# how much protein



## ken Sass (May 19, 2013)

everything i have read, macro calculators and diet experts say for building muscle 1.5 to 2 grams of protein per lean body pound. but some of the guys on here say 100-150 grams total protein in a day. my kidney functions are not the best, too many years working in jet fuel and chemicals, so this is a important question to me. thanks


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## Azog (May 19, 2013)

Meh, I eat like 430 grams a day. I do fart a lot tho...like A LOT haha. Is that bad? It is working for me at the moment. I am pretty damn lean and am gaining size like crazy.


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## PillarofBalance (May 19, 2013)

1.5 to 2 grams is excessive and will result in a lot of waste. 1 is enough especially at TRT doses.


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## PFM (May 19, 2013)

I am taking in 1 gram for every kilo (2.2lbs) of body weight, holding a lean 235lbs on 100 grams protein/day.

Protein will wreck your kidneys, they do not regenerate like the liver. 

The BB industry makes millions a year selling "dead protein" void of enzymes and all the Pro BB are endorsing these man made powders for a buck. 

I myself call complete BS to anything over 1 gram being "required" and over that 1 gram is nothing but taxing your kidneys. Remember beating up your kidneys is forever, you cannot "undo it".  And that 1 gram/lbs of body weight should be cycled as much time ON as time off.


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## SuperBane (May 19, 2013)

I honestly do not know what to say about this.
What PFM says about kidneys have crossed my mind more than once.
Would h20 intake off set and flush is another question?

Me personally Carbs fatten me up quick.
If fats are only at .5 x BW where do the other Cals come from then? Protein.
I should Carb cycle ON/OFF days I suppose.

What say you PFM, If the carbs were not from industry supplement protein powders?
Whole foods. Chicken & Beef 
230lbs I aim for 295grams a day. (off days)
320-340 depending on what I eat on during the workout days. 

Good topic.


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## ken Sass (May 19, 2013)

what i have read about rehabing kidneys is as long as the blood flow is not damaged they will heal but slowly, water, asparagus, cranberry juice/caps, and their are supplements sold by body building .com. i have had a problem with kidney stones and had the high frequency shattering of the stones so they would pass. i think the stone shattering damaged the blood flow, i was bruised all over my back and pissed blood for a week.


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## PillarofBalance (May 19, 2013)

ken said:


> what i have read about rehabing kidneys is as long as the blood flow is not damaged they will heal but slowly, water, asparagus, cranberry juice/caps, and their are* supplements sold by body building .com.* i have had a problem with kidney stones and had the high frequency shattering of the stones so they would pass. i think the stone shattering damaged the blood flow, i was bruised all over my back and pissed blood for a week.



Oh wow look at that. The same people that are selling the crap out of protein supps also sell kidney health products THAT YOU WOULDN'T NEED IF YOU JUST ATE SOME GOD DAMN FOOOOOOOOD.


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## ken Sass (May 19, 2013)

PillarofBalance said:


> Oh wow look at that. The same people that are selling the crap out of protein supps also sell kidney health products THAT YOU WOULDN'T NEED IF YOU JUST ATE SOME GOD DAMN FOOOOOOOOD.


i eat good, chicken and rice,,all the time


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## PillarofBalance (May 19, 2013)

ken said:


> i eat good, chicken and rice,,all the time



Wasn't talking to you Ken. Meant the kiddies that want to get huge on nitro-tech.

I don't think you need to worry about getting in too much protein if you're eating whole food sources of it.  Avoid the powders, they'll just up your cals and leave you hungry.  How things going btw? We getting updated pics soon?  We're all still riding your ass to keep you going in case you forgot


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## ken Sass (May 19, 2013)

PillarofBalance said:


> Wasn't talking to you Ken. Meant the kiddies that want to get huge on nitro-tech.
> 
> I don't think you need to worry about getting in too much protein if you're eating whole food sources of it.  Avoid the powders, they'll just up your cals and leave you hungry.  How things going btw? We getting updated pics soon?  We're all still riding your ass to keep you going in case you forgot


i don't do protein powder and am cutting my red meat way back, i will get some pics up soon


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## Cashout (May 19, 2013)

PillarofBalance said:


> 1.5 to 2 grams is excessive and will result in a lot of waste. 1 is enough especially at TRT doses.



This.

I've never seen a benefit of more than 1.2 grams per pound of lean body weight. 

Easy trial and error will tell you how your body responds. Start at 1 g per pound and adjust up or down from there to see how you respond. Give each incremental change at least 60 days to reach an equilibrium in your body.


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## PFM (May 19, 2013)

SuperBane said:


> I honestly do not know what to say about this.
> What PFM says about kidneys have crossed my mind more than once.
> Would h20 intake off set and flush is another question?
> 
> ...



The kidneys do allot of work for how small they are (about the size of a deck of cards). Gear makes blood, blood makes RBC's, single RBC is a living creature of sorts, when they die the "skeleton" get caught up in the blood filters (your kidneys) and reduces GFR. Combine high (ridiculous) amounts of protein that must be filtered through the kidneys and it become double trouble.

Keeping the blood thin with water reduces the pressure(s) but the by products (RBC's and amino acids are going through. So water helps but unless you have a damn good set of kidneys (genetically) all the water in the world isn't going to stop those two kidneys killers from passing through.

If you're not making good money abusing your body with all that protein I suggest the ON/OFF and 1 gram max.

It's true the body cannot create the essential 8 aminos from carbs, but it can produce glycogen from protein (for a price).


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## PFM (May 19, 2013)

Cashout said:


> This.
> 
> I've never seen a benefit of more than 1.2 grams per pound of lean body weight.
> 
> Easy trial and error will tell you how your body responds. Start at 1 g per pound and adjust up or down from there to see how you respond. Give each incremental change at least 60 days to reach an equilibrium in your body.



That 1.2 would be for healthy guy in his prime and again I stress cycle your upper 1-1.2 MAX with periods of 1g/2.2lbs.

Older guys like Ken and myself even 1 gram/ lbs of weight or desired weight is just stressing the kidneys for what? Even if your going to win 130K at the 2013 Mr. O is that worth dialysis?


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## ken Sass (May 19, 2013)

PFM said:


> That 1.2 would be for healthy guy in his prime and again I stress cycle your upper 1-1.2 MAX with periods of 1g/2.2lbs.
> 
> Older guys like Ken and myself even 1 gram/ lbs of weight or desired weight is just stressing the kidneys for what? Even if your going to win 130K at the 2013 Mr. O is that worth dialysis?


no it's not pfm, i am cutting my protein back, i think i can still make good gains


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## PFM (May 19, 2013)

ken said:


> no it's not pfm, i am cutting my protein back, i think i can still make good gains



Good thing you eat whole foods. My TRT Counselor (who promotes supplements) encourages no protein supplements of any kind not even BCAA's.


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## warlord (May 20, 2013)

Cashout said:


> This.
> 
> I've never seen a benefit of more than 1.2 grams per pound of lean body weight.
> 
> Easy trial and error will tell you how your body responds. Start at 1 g per pound and adjust up or down from there to see how you respond. Give each incremental change at least 60 days to reach an equilibrium in your body.



Exactly what i have been reading.  I have not read any actual scientific proof/research that says that eating more then 1.2 gram per pound of body weight in protein does anything. Most of the current article on protein synthesis all say that 1 gram of protein per pound of body weight is more then enough for bulking and cutting.  I've seen some research that says .8 grams per pound is enough.


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