# Test E+Dbol Cycle



## tony72722 (Feb 19, 2016)

Layout
-Week 1-4 DBOL 50mg ED
-Week 1-12 TEST E 500mg /a week
-NAC Liver support 1000mg ED

On hand
-Adex
-Letro
-Nolva
-Clomid

Current Stats
-6"0 194 lbs
-16% Bodyfat
-29in Waist
-Very bloated in these pics.. the end of the day.







Diet
*Meal 1:* 
-Egg White Formula.. 50grams of protein
-1 Cup of oats

*Meal 2*
-10Oz Grounded Turkey Breast
-2 Cups of Brown Rice

*Meal 3(Post Workout Shake)*
-2 Scoops of Whey
-Dextrose

*Meal 4*
-2 Slices Whole Grain Bread w/ butter
-6oz Red Meat

*Meal 5*
-Steamed Veggies
-8oz Chicken Breast

***Might throw in some chipotle here and there*

Training
-So I don't like set schedules because I go off of how many body feels. I'm going to be hitting legs and chest twice a week. The rest of my body is developed fine. Those are my weak points. Also going to be training calves every other day. I'm not going to do cardio for the first four weeks. If my bodyfat gets too high I will surely incorporate it into my program. I do plan to start doing cardio the last 4 weeks of my cycle. I plan to train for two hours a day. Most likely three for chest and legs. I'll be switching between heavy days and light days.. Light days for really milking out that pump and heavy days to utilize that dbol and get some strength gains. Going to be rotating exercising every week just to really shock my body and give it something new for optimal growth.

The Goal..My vision
My focus this cycle isn't so much aesthetics as it is for regaining the mass I've lost this year. The goal is to grow as much lean muscle tissue as much as I can while controlling bodyfat. I plan to cruise on a TRT dose for a while after this blast. Then going to start shredding for summer and run Tren Ace with Test Prop. I want to compete in 2017 NPC. My goal is to reach 215 lbs. Here is a picture of what I looked like natty at 9%.. I was 181lbs here. If I could get to this bodyfat again but maybe at a 190ish I think I'd look amazing.





***Going to get measurements tomorrow***

***Open to any suggestions** *


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## bvs (Feb 19, 2016)

Take adex from the start as dbol aromatizes a lot. Also no hcg?


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## tony72722 (Feb 19, 2016)

bvs said:


> Take adex from the start as dbol aromatizes a lot. Also no hcg?


No HCG although I have a source to get it. Like I said I plan to blast and cruise so I wouldn't think HCG would be necessary for this blast. If my nuts shrink that much I might consider taking it. I know there are a lot of other benefits to HCG but I just didn't see it as a necessity for this blast. Feel free to correct me if I am wrong.

I've read a lot of different views on adex and I think it would be best to start running the adex only if I start feelings symptoms of itchy nips or an overwhelming amount of bloat. My friend that is training me.. has his pro card and great experience is telling me this. Pretty much saying only take it if those symptoms occur. Should I start taking .5mg EOD to use more as a preventative manner rather than waiting for symptoms to appear?


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## ECKSRATED (Feb 19, 2016)

Just because you don't have the symptoms of high estrogen doesn't mean u don't have high e. U can start it on day one or get bloods done about 5 weeks in and take it from there. With dbol I would suggest running it from day one at .5 e3d. But that's my opinion. 

And please don't say "shock the body" drives me nuts when people say that shit. As long as your progressively lifting heavier weights or doing more reps your body will not "get used to" something and stop growing. Drives me up a wall when people say that shit. U know who Eric lilliebridge is?  Well he does the same 3 lifts every week and is a ****ing mass monster. I don't think he substitutes deadlifts with reverse underhand cable curl extensions to shock his body to grow. Know what I'm sayin?


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## tony72722 (Feb 19, 2016)

ECKSRATED said:


> Just because you don't have the symptoms of high estrogen doesn't mean u don't have high e. U can start it on day one or get bloods done about 5 weeks in and take it from there. With dbol I would suggest running it from day one at .5 e3d. But that's my opinion.
> 
> And please don't say "shock the body" drives me nuts when people say that shit. As long as your progressively lifting heavier weights or doing more reps your body will not "get used to" something and stop growing. Drives me up a wall when people say that shit. U know who Eric lilliebridge is?  Well he does the same 3 lifts every week and is a ****ing mass monster. I don't think he substitutes deadlifts with reverse underhand cable curl extensions to shock his body to grow. Know what I'm sayin?


