liver is holding up, ya know?


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