# Leg Exercises for Bad Knees



## Assassin32 (Dec 5, 2013)

Alright dudes, I'm 6'3" and weighed in at 261 today, but my legs are toothpicks! Part of my problem is I have horrible knees. Specifically my right, which is bone on bone, and will have to be replaced at some point. I added Deca about 4 months ago, and although my shoulders and elbows feel great, I still have lots of daily knee pain. I can't squat at all(it's painful to get out of the hole with 135) but I want my legs to grow with my upperbody. I beginning to look very disproportionate. My wife told me if my upperbody got any bigger I was gonna tip over. What are some exercises for leg growth for a dude with awful knees? Thanks fellas.


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## Seeker (Dec 5, 2013)

Damn bro that is tough. All I can think of is can you do stairs? Bike riding up a hill ( I'm serious ) elyptical machine. I know when I've done any of those my legs would burn hard. Shouldn't be bad on the knees either.


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## DocDePanda187123 (Dec 5, 2013)

Can you do body weight squats?


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## Assassin32 (Dec 5, 2013)

Docd187123 said:


> Can you do body weight squats?



I can, pains not bad with body weight. My problem is when I get past parallel it's hard to get back up. I can do leg presses, but if I go too heavy, I pay dearly the next day.

Sidenote: Even when my knees were still good and I could squat, my legs barely grew. I played hockey for 20 years and had fairly skinny legs. They were bigger though, but now I'm starting to look ridiculous. I'm that dude at the gym, but I don't wanna be.


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## ImDennis (Dec 5, 2013)

lunges, don't bend the knee, go as low as u can, even with like half lunges.... we had this guy on ology.. did 1/5th squats, mans got beast legs.... could do that too..lol...


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## DocDePanda187123 (Dec 5, 2013)

Assassin32 said:


> I can, pains not bad with body weight. My problem is when I get past parallel it's hard to get back up. I can do leg presses, but if I go too heavy, I pay dearly the next day.



IMO leg presses are the inferior exercise and potentially make things worse than squats. Squats are the best exercise to develop leg strength and mass bar none. You have issues that need to be addressed. Make sure you 100% use proper form ABOVE ALL. This means to just below parallel where the crease in your shorts at the hip are lower than the top of your patella. Knees in line with toes chest up, etc. Try working with body weight squats and possibly bands to help your ascent. Or another option is body weight box squats and forget about the concentric contraction at the bottom out the hole as it will place extra stress on the knee. Another option I can think of is strengthening your knee in water then progress to squats. Swim squat in a pool etc. Less stress on the knee.


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## Assassin32 (Dec 5, 2013)

ImDennis said:


> lunges, don't bend the knee, go as low as u can, even with like half lunges.... we had this guy on ology.. did 1/5th squats, mans got beast legs.... could do that too..lol...



Dude, how do you do lunges without bending your knee? 1/5 squats? Now I think you're just f'n with me. It's all good though.


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## Assassin32 (Dec 5, 2013)

Docd187123 said:


> IMO leg presses are the inferior exercise and potentially make things worse than squats. Squats are the best exercise to develop leg strength and mass bar none. You have issues that need to be addressed. Make sure you 100% use proper form ABOVE ALL. This means to just below parallel where the crease in your shorts at the hip are lower than the top of your patella. Knees in line with toes chest up, etc. Try working with body weight squats and possibly bands to help your ascent. Or another option is body weight box squats and forget about the concentric contraction at the bottom out the hole as it will place extra stress on the knee. Another option I can think of is strengthening your knee in water then progress to squats. Swim squat in a pool etc. Less stress on the knee.


Thanks Doc, the only reason I do leg presses is it's an exercise I can do with weight and limited pain because of the range of motion. I know I probably shouldn't do them.


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## Seeker (Dec 5, 2013)

If your legs are gonna grow you have to force some type of  resistant Hypertrophy on them.  I can't see body squats doing that.