 Gotcha. Thanks for your input. Yes I know who Eric Lilliebridge.


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## ECKSRATED (Feb 19, 2016)

Calves every other day, have u met our board calve builder snake? He loves training calves.


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## tony72722 (Feb 19, 2016)

ECKSRATED said:


> Calves every other day, have u met our board calve builder snake? He loves training calves.



 No lol don't think so. I have poverty calf genetics lol.


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## bvs (Feb 19, 2016)

Sorry i must have misread, hcg is not very necessary on blast and cruise. But id definitely go with 0.5mg of adex eod. Prevent the problem before it starts rather than going into damage contol once it happens


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## Redrum1327 (Feb 19, 2016)

EOD or e3d on the adex man especially the first 4 weeks you might be able to go lower with just the test. Again that's just me , I'm like 12% bf and don't need alot with 500 test tho , get bloods to see where your at. Don't be the guy that says " I know my body" you need bloods bro no matter what .

Blast and cruise ? How old are you ? Whsts your idea of a trt cruise ? Are you ready to stick yourself for the rest of your life BC I do and it's not fun after a while !!!!


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## tony72722 (Feb 19, 2016)

Redrum1327 said:


> EOD or e3d on the adex man especially the first 4 weeks you might be able to go lower with just the test. Again that's just me , I'm like 12% bf and don't need alot with 500 test tho , get bloods to see where your at. Don't be the guy that says " I know my body" you need bloods bro no matter what .
> 
> Blast and cruise ? How old are you ? Whsts your idea of a trt cruise ? Are you ready to stick yourself for the rest of your life BC I do and it's not fun after a while !!!!



Yeah I'll get bloods done. I'm about to turn 23. Been thinking about AAS the whole time I was in the military. Want to compete and I know I'll be training for the rest of my life unless an injury happens that prohibits me from training. I'm going to college in LA just so I can train at Golds Venice lol just to give you an idea on how much I love this shit. I don't think a pin twice a week seems so bad. I have the clomid in case I change my mind after my cycle but I've weighed out the pros and cons in my head plenty of times. I've read 100s of articles where younger guys blast and cruise for 3-5 years and take the precautions and still recover. Maybe takes 6 months or so to recover but just to know that my body at my young age could recover is an option that is comforting. The idea of going on that cycle and pct rollercoaster doesn't seem like my most optimal approach if I want to compete. Again I have the clomid and nolva in case I decide to change my mind and run a couple of cycles before I decide to take that route. My idea of a trt dose is 250mg EW.

My mindset in everything has been if I'm going to something I'm going to go all out if that makes sense. Was getting into Law Enforcement and I chose LA County Sheriff's. Went into the military and I chose the Marines. Was a high school wrestler I dedicated my whole life to wrestling and went varsity my sophomore year and wrestled CIF all four years. Going to college and I chose engineering. None the less I've failed a shit load of times but this is just a pattern. Not trying to give you subtle brag list but that has always been my mindset.


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## ToolSteel (Feb 19, 2016)

One thing caught my eye: training instinctively or "by feel"

Do not do this. I used to. And yeah it works to a point. But NO ONE will progress as fast as they potentially could going by how they feel. Getting a coach and being forced to stick to a program was the best thing I ever did. 
It gets to a point where lifting heavy sucks! But you do it because that's what the program calls for and that's what's going to make the progress. 
If you don't need an occasional deload week, you're not training hard enough. Plain and simple.


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## PillarofBalance (Feb 19, 2016)

ToolSteel said:


> One thing caught my eye: training instinctively or "by feel"
> 
> Do not do this. I used to. And yeah it works to a point. But NO ONE will progress as fast as they potentially could going by how they feel. Getting a coach and being forced to stick to a program was the best thing I ever did.
> It gets to a point where lifting heavy sucks! But you do it because that's what the program calls for and that's what's going to make the progress.
> If you don't need an occasional deload week, you're not training hard enough. Plain and simple.



RPE and autoregulation are fancy for training by feel isn't it?


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## PillarofBalance (Feb 19, 2016)

Tony if you want to compete in NPC you need to focus on putting on serious weight for a long time.  Running this bulk then a cut later on is only going to slow it down for a while.  I would just keep bulking until you are like 20 weeks out.

And don't use some pussy flex magazine workout.  Go heavy on your compound lifts and really beat the shit out of yourself. 

