# Box Squats for Hypertrophy?



## NbleSavage (Oct 21, 2013)

Box squats (not just 'squatting to a box as an indicator of where parallel is', I'm talking about sitting back on a box usually at around 14" with a 1 sec pause and a corresponding wide stance with toes pointed outwards) are an effective tool IME for developing hip strength which carries-over into traditional squats and deads. Great posterior chain developer. 

But what about for bodybuilding? I've not seen this technique used commonly as a tool for developing, say, hamstrings and glutes (which it most certainly does, albeit perhaps not as much from a hypertrophic perspective when training in the 1-3 rep range). 

Anyone use box squats for bodybuilding / hypertrophy? 

Here's a good example of the technique I'm describing for those who have never done one before.

http://stronglifts.com/build-explosive-strength-how-to-perform-box-squats/

Peace.

- Savage


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## PillarofBalance (Oct 21, 2013)

I have 29" thighs and I squat in the 1 to 5 rep range in training.


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## Tren4Life (Oct 21, 2013)

I just went down to the 13 i.nch box this morning, also had to go down in weight. I can feel it in my hips already, it will be a slow up hill climb back to 405.


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## NbleSavage (Oct 21, 2013)

PillarofBalance said:


> I have 29" thighs and I squat in the 1 to 5 rep range in training.



Speak to your leg program a bit if you would. I prefer to train in the lower rep ranges as well.


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## NbleSavage (Oct 21, 2013)

Steelers4Life said:


> I just went down to the 13 i.nch box this morning, also had to go down in weight. I can feel it in my hips already, it will be a slow up hill climb back to 405.



IME when box squatting, control is everything. Seen too many Bros "plopping" back on to the box, wrecking their spines up in the process. Wise move IMO to cut the weight with the reduction in box height. You'll be back to 4 wheels in no time


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## DocDePanda187123 (Oct 21, 2013)

27in quads here, although some of it is fat hahaha, but I almost  never go above 8reps for a big compound movement like squats. The effectiveness of the lift is not lost upon your end goal of BB vs powerlifting.


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## PillarofBalance (Oct 21, 2013)

NbleSavage said:


> Speak to your leg program a bit if you would. I prefer to train in the lower rep ranges as well.




6 week waves

Week 1
60% 10 sets / 2 reps
Bands and/or Chains if desired

Week 2
70% 3 sets / 5 reps - if bar speed is still high at 3 sets, up number of sets to no more than 6

Week 3
80%  5 sets / 3 reps 

Week 4
65% 10 sets / 2 reps

Week 5 
75% 3 sets / 5 reps

Week 6
85% 5 sets / 3 reps

Week 7
Max Effort and recalculate percentages. Return to week 1.


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## NbleSavage (Oct 21, 2013)

PillarofBalance said:


> 6 week waves
> 
> Week 1
> 60% 10 sets / 2 reps
> ...



Smart looking program. May have to give this a shot. Cheers!


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## PillarofBalance (Oct 21, 2013)

Another point noble is that when a box squat is executed properly you get mostly ham and glute development.  If I showed you my legs you'd notice they don't look quite like a bodybuiders. Much of mass is up around the hips and upper quads, but the development is most notable from the side view. My ham strings have a very distinct sweep to them. A box squat is essentially a leg curl because when you sit on the box, the angle of the shin should be back.  In other words the knee should be just above the heel or behind it if possible. 

Here is an image from a speed day of mine. This was a 405 reverse band to a 15 inch box.  You can also see pretty clearly that my thighs are mostly hip and hamstring.  I can see if I can find a quad shot too just to give you an idea.







Bottom line is, squats, deads, bench and overhead press should be done with near maximal weights (60 to 80% range) in order to force the body to adapt. A 15 reps set of deadlifts isn't going to do much if anything at all.  If you're using every muscle in the body to move the weight, it has to be overwhelming.


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## NbleSavage (Oct 21, 2013)

Great tips, POB! (nice ass, too)


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## italian1 (Oct 22, 2013)

I love when POB lays out some raw knowledge.  Especially on shit like this.  Dude know his stuff


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## Hero Swole (Oct 22, 2013)

PillarofBalance said:


> Another point noble is that when a box squat is executed properly you get mostly ham and glute development.  If I showed you my legs you'd notice they don't look quite like a bodybuiders. Much of mass is up around the hips and upper quads, but the development is most notable from the side view. My ham strings have a very distinct sweep to them. A box squat is essentially a leg curl because when you sit on the box, the angle of the shin should be back.  In other words the knee should be just above the heel or behind it if possible.
> 
> Here is an image from a speed day of mine. This was a 405 reverse band to a 15 inch box.  You can also see pretty clearly that my thighs are mostly hip and hamstring.  I can see if I can find a quad shot too just to give you an idea.
> 
> ...



I like those chubby calfs


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## f.r.a.n.k. (Oct 22, 2013)

POB, How much does your percentages/volume change with the other core lifts compared to your squat routine?
Is it basically the same set up for your bench, deads, and OHP?


