# Student loan forgiveness....?



## Hughinn (Apr 28, 2022)

I don't understand the big push here for this.  Meaning, I don't get the logic behind it other than the democrat party purchasing votes. 

Why is this something the government would consider?  The last time I looked, nobody was forced to accept a college tuition loan and those debts were accepted.  Not coerced.   Nobody was made to take on this debt. 

Secondly, how do those who support this measure, justify making so many hardworking Americans who didn't get to attend college, pay for others education who chose to accept the debt and attend?

Am I missing something?


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## BigBaldBeardGuy (Apr 28, 2022)

I honestly have no idea. I have a kid in college right now and he has a student loan.
1) He’s going to a state university and not some popular private college
2) He’s not getting a bullshit degree in Liberal Arts or Recreational Studies or whatever the fuck. He’s getting a Civil Engineering degree and he’s going to work his ass off to get it. 
3) He’s going to get a job in his field immediately after graduation. No time off to “find himself” and no “mission work” or whatever. 

These fuckheads all did the wrong things. And they can’t afford to pay off their tuition loans because they got bullshit degrees from expensive colleges. Fuck these people. The loans are hitting default and with no recourse the companies that issue these loans are losing money. 

It’s to buy votes and I believe part of the package includes free college tuition to minorities. Gotta keep those loyal democratic voters sucking from the government titty.


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## Cronus (Apr 28, 2022)

Hughinn said:


> I don't understand the big push here for this.  Meaning, I don't get the logic behind it other than the democrat party purchasing votes.
> 
> Why is this something the government would consider?  The last time I looked, nobody was forced to accept a college tuition loan and those debts were accepted.  Not coerced.   Nobody was made to take on this debt.
> 
> ...


How do so many hardworking Americans support wars that just get our boys killed for no benefit to us?

How do so many hardworking American support corporate subsides that don't benefit the workers?

How do so many hardworking Americans support companies getting bailed out when they go bust?

How do......

Those are all rhetorical questions. The point I'm making is that this is the kind of shit our government should be doing. They waste so much of our tax dollars on things that only benefit corporations, wall street, etc. I will always support when the government does something that improves citizens lives.

Don't confuse my position for supporting those who do not want to do anything for themselves. That's not what this is. I don't advocate for handouts for lazy bums.

Lots of people go to college to get real degrees, not some bullshit pottery degree 😂, and are having a hard time finding work despite it. People go to college with the promise of better pay and better work. For whatever reason that isn't happening with the younger workforce.

I'm new here, but I've read enough on the forum to see how these threads go. I have no interest in getting into a pissing match over opinions. I've said mine, and now I'm exiting this thread. 😂

Have fun getting worked up. If the Ukraine and COVID threads are any indication, then I'm sure this one will be another banger 😂


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## CJ (Apr 28, 2022)

Unless I'm wrong, the gov't can only forgive gov't owned student loan debt, not private loans.


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## Robdjents (Apr 28, 2022)

Cronus said:


> How do so many hardworking Americans support wars that just get our boys killed for no benefit to us?
> 
> How do so many hardworking American support corporate subsides that don't benefit the workers?
> 
> ...


Hahaha Nissan will come piss someone off soon then it’s fucking on


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## Redloh (Apr 28, 2022)

Hughinn said:


> I don't understand the big push here for this.  Meaning, I don't get the logic behind it other than the democrat party purchasing votes.
> 
> Why is this something the government would consider?  The last time I looked, nobody was forced to accept a college tuition loan and those debts were accepted.  Not coerced.   Nobody was made to take on this debt.
> 
> ...



Purchasing votes is #1 of course. But the practical application behind it is that the loans were framed as "financial aid" not "debt," and there was no recognizable screening to be able to take on the debt. It's an isolated instance of being able to take out six figure loans with no proof of income. Recipe for disaster.

Definitely the fault of the student/borrower, but the student loan process is predatory. Young impressionable adults being told by society that they are failures if they don't attend college, and the benevolent colleges offering "financial aid" to help them along. Degrees should be priced based on market factors (supply/demand) and loans should be pegged to BLS average incomes for the dominant career paths associated with the degrees. Some combination of those two considerations would have prevented the problem in the first place.

As for who pays for it, it will be the middle class. Those who didn't attend college are (as a group) on the lower end of the income spectrum (sub $100k/yr). Their taxes won't be impacted most likely. The middle class, however, are really getting shit on. Even more so, the one's who attended college and already paid off their debt. That's what pisses me off.