As for the cycle yes get bloodwork.  Definitely run the Adex after the first few days.  Aromasin would be better imo. Remember adex doesn't stop the conversion aromasin does.  Dbol converts - a lot in some.  

Also get rid of any notion that you will recover if you blast and cruise.  Very low chance of that happening.  You do this I can almost promise you will be on for life.


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## ToolSteel (Feb 19, 2016)

PillarofBalance said:


> RPE and autoregulation are fancy for training by feel isn't it?



Yes, BUT.... When you're self training it's easy to say ugh this feels heavy. Must be @9 already. 

But when I know that I have to email you my workout, you will know if I was actually @9. And if I wasn't, I'll get bitched at. 

Makes a big difference.


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## John Ziegler (Feb 19, 2016)

Just thought I would revamp this post by Seeker for something to think about before you kick start the cycle with the Dbol.

My Oral AAS Experience
Test, Deca, Dbol is probably the most popular cycle in the AAS community. I myself have run it a number of times. I've also ran it like most by Kickstarting the dbol for the 1st few weeks until the oils kick in. Well, let me tell you I don't agree with this method anymore.

My last cycle was in fact dbol, test cyp, and NPP. It was a 16 week run. Probably the best cycle I've had in a long time. 

This time I did not kickstart the oral. I waited. I waited until I started to feel the oils peaking. Right around week 9 the oils really started to take full effect working together. 
That's when I added the dbol. By week 10 I had all 3 compounds working in a perfect sy,nergistic harmony. I was getting harder, stronger, wider, bigger by the day. My training, my diet, my recovery was going fantastic. Bloat was no factor either. I was vascular as fuk!

The point of running multiple compounds is so that they compliment each other and create a synergistic effect so that you get the best possible results.

My timing was perfect in doing this by adding the oral at the right time. 

Why kick start? By the time your oils start to kick in your oral is leaving your system. That makes no sense. It's not supposed to work that way.

I ran the oral for 6 weeks at 30 mgs per day.
Test at 500, NPP at 400.

I've been off this run for 4 months now
Just running 200 mgs test a week now and I added creatine. I've lost little size and little strengh if any. Not as rock hard as before but im definitely content.


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## tony72722 (Feb 19, 2016)

Zeigler Robertson said:


> Just thought I would revamp this post by Seeker for something to think about before you kick start the cycle with the Dbol.
> 
> My Oral AAS Experience
> Test, Deca, Dbol is probably the most popular cycle in the AAS community. I myself have run it a number of times. I've also ran it like most by Kickstarting the dbol for the 1st few weeks until the oils kick in. Well, let me tell you I don't agree with this method anymore.
> ...



This is actually a great idea and this was my first thought planning out this cycle. A couple of other guys knocked me on it and advised me to just use it as a kick start. I've already taken two dbol orals 50mg. Yesterday and today. Should I follow through or discontinue and wait till the testosterone enanthate is fully stabilized in my blood?


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## tony72722 (Feb 19, 2016)

PillarofBalance said:


> *Tony if you want to compete in NPC you need to focus on putting on serious weight for a long time.  Running this bulk then a cut later on is only going to slow it down for a while.  I would just keep bulking until you are like 20 weeks out.*
> 
> And don't use some pussy flex magazine workout.  Go heavy on your compound lifts and really beat the shit out of yourself.
> 
> ...



So I've gotten some opinions on this and this was also what I was initially thinking. The problem is that I can't see much if any muscle definition right now. It makes it problematic to really pinpoint weaker areas. When it comes down to compete I know I'll be nitpicking all the trivial details and minutiae like the striations on my lower back or a lacking separation on a single quadricep. 

I feel like if I just cut last minute I'm not going to be able to polish my physique. This cycle is yes to gain back the mass that I've lost. If I could go to 215 and cut down to 190-195ish for stage I'd be happy. Obviously come the next year I'll be pushing for 200-210lbs competition ready. I'm personally more inclined to the golden era physiques with the small waist instead of those IFBB competitors with huge GH bellys. I guess what I'm saying is what I want is to strive for perfection and quality rather than mass right away for this first competition.

I really want to fine tune and polish my physique and make it immaculate come stage time. Frank zane is my idea physique. His physique was absolutely beautiful and the epitome of aesthetics in my opinion.(No homo) I know my genetics certainly don't match his but I'm just trying to give you an idea of the physique I'm going for. I also do have a 29 inch waist even at my current bodyfat. I was a 27inch when I was at 9%.  When Frank was competing in the 1960s at 200lbs he looked amazing.

