# Estradiol Too High, Switching AI Strategy - Thoughts?



## NbleSavage (Oct 6, 2012)

My recent blood showed my estradiol had spiked to over 140 (acceptable range between 7 and 43). 

I'd been running ManPower 'stane at 25 Mg eod for 2-3 weeks. 

My Test intake is only 200 Mg per week - hence I'm surprised at the high estradiol value. 

Am considering switching from 'stane to Letro. Other possibility is sticking with 'stane and going to 25 Mg ed (which is a bit costly but will do if necessary). 

Cheers for input.

- Savage


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## Big Worm (Oct 6, 2012)

Kinda quick to jump straight to Letro.  You sure what you have now is good stuff?


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## NbleSavage (Oct 6, 2012)

Big Worm said:


> Kinda quick to jump straight to Letro.  You sure what you have now is good stuff?



Cheers, BW. Its ManPower 'stane so I'm fairly confident its legit. Could try another source but I've never heard any negative feedback about their products.


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## PillarofBalance (Oct 6, 2012)

I would try adex before going with Letro.


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## NbleSavage (Oct 6, 2012)

PillarofBalance said:


> I would try adex before going with Letro.



Good add, POB - may give this a roll. Any suggestions on dosing?


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## Live2Train (Oct 6, 2012)

Try Adex at .5 mg EOD.  That would be my next choice anyhow.


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## TheLupinator (Oct 6, 2012)

estro @140 with only 200mg/week of test? Thats shits bunk.. happens to all res chem companies at some point.. i always keep ancillaries around from multiple sources


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## NbleSavage (Oct 6, 2012)

Live2Train said:


> Try Adex at .5 mg EOD.  That would be my next choice anyhow.



Thanks Mate. Am leaning this way also.


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## NbleSavage (Oct 6, 2012)

mlupi319 said:


> estro @140 with only 200mg/week of test? Thats shits bunk.. happens to all res chem companies at some point.. i always keep ancillaries around from multiple sources



Cheers, Mlupi. Hate to think that as MP is a good sponsor, but yes, I'd have expected much greater results after 2+ weeks on their 'stane.


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## NbleSavage (Oct 6, 2012)

Made a couple of moves.

As MP is a board sponsor, I reached-out and asked them if it was possible I got a bad batch. I want to give the benefit of the doubt as their service and pricing are top notch. 

I've also ordered the adex as L2T suggested, from a different source. Until that arrives, I'm going to use the 'stane from GWPeptides at 50 Mg daily in an effort to quickly reduce my E2 level. 

This likely also explains the severe night sweats I've had of late (am running Tren but have done so before and never had sweats this bad). 

More to come...


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## LeanHerm (Oct 6, 2012)

Stane isn't the best ai and is fairly different than the rest. Aromasin a suicide inhibitor kills estrogen up to 85% which is why it's most guys drug of choice.  Adex kinda does the same thing but is different.


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## NbleSavage (Oct 6, 2012)

BigHerm said:


> Stane isn't the best ai and is fairly different than the rest. Aromasin a suicide inhibitor kills estrogen up to 85% which is why it's most guys drug of choice.  Adex kinda does the same thing but is different.



Cheers, BH. I understood that Exemestane was the generic for Aromasin, yes? Understood as per the suicide effect on estrogen - thats good in my case. 

As per Adex, how does it operate differently and do you have an overall preference for AI?

Keep in mind: I'm not gyno prone, apparently I'm just a prime aromatizer (if such a term exists) and I'm suspecting that many of the symptoms I've been dealing with are actually due to the high E (eg. poor sleep quality, night sweats, low libido).


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## LeanHerm (Oct 6, 2012)

Think as it as a game of duck duck goose.  The seats our are receptors. Adex beats the estrogen to the seat. Aromassin grabs the fucker sitting in the seat and throws him.  If that's makes any sense. Lol.


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## NbleSavage (Oct 6, 2012)

BigHerm said:


> Think as it as a game of duck duck goose.  The seats our are receptors. Adex beats the estrogen to the seat. Aromassin grabs the fucker sitting in the seat and throws him.  If that's makes any sense. Lol.



This may be the best analogy for AIs that I've ever read!! LOL!!

Cheers, Big Herm!!


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## NbleSavage (Oct 6, 2012)

A quick update: MP has already responded to my email (yes, on a weekend no less) and is going to reship an order of their 'stane. That's excellent service, IMO. This may have simply been a bad batch or even just a bad pack. has to happen from time to time.

That said, I'll be glad when I can get a bloody hard-on again!! (as will Missus Savage  )


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## LeanHerm (Oct 6, 2012)

Good deal brother.  Yeah I always run mp aromasin and works great for me.


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## 63Vette (Oct 6, 2012)

I run their aromasin consistantly and love it. POB said it run ANYTHING ahead of letro brother. Please keep us updated and be assured that MP will stand with you every step of the way. 

Much respect and well wishes,
Vette


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## NbleSavage (Oct 6, 2012)

63Vette said:


> I run their aromasin consistantly and love it. POB said it run ANYTHING ahead of letro brother. Please keep us updated and be assured that MP will stand with you every step of the way.
> 
> Much respect and well wishes,
> Vette



Cheers, Bro and thanks for the support. Will definitely keep this thread current. I'll plan on new bloods in 3-4 weeks but I suspect I'll notice me body responding much sooner than that.


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## PillarofBalance (Oct 7, 2012)

NbleSavage said:


> Good add, POB - may give this a roll. Any suggestions on dosing?