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## NbleSavage (Oct 22, 2013)

I'm going to start working these in on my hamstring dominant leg days, me thinks. Had to run downstairs to the cage and bust out a few after PoB's advice and damn if they didn't feel good.


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## PillarofBalance (Oct 22, 2013)

frank.tb said:


> POB, How much does your percentages/volume change with the other core lifts compared to your squat routine?
> Is it basically the same set up for your bench, deads, and OHP?



I don't OHP much honestly. I tore my lower left trap a couple years ago doing it and never really got back to it.

My program for bench squat and deads looks pretty much the same. Only part you aren't seeing is how I accessorize.


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## Tren4Life (Oct 22, 2013)

frank.tb said:


> POB, How much does your percentages/volume change with the other core lifts compared to your squat routine?
> Is it basically the same set up for your bench, deads, and OHP?



I know you were not asking me the question, but I know POB doesn't do much OHP. 
Maybe I can help. Honestly when I do my OHP, I don't use the same %'s I never go above weight that I can do for 6 reps. I feel that the muscles are smaller in your shoulder and they get tired faster. If you are serious about doing OHP, I might also suggest spread the floor with your feet and always wear your belt.
Just my .02 
S4L


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## f.r.a.n.k. (Oct 22, 2013)

Steelers4Life said:


> I know you were not asking me the question, but I know POB doesn't do much OHP.
> Maybe I can help. Honestly when I do my OHP, I don't use the same %'s I never go above weight that I can do for 6 reps. I feel that the muscles are smaller in your shoulder and they get tired faster. If you are serious about doing OHP, I might also suggest spread the floor with your feet and always wear your belt.
> Just my .02
> S4L



Lol thanks for the reply.
I'm running a 5/3/1 program right now and my Friday core lift is standing OHP.
I have to alternate back an forth with DB and BB OHP because I have shitty shoulder joints/tendons (may deca help me!)

And I agree with you on higher rep range with shoulders. Guy at my gym swears by the same concept. He now reps 315 for like 15 to 20 or some shit.
Thanks again


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## f.r.a.n.k. (Oct 22, 2013)

PillarofBalance said:


> I don't OHP much honestly. I tore my lower left trap a couple years ago doing it and never really got back to it.
> 
> My program for bench squat and deads looks pretty much the same. Only part you aren't seeing is how I accessorize.



Ahhh that blows! Lol
And k sounds good...I've never incorporated bands into my squats...gonna have to try that out!
Thanks for the reply


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## Seeker (Oct 22, 2013)

Box squats though great for powerlifters who want to move massive weights and strengthen those hips and glutes it's not so great for the bodybuilder who is purely interested in aesthetics and looking to develop that classic "V" shape.


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## PillarofBalance (Oct 22, 2013)

Seeker said:


> Box squats though great for powerlifters who want to move massive weights and strengthen those hips and glutes it's not so great for the bodybuilder who is purely interested in aesthetics and looking to develop that classic "V" shape.



But you said I had sexy legs?

Box squats will help you squat properly and add mass but the accessories are important too. Front squats lunges more lunges and more front squats all super setted with front squats and lunges


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## Seeker (Oct 22, 2013)

I love your legs, and your ass.  I will box squat occasionally though just because it does help like you said above.


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## DocDePanda187123 (Oct 22, 2013)

PillarofBalance said:


> But you said I had sexy legs?
> 
> Box squats will help you squat properly and add mass but the accessories are important too. Front squats lunges more lunges and more front squats all super setted with front squats and lunges



For myself, I found that when I started incorporating power cleans into my training that it helped squats a good deal. I was stuck on a plateau for a while and without deloads/resets or changes to my diet I got past the plateau. The power movements helped me explode better and use more power for hip drive out the hole.


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## f.r.a.n.k. (Oct 22, 2013)

Docd187123 said:


> For myself, I found that when I started incorporating power cleans into my training that it helped squats a good deal. I was stuck on a plateau for a while and without deloads/resets or changes to my diet I got past the plateau. The power movements helped me explode better and use more power for hip drive out the hole.



I figured you would chime in eventually


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## NbleSavage (Oct 23, 2013)

PillarofBalance said:


> But you said I had sexy legs?
> 
> Box squats will help you squat properly and add mass but the accessories are important too. Front squats lunges more lunges and more front squats all super setted with front squats and lunges



What about some lunges? Or front squats? Or front squats while lunging? 

_*writes article for 'Testosterone Nation' about secret new exercise: the 'Flungersquat'*_


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## NbleSavage (Oct 25, 2013)

So a Mate's giving me something called a "Stingray" which he swears is the best / easiest way to nail the front squat "shelf" position. they look like rubber shoulder pads...anyone use these things to any significant end?


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## PillarofBalance (Oct 25, 2013)

NbleSavage said:


> So a Mate's giving me something called a "Stingray" which he swears is the best / easiest way to nail the front squat "shelf" position. they look like rubber shoulder pads...anyone use these things to any significant end?