I think I'm getting sidetracked into the debate of todays classic vs open bodybuilding which is entirely a different discussion. But again I'm new to AAS and I'm new to competing. Feel to correct me if I'm wrong for I'm noobie.


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## ECKSRATED (Feb 20, 2016)

I'd wait to run the dbol man. Be patient let the test build up and then start teaching dbol at like week 5 or 6. You'll be strong and be as fukk of u do. You'll be happy u waited.


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## ToolSteel (Feb 20, 2016)

tony72722 said:


> This is actually a great idea and this was my first thought planning out this cycle. A couple of other guys knocked me on it and advised me to just use it as a kick start. I've already taken two dbol orals 50mg. Yesterday and today. Should I follow through or discontinue and wait till the testosterone enanthate is fully stabilized in my blood?


I would wait. Orals at the peak of a cycle are amazing.


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## ToolSteel (Feb 20, 2016)

tony72722 said:


> So I've gotten some opinions on this and this was also what I was initially thinking. The problem is that I can't see much if any muscle definition right now. It makes it problematic to really pinpoint weaker areas. When it comes down to compete I know I'll be nitpicking all the trivial details and minutiae like the striations on my lower back or a lacking separation on a single quadricep.
> 
> I feel like if I just cut last minute I'm not going to be able to polish my physique. This cycle is yes to gain back the mass that I've lost. If I could go to 215 and cut down to 190-195ish for stage I'd be happy. Obviously come the next year I'll be pushing for 200-210lbs competition ready. I'm personally more inclined to the golden era physiques with the small waist instead of those IFBB competitors with huge GH bellys. I guess what I'm saying is what I want is to strive for perfection and quality rather than mass right away for this first competition.
> 
> ...


Not long ago I competed in my first pl meet. And I feel like of the advice I got from the vets here applies: they all told me just get a total. Just get in, hit the lifts, get your name in the books. I can work on increasing my total later. But now I am officially a powerlifter. 

So IMO: just get on stage. Bulk as hard as you can without getting more fat on you than you can cut by show time. So what if you don't have your physique perfectly polished? You said you want to make a lifestyle of this, you've got the rest of your competitive career to work on the details. Get on the stage. Get your name in the books. Become an official competitor.


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## tony72722 (Feb 20, 2016)

UPDATE.. So my source mailed me aromasin instead of adex. I think i'm going to use that instead of adex for now on. Recommendations on dosages?


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## ECKSRATED (Feb 20, 2016)

That's a good mistake. Stane is better in my opinion. Start at 12.5mg e3d or twice a week and go from there.


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## tony72722 (Feb 20, 2016)

ECKSRATED said:


> That's a good mistake. Stane is better in my opinion. Start at 12.5mg e3d or twice a week and go from there.



Right on. Half life is pretty short with these I shouldn't be dosing everyday?


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## bvs (Feb 20, 2016)

i also prefer aromasin. dosing is a very personal thing but i like to go with 12.5mg eod


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## tony72722 (Feb 20, 2016)

bvs said:


> i also prefer aromasin. dosing is a very personal thing but i like to go with 12.5mg eod


 After reading more on it definitely seems like the better choice versus adex. 12.5mg seems like the way to go. These droppers make me feel like I'm not getting an accurate dosage.


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## Maijah (Feb 20, 2016)

tony72722 said:


> After reading more on it definitely seems like the better choice versus adex. 12.5mg seems like the way to go. These droppers make me feel like I'm not getting an accurate dosage.



Don't sweat the exact line on the dropper. I'm assuming your stane is 25 mgs per ml, just use about half the dropper EOD.


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## tony72722 (Feb 20, 2016)

Maijah said:


> Don't sweat the exact line on the dropper. I'm assuming your stane is 25 mgs per ml, just use about half the dropper EOD.


 No it is actually 10mg/ml


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## PillarofBalance (Feb 20, 2016)

tony72722 said:


> No it is actually 10mg/ml



If a syringe fits in the bottle use a syringe to measure out the correct dose. I never use those stupid droppers.


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## ToolSteel (Feb 20, 2016)

There's 20 drops per ml. Not that hard lol


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## tony72722 (Feb 20, 2016)

Trained today.. Isolated my quads for a good hour. Had to cut it short because I felt so light headed. I got about 7 hours of sleep. I took 10mg of adderall at 6:00AM to study and it should only stay in my system for four hours. Left to the gym 10:30 so I don't think it was the adderall. Had enough water and calories. I'm just extremely light headed and feel kind of loopy. Don't know if it's the dbol or anything else or maybe it's just a bad day. Huge pump today though and my quads are still aching right now. I usually do get light headed when I train legs but this was on a different level. Also was really gasping for air in between sets on front squat. Haven't noticed any noticeable strength gains today but shit this is the third day.