You can start with 1mg EOD. If you're joints start to hurt, knock it back to 1mg E3D...


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## bubbagump (Oct 7, 2012)

I used Erase pro and It seemed to be ok. Im new to all of this stuff so my opinion is isnt exactly gold. Just wanted to mention it.


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## NbleSavage (Oct 13, 2012)

Quick Update: 

ManPower's pack arrived today, not only did they replace my order but they threw-in a little extra. Great service from those blokes. 

I've also procured some Anastrozole (Adex) but will keep that in reserve in the event that I conclude 'stane won't work for me (which I doubt will be the case). 

Been running 50 Mg of another research shops' stane for the past week and as I suspected am already feeling improvement. Nightly visits from Woodrow Wilson have returned, plus a bit more energy and swag 

I will be switching now to the MP 'stane, and will run 25 Mg per day for the next week (again making certain I bring my E down from where it had spiked to), then will lean-off to my intended long-term dose of 25 mg EOD & blood work then two weeks later. 

- Savage


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## ripped_one (Oct 13, 2012)

Letro at 1mg 2x a week has done well for me.  500mg a week of test and my estrogen came back at 16.5.  Nice and low but just enough to keep me from having libido issues.  I'm sure it fluxuates some but overall it stays within range just going off of feel.


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## NbleSavage (Oct 13, 2012)

Cheers, RippedOne. Am hoping to stay away from letro if I can. I'm not running a high dose of Test (presently 250 Mg per week) and I would think that a standard exemstane protocol would keep me in in the 15-40 range where I'd like it. Any sides from letro in your experience?


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## ripped_one (Oct 13, 2012)

I've had dry joints and zero libido when I suppress it too much.  I actually got tested at < .1 ng/dl once when I was using too much.  At 2mg a week I'm pretty much side free.


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## Christosterone (Oct 13, 2012)

Exmestane is a suicide enzyme inhibitor. And that's a pretty high dose....it generally would lower estrogen more than arimidex..


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## SAD (Oct 13, 2012)

Christosterone said:


> Exmestane is a suicide enzyme inhibitor. And that's a pretty high dose....it generally would lower estrogen more than arimidex..



25mg ED is not what most would consider a "pretty high dose" when considering the goal at this point is to reduce spiked levels.  If it were for maintenance, then it would be near the upper end of a long term dose, but he already said he plans on running it at 25mg/EOD once his levels stabilize.

You are right about it being a suicide inhibitor, but that doesn't necessarily mean that it is easier to drive levels too low with it.  That is just a colloquial way of saying that once it neutralizes the estrogen, it does so permanently, whereas as BigHerm would say, Adex just takes estrogen's seat, estrogen is still rampant which causes the estrogen rebound from adex or letro or nolva.  The "up to 85%" numbers came from a study where they gave men up to 50mg/day for weeks on end.  I'm a huge fan of aromasin for a number of reasons, including its propensity to raise free testosterone.  It is the superior choice for PCT, maintenance, and most (not all) circumstances of spike E2 levels.  Extreme cases may need letro, and an unlucky few out there don't react well with aromasin.

I'm forgetting some other points I wanted to make, but if I remember I'll post up.

EDIT: I remembered.... aromasin also raises IGF levels and is easier on the lipids than its competition.


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## Christosterone (Oct 13, 2012)

SAD said:


> 25mg ED is not what most would consider a "pretty high dose" when considering the goal at this point is to reduce spiked levels.  If it were for maintenance, then it would be near the upper end of a long term dose, but he already said he plans on running it at 25mg/EOD once his levels stabilize.
> 
> You are right about it being a suicide inhibitor, but that doesn't necessarily mean that it is easier to drive levels too low with it.  That is just a colloquial way of saying that once it neutralizes the estrogen, it does so permanently, whereas as BigHerm would say, Adex just takes estrogen's seat, estrogen is still rampant which causes the estrogen rebound from adex or letro or nolva.  The "up to 85%" numbers came from a study where they gave men up to 50mg/day for weeks on end.  I'm a huge fan of aromasin for a number of reasons, including its propensity to raise free testosterone.  It is the superior choice for PCT, maintenance, and most (not all) circumstances of spike E2 levels.  Extreme cases may need letro, and an unlucky few out there don't react well with aromasin.
> 
> ...



He said he'd been running it two to three weeks, and only on 200mgs of test, I was leaning to point that it was indeed a bad batch, I run 12.5 eod after third week of cycle of 600mgs a day. Leaning towards ineffectiveness of the batch


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## NbleSavage (Oct 13, 2012)

Christosterone said:


> He said he'd been running it two to three weeks, and only on 200mgs of test, I was leaning to point that it was indeed a bad batch, I run 12.5 eod after third week of cycle of 600mgs a day. Leaning towards ineffectiveness of the batch



Cheers, Christosterone (that is a great handle). I agree with your assessment eg. had a bad batch. MP has already replaced it & even sent me a little extra for the trouble. As SAD said, I'll be back to eod at 25Mg once I get my E within a good range.


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## SAD (Oct 13, 2012)

Christosterone said:


> He said he'd been running it two to three weeks, and only on 200mgs of test, I was leaning to point that it was indeed a bad batch, I run 12.5 eod after third week of cycle of 600mgs a day. Leaning towards ineffectiveness of the batch



Ahhhh, gotcha, you were replying to an old post.  Read just a couple up and you'll see where I was coming from.  We were just on two different pages (literally) lol.


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## Christosterone (Oct 13, 2012)

Haha I see


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