# Can somebody explain AI's vs SERM's to me?



## bubbagump (Oct 7, 2012)

What is the difference? How do you know when to use which one? I kinda get what an AI is but does a SERM do the same thing?  Can you use a SERM on cycle as an AI? Help me out guys


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## coltmc4545 (Oct 7, 2012)

SERMs attach to the estrogen receptor in breast tissue and block estro from attaching to it preventing gyno but do nothing to actually lower estrogen. AI's lower estrogen. SERMs are pointless on cycle IMO. Use an AI.


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## 63Vette (Oct 7, 2012)

coltmc4545 said:


> SERMs attach to the estrogen receptor in breast tissue and block estro from attaching to it preventing gyno but do nothing to actually lower estrogen. AI's lower estrogen. SERMs are pointless on cycle IMO. Use an AI.



Simple and to the point. Well said!

Kudos,
Vette


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## gymrat827 (Oct 7, 2012)

coltmc4545 said:


> SERMs attach to the estrogen receptor in breast tissue and block estro from attaching to it preventing gyno but do nothing to actually lower estrogen. AI's lower estrogen. SERMs are pointless on cycle IMO. Use an AI.



well clomid or nolva will function similar to hcg if used while on.  not sure how true this is, never seen any bloods or proof. but have read guys using them like this.


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## bubbagump (Oct 7, 2012)

coltmc4545 said:


> SERMs attach to the estrogen receptor in breast tissue and block estro from attaching to it preventing gyno but do nothing to actually lower estrogen. AI's lower estrogen. SERMs are pointless on cycle IMO. Use an AI.



Ok. Thaks!
What about AI choice?  Everybody seems to have an opinion. Is it just trial and error till you find what you like? Or just go with Aromasin and call it good? What about Erase? I havnt seen it mentioned here much but im a member on one other board and they seem to push it.


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## bubbagump (Oct 7, 2012)

gymrat827 said:


> well clomid or nolva will function similar to hcg if used while on.  not sure how true this is, never seen any bloods or proof. but have read guys using them like this.




I have read a couple of posts here regarding that. I wonder how accurate it is myself. The only problem my wife has with me cycling is that she wants to get pregnant asap. :-?  If I could use clomid to maintain some sperm count, I could have my cake and eat it too!!


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## coltmc4545 (Oct 7, 2012)

Regarding SERMs taking place of hcg, the theory is kind of new. I haven't seen much info on it except a few guys taking clomid during cycle to keep thier nuts full. Personally, I'd go with the tried and true hcg until I see some actual evidence to the SERM therapy during cycle. And honestly if your wife wants to get pregnant ASAP, I would hold off on any cycle until you handle your business there but that's just my opinion. Even a test only cycle can reduce sperm count so why risk it?

Now to your AI choice. It's really all personal preference an what works best for you. I've tried letro, stane, and adex. Adex didn't cut it for me, letro's too strong, stane is just perfect for me so that's what I use.


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## bubbagump (Oct 7, 2012)

coltmc4545 said:


> Regarding SERMs taking place of hcg, the theory is kind of new. I haven't seen much info on it except a few guys taking clomid during cycle to keep thier nuts full. Personally, I'd go with the tried and true hcg until I see some actual evidence to the SERM therapy during cycle. And honestly if your wife wants to get pregnant ASAP, I would hold off on any cycle until you handle your business there but that's just my opinion. Even a test only cycle can reduce sperm count so why risk it?
> 
> Now to your AI choice. It's really all personal preference an what works best for you. I've tried letro, stane, and adex. Adex didn't cut it for me, letro's too strong, stane is just perfect for me so that's what I use.



Thanks for the input.  The problem is, she has some fertility issues. She is estrogen dominant for some reason and we have not had any luck conceiving in a year+. Im no doctor so I dont know exactly how all that works and what her situation is but it may take years and going to a fertility specialist to get it done. So I figure in the mean time, Ill do short cycles and try to keep some sperm count up while doing so.  I dont know if its possible but thats why Im here! I want to learn from the people that know.  
I do know one thing, I feel like crap. Its been getting worse over the past few years. I just did my first cycle and I felt like a million bucks while I was on.  I never even heard of low testosterone till a year or so ago. Got to reading about it and was like WOW! THats ME! I thought I had depression or something.  My doc put me on prozac and it actually made me worse.  I switched jobs and my insurance is a super high deductible and I dont know if it even covers TRT, so I got to looking for other ways to get test up. Tried natty stuff without much result. So Im left with looking for chemical help.


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## coltmc4545 (Oct 8, 2012)

Have you had bloodwork done to see exactly where your levels are? Don't just assume you have low T. Get some bloods. They're cheap. Use privatemdlabs.com and get the female hormone panel. Order the test, go to the nearest labcorp and draw, you'll have results in a few days in your email.


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## bubbagump (Oct 8, 2012)

I havnt done bloods yet. I will soon. Want to give it a little time to stabilize after pct


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## IronCore (Oct 8, 2012)

SERM'S = Selective Estrogen Receptor Modulators
AI = Aromotaise Inhibitor

(feel free to check the spelling)

As Said before - Serms prevent the estrogen ALREADY in your system from attaching to the estrogen receptors throughout your body... ESPECIALLY the nipple area as they have more receptors.

AI's prevent the conversion of Free Test to Estrogen... which in turn prevents it from attaching to your receptors because it reduces the chance for free Estrogen...

SERMS actually do have a place during cycle if you are gyno prone... if not dont waste your time or money... and a little Estro in the system is good to help keep things balanced...

SERMS during cycle will help block the free estrogen that is already present or created by what is missed by the AI's...

Some use one or the other... some use both...  some use none... depends on the person...

As for which to chose I recommend Adex... it has been around for a while and is proven to be usefull...

Letro works as well but is classified as a "suicide inhibitor" and actually  "kills" the receptor... how permanent this "death" is I dont know... I do know that I dont want to damage my body anymore than necessary...


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