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## Maijah (Feb 20, 2016)

tony72722 said:


> No it is actually 10mg/ml



If it's dosed that low then like pillar said just use a syringe and fill it to 1.25 ml EOD


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## tony72722 (Feb 20, 2016)

Maijah said:


> If it's dosed that low then like pillar said just use a syringe and fill it to 1.25 ml EOD


 That's what I'm going to do thanks.


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## tony72722 (Feb 21, 2016)

2/21


So today I woke up and my quads are ridiculously sore. When I looked in the mirror they almost looked pump. I've noticed my gyno looks a little bit worst. My nipples are a little bit itchy so I'm going to bump the aromasin. My nipples definitely do look a bit more pointy. I developed some pretty mild gyno during puberty. I might just get the surgery done after this cycle. From what I've read it's a pretty quick recovery. 

Despite that I have been eating really well. I've noticed I'm much more hungry that I usually am. I don't know if this was a placebo but I ended up ****ing a girl yesterday and went all night.. Erection was damn powerful and I think I scared the shit out of her because of how rough I went on her but she loved it. Again not sure if placebo but I judging from last night I think it affected my aggression and sex drive. Because I decided to go almost all night I'm waking up today with a result of only 5 hours of sleep so I'm going to be making today a rest day. I'm still going to carb up and might even eat a chipotle burrito. 

Monday I'll be training hammies..calves. Want to just completely slay them for a good two hours. I'll be hitting some deads. Curious to see how long I can and if that dbol is really kicking in by then.


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## tony72722 (Feb 22, 2016)

2/22

Second injection of test today. Injection was a little bit more harsh this time. Keep injecting in my delt this time my arm feels  a little bit sore. I notice that my physique looks a little bit more full. Yesterday was a low calorie day so it could just be that. Going to hit the gym around 1p.m. Train Hamstrings Calves and some light ab work. Despite the deadlifts that I will do today I'm training today more for volume. Tomorrow will be training shoulders and that will be the real test whether the dbol has kicked in or not. Sex drive I feel like has definitely increased. Horny all the fcking time. Getting off like 6 times a day right now. I'll post progress pics in a couple weeks. Will also be weighing myself this thursday to see if I've gained anything during this first week. My next update will be thursday with the weigh in. Don't want to annoy the forum with my log.


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## tunafisherman (Feb 22, 2016)

because I think everything else has been said, and I don't like repeating, all I will add is your cycle is missing tren.  That is all.


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## tony72722 (Feb 23, 2016)

tunafisherman said:


> because I think everything else has been said, and I don't like repeating, all I will add is your cycle is missing tren.  That is all.


 I actually do have some tren ace was saving that for another blast though.


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## tony72722 (Mar 2, 2016)

3/1

I'm up 8 lbs. My strength has definitely gone up. My sense of well being is even much better. I'm overall just a happy person most of the time on this. My sex drive is getting ridiculous.. It sounds amazing to have a ridiculous high sex drive but it's getting to the point where I can't get shit done. If I don't fck that day I'm literally just stuck at home getting off like 7+ times a day. Random erections in my lecture hall.

In the gym I feel like superman.. I'm sure I look like a douche because I pose between every set. My pumps are absolutely insane.. Almost painful to the point where I feel like my muscle is about to explode. People have started complimented me saying I look bigger. I look great with a shirt on.. take it off and I still look like a puffed up water balloon. I'm really tempted to start cutting carbs after my dbol is done. I desperately miss my abs and low bodyfat. It's been a while since I've seen that.

My aggression has gone up dramatically and I'm just trying to channel it all into my training and control it.

I noticed that my calves aren't recovering that quick. It's been three days since I trained calves and they are still sore as hell. I'm just going to say fck it and train them tomorrow. Hopefully they will just be a little bit tight tomorrow and not as bad as they are right now. 

Also noticed that the days I don't take aromasin  I look like I have slight gyno. The days that I do take aromasin I look fine. So I decided to bump my aromasin to 10mg a day and it has been working for me. Everyone has told me you have to feel it out with your body as far as dosages and I think 10mg ED works for me. Feel free to critique me if that is too much.


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