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## ImDennis (Dec 5, 2013)

Assassin32 said:


> Dude, how do you do lunges without bending your knee? 1/5 squats? Now I think you're just f'n with me. It's all good though.



dude i dont know, but i was watching this girl cause i saw a hot pic of her on facebook, so looked her up and she does everything without really bending the knee..... watch it, see if ucan take anything away from it  somethings better then nothing, if not u get to look at a hot girl


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## Joliver (Dec 5, 2013)

You can force hypertrophy on your legs by volume, but unfortunately, progessive overload is not feasible in your condition.  If you can't introduce that volume via exercise you have a few unconventional options that have served me pretty well.

1) Weighted vest--Don't slap 90lbs on your back, but rather start with something more manageable.  10% of your bodyweight worn during daily activity for a few hours.  Any stair you encounter will be additional resistance.  It also increases your VO2 max, and general physical strength.  You will feel like a new man after a month. 

2) Electrostimulation--Using 2.5Khz will stimulate the muscle in a way that is complementary to what you can currently do.  I swear by it.  It has decreased my healing time and added stability and strength to my joints.  It hurts like hell if you do it wrong, so if the saying "no pain, no gain" means anything to you....this is your machine. 

3) Box Squats--Have a box above the point in your lift where you begin to feel pain as you apply reversal strength.  Sit on the box  like you would a chair and relax for two seconds.  The box lends itself to enhance your stopping power. Then lead out of the hole with your head and torso (shifting the initial hole shot to the hips, glutes, and hams. 

4) Knee wraps--You need to wrap your knees with a 2.5m wrap.  Use a "sub-x" technique.  It lends for great reboud and maximum protection.  When i wrap my knees correctly and tightly, i get 40-50lbs on my squat.   

5) Sled dragging/pushing--Drag a sled forwards and backwards with a shitload of weight on it.  Push it once in a while to change it up.  Mo weight...mo betta.  You control your stride length and cadence, so you shouldnt feel pain.

It may sound like BS, but i have successfully used them all of these methods with statistically significant results. 


Electrostimulation shit you might like to read...

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22095207
http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s00421-011-2133-7/fulltext.html


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## Assassin32 (Dec 5, 2013)

joliver said:


> You can force hypertrophy on your legs by volume, but unfortunately, progessive overload is not feasible in your condition.  If you can't introduce that volume via exercise you have a few unconventional options that have served me pretty well.
> 
> 1) Weighted vest--Don't slap 90lbs on your back, but rather start with something more manageable.  10% of your bodyweight worn during daily activity for a few hours.  Any stair you encounter will be additional resistance.  It also increases your VO2 max, and general physical strength.  You will feel like a new man after a month.
> 
> ...


Thanks Jol, awesome info bud. I really appreciate it. I've tried knee wraps, it helped, but the problem is I don't have any cartiledge in my right knee. I have osteoarthritis. I love the sled pushing/dragging idea. I never really even thought about that.


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## DocDePanda187123 (Dec 5, 2013)

Seeker said:


> If your legs are gonna grow you have to force some type of  resistant Hypertrophy on them.  I can't see body squats doing that.



I suggested body weight squats as a beginning. He can't squat 135 without pain so starting with body weight and progressing at a safe rate will help strengthen him up and increases the workload slowly but surely.

Edit* I absolutely agree that they won't be enough in the long run


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## BigGameHunter (Dec 5, 2013)

Get a creeper like mechanics use from auto zone.  Then get some elastic bands from academy. Wrap the bands around a leg of a desk, chair or something sturdy.  Lay on your back and put your feet on the desk or sturdy object.  Press away will be light resistance until you can work your way up to Hyndu Squats.

A buddy of mine does this with his patients that are recovering from leg injuries for physical therapy.  Sounds crazy but you wont hurt your self.

Concrete or tile floors will work the best.


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## halfwit (Dec 5, 2013)

ImDennis said:


> dude i dont know, but i was watching this girl cause i saw a hot pic of her on facebook, so looked her up and she does everything without really bending the knee..... watch it, see if ucan take anything away from it  somethings better then nothing, if not u get to look at a hot girl



Ya know, sometimes I wish my monitor was scratch 'n sniff.