Manta ray. If you use that it means your are a pussy. Seriously. That's as bad as using a pad on the bar when you squat or wearing bitch mittens. 

Learn how to support the bar properly.


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## DocDePanda187123 (Oct 25, 2013)

PillarofBalance said:


> Manta ray. If you use that it means your are a pussy. Seriously. That's as bad as using a pad on the bar when you squat or wearing bitch mittens.
> 
> Learn how to support the bar properly.



^^^this. Manta Ray is like putting a butt plug on top of the box when doing box squats...just don't do it. Supporting the bar on the spine of the scapula will thicken your muscles and bones in that area and you won't feel it after a while.


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## NbleSavage (Oct 25, 2013)

Docd187123 said:


> ^^^this. Manta Ray is like putting a butt plug on top of the box when doing box squats...just don't do it. Supporting the bar on the spine of the scapula will thicken your muscles and bones in that area and you won't feel it after a while.



LOL!! This is excellent. I think he meant well, but I'll let him know to save the trip, that I won't need the ray thing. Thanks all.


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## DocDePanda187123 (Oct 25, 2013)

NbleSavage said:


> LOL!! This is excellent. I think he meant well, but I'll let him know to save the trip, that I won't need the ray thing. Thanks all.



This is a great idea lol. If you really want to hit your quads hard full range squats and add in a day of front squats. Don't do the cross armed method for front squats though. Learn to hold the bar in the rack position of the power clean. Drop the weight a lot and try them out. Keep back close to vertical and go to parallel or slightly lower. Come back and tell us how fried your quads are after a heavy session


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## f.r.a.n.k. (Oct 25, 2013)

Damn doc is on a roll with this shit lol
Butttt I can see why, thanks to his critique on my squat form, NEW PR BITCHES!


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## PillarofBalance (Oct 25, 2013)

Docd187123 said:


> This is a great idea lol. If you really want to hit your quads hard full range squats and add in a day of front squats. Don't do the cross armed method for front squats though. Learn to hold the bar in the rack position of the power clean. Drop the weight a lot and try them out. Keep back close to vertical and go to parallel or slightly lower. Come back and tell us how fried your quads are after a heavy session



My Damn wrists don't let me hold in a clean grip 

I have to use straps.


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## DocDePanda187123 (Oct 25, 2013)

PillarofBalance said:


> My Damn wrists don't let me hold in a clean grip
> 
> I have to use straps.



That'd be my choice over the cross armed method or California method. Whatever they call it lol. My wrist and tricep and shoulder flexibility hinders me but once I'm warmed up and stretched by holding that rack position with a few plates on I'm good to go. Working on bringing up my elbows though as to get the right rack position I have to drop my elbows


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## grizzldsealpoacher (Oct 25, 2013)

Great thread Got some great tips thanks


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## NbleSavage (Oct 26, 2013)

A nice vid from Dan Green addressing some common front squat mistakes. TIL, sitting back in the front-squat is bad juju.


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## PillarofBalance (Oct 26, 2013)

Docd187123 said:


> That'd be my choice over the cross armed method or California method. Whatever they call it lol. My wrist and tricep and shoulder flexibility hinders me but once I'm warmed up and stretched by holding that rack position with a few plates on I'm good to go. Working on bringing up my elbows though as to get the right rack position I have to drop my elbows



Work on loosening your back prior to front squatting. You need the spinal erectors relaxed to arch the back. That might be what is stopping you from getting the elbows up enough.  The other common problem is tight lats and teres minor and major.  Loosen them up and you won't find yourself so restricted.


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## DocDePanda187123 (Oct 26, 2013)

PillarofBalance said:


> Work on loosening your back prior to front squatting. You need the spinal erectors relaxed to arch the back. That might be what is stopping you from getting the elbows up enough.  The other common problem is tight lats and teres minor and major.  Loosen them up and you won't find yourself so restricted.



I've been foam rolling lately and have this weird contraption my brother gave me that's supposed to simulate a fist or elbow. I believe it's used in trigger point therapy which has helped me substantially so far. I wasnt aware that lats could affect it but knew about the teres minor and major. I have a few spots I know for TPT (trigger point therapy) that hit those and also have added doorway stretches for the pecs, tricep stretches, and shoulder dislocations. I notice I have worse flexibility in my left side than right and a massage therapist has indicated this same issue to me during a free session at my gym which is likely due to an old football injury. All in all, I'm slowly getting there and appreciate the tips you've given me.


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## NbleSavage (Oct 26, 2013)

PillarofBalance said:


> Work on loosening your back prior to front squatting. You need the spinal erectors relaxed to arch the back. That might be what is stopping you from getting the elbows up enough.  The other common problem is tight lats and teres minor and major.  Loosen them up and you won't find yourself so restricted.



^^ THIS ^^ helped me out tremendously today. Did a light back workout ahead of front squats and felt great. Only hit 225 x 5 and I used the cross-grip (felt slightly more secure than the clean grip) but damn if my quads weren't smoked.


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