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## PillarofBalance (Dec 5, 2013)

I have gotten at least a dozen people with knee issues to start squatting again by having them box squat with a wider stance.  It takes the pressure off the knees especially when done properly (spread the floor with the feet, sit back onto the box and focus on using the hips first to get off the box). Knee wraps will also help with stability of the knee itself but don't wrap to tight.


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## Joliver (Dec 5, 2013)

x2 on the wide stance.


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## Assassin32 (Dec 5, 2013)

PillarofBalance said:


> I have gotten at least a dozen people with knee issues to start squatting again by having them box squat with a wider stance.  It takes the pressure off the knees especially when done properly (spread the floor with the feet, sit back onto the box and focus on using the hips first to get off the box). Knee wraps will also help with stability of the knee itself but don't wrap to tight.


POB, should I put the box at parallel, it's when I go below parallel that the pain really sets in on regular squats.


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## PillarofBalance (Dec 5, 2013)

Assassin32 said:


> POB, should I put the box at parallel, it's when I go below parallel that the pain really sets in on regular squats.



Start at just above parallel and work your way down. Stay out of the painful depths of course. You aren't a powerlifter so it's not that big of a deal for you. But squatting is important regardless.


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## AliCat (Dec 5, 2013)

About 10 years ago I tore my mcl and tried pilates.  I was amazed at how many exercises you can do on your butt and not put any stress on the knee.  The exercises aren't intended to build much bulk, but they can build some bulk and strength.


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## Assassin32 (Dec 5, 2013)

Thanks for all the replies boys and girls. I appreciate it. You're all ****in awesome. Monday I'm gonna try box squats with knee wraps and a wide stance and I'll go from there. Rock and ****in roll!


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## stonetag (Dec 16, 2013)

Assassin32 said:


> Alright dudes, I'm 6'3" and weighed in at 261 today, but my legs are toothpicks! Part of my problem is I have horrible knees. Specifically my right, which is bone on bone, and will have to be replaced at some point. I added Deca about 4 months ago, and although my shoulders and elbows feel great, I still have lots of daily knee pain. I can't squat at all(it's painful to get out of the hole with 135) but I want my legs to grow with my upperbody. I beginning to look very disproportionate. My wife told me if my upperbody got any bigger I was gonna tip over. What are some exercises for leg growth for a dude with awful knees? Thanks fellas.


Quick little story Assassin, I was in the exact fukkin boat you are in now about five years ago. I had strong legs, good muscle..the whole story. I started noticing knee pain quite frequently, not just after workouts but at work (walk A lot) and it was starting to irritate the fuk out of me, I thought I can't be breaking down, not yet. I lived with the almost constant pain up until a year ago last August when my wife finally convinced me to see a doc...well bone on bone on the lateral side (no fuking cartilage) both knees! Had a bi-lateral knee replacement operation (both knees, don't recommend it) after the op. I saw sparrows with bigger legs! Anyway my legs are back to pre-op status...seated leg press, smith mach. saved me with squats, deads (cheat type), that make sense?, hammie curls (standing worked best for me), now leg extensions were the kicker, had to have someone just smoothly go through the full motion for some time until I was able to do them on my own, had something to do with legs hanging in the air I guess, not sure why. I never will get on another stationary bike again, helped a bunch though. All the lifts I could only useg partial flexation of the joint. I guess what I'm try to say bro is take extreme care of the original equipment you got, hate to say it but heavy leg day may be gone or it might be something simple like meniscus issues, if that is the case back to fukin heavy days!haha Did A Doc say it was bone on bone?


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## stonetag (Dec 16, 2013)

I don't know if that helps? it was the full motion of the lift that killed me, before and after surgery...I know, crazy old bastard.


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## widehips71 (Dec 20, 2013)

Front squats put less force on the knees

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19002072


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## PillarofBalance (Dec 20, 2013)

Stone first good story. But what are cheat deads? You mean rack pulls.


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