We really should bring back voc ed to high school and get rid of this "college is the only way" b.s...


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## Hughinn (Apr 28, 2022)

Cronus said:


> How do so many hardworking Americans support wars that just get our boys killed for no benefit to us?
> 
> How do so many hardworking American support corporate subsides that don't benefit the workers?
> 
> ...



If you get to go to college, and I have to pay the tab, do I get a degree too?


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## Cronus (Apr 28, 2022)

Hughinn said:


> If you get to go to college, and I have to pay the tab, do I get a degree too?


Find someone else to argue with. Not me, not today, not ever.

My opinion is said, and I'm done. Have a good day.


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## Hughinn (Apr 28, 2022)

Cronus said:


> Find someone else to argue with. Not me, not today, not ever.
> 
> My opinion is said, and I'm done. Have a good day.



Okay. 
I must have missed the part where a college degree is supposed to guarantee a person a lucrative career. 

And if doesn't work out, then the government should reimburse the tuition. 

Shit, why don't all jobs work like that?


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## Cronus (Apr 28, 2022)

Hughinn said:


> Okay.
> I must have missed the part where a college degree is supposed to guarantee a person a lucrative career.
> 
> And if doesn't work out, then the government should reimburse the tuition.
> ...


Still trying to instigate a fight?

Like I said, I've seen your posts. I'm not taking your bait. If you want to be angry about the topic, or my opinion, then I'm good with that... but you and I have nothing to discuss on this topic.

Pick a new person to try to argue with friend. 😘


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## Hughinn (Apr 28, 2022)

Cronus said:


> Still trying to instigate a fight?
> 
> Like I said, I've seen your posts. I'm not taking your bait. If you want to be angry about the topic, or my opinion, then I'm good with that... but you and I have nothing to discuss on this topic.
> 
> Pick a new person to try to argue with friend. 😘



Sorry I offended you. 

I really am trying to understand why this is a thing.  

I just don't understand why these loans should be paid by the taxpayers.  

I'll ask someone else. Thank you for your time


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## Robdjents (Apr 28, 2022)

Cronus said:


> Still trying to instigate a fight?
> 
> Like I said, I've seen your posts. I'm not taking your bait. If you want to be angry about the topic, or my opinion, then I'm good with that... but you and I have nothing to discuss on this topic.
> 
> Pick a new person to try to argue with friend. 😘


He’s got you hook line sinker


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## Hughinn (Apr 28, 2022)

Redloh said:


> Purchasing votes is #1 of course. But the practical application behind it is that the loans were framed as "financial aid" not "debt," and there was no recognizable screening to be able to take on the debt. It's an isolated instance of being able to take out six figure loans with no proof of income. Recipe for disaster.
> 
> Definitely the fault of the student/borrower, but the student loan process is predatory. Young impressionable adults being told by society that they are failures if they don't attend college, and the benevolent colleges offering "financial aid" to help them along. Degrees should be priced based on market factors (supply/demand) and loans should be pegged to BLS average incomes for the dominant career paths associated with the degrees. Some combination of those two considerations would have prevented the problem in the first place.
> 
> ...



This post speaks to me. 

I've never set foot on a college campus.  Because the cost of the tuition was simply more than I was willing to pay.  

So I went to work. 

Like millions of other Americans, I'm asking myself that if I didn't want to take on that tab for myself, then why should we all take it on for other people's choices?


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## Hughinn (Apr 28, 2022)

I've had a good career anyway.

I had a cousin that went to LSU.  He got a degree in environmental engineering.

He now works for people who rotate certain cane and rice crops in soil biology.

We sat down several years ago and figured out that his income vs mine, minus his debt and time lost getting his degree.  We would be 52 and 54 years old respectively once he passed me in lifetime earnings. But at 55 I'll have 30+ years in Blue collar trade work and a decent pension and be looking for retirement.  He'll just be getting started 

He considers it worth it because he likes what he does and never was very capable of labor work anyway.    He paid his debts and also is against the government paying everyone else's.


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## BigBaldBeardGuy (Apr 28, 2022)

Hughinn said:


> Sorry I offended you.
> 
> I really am trying to understand why this is a thing.
> 
> ...


It’s because the MEDIA says these poor whittle angel kids went to college have an expensive college debt and….. oh my… STILL can’t find jobs. 😱

But we all know that’s bullshit. The graduates are different now. They EXPECT a huge salary with no experience whatsoever. They don’t prove their worth and get a salary increase based on merit. They cry about it and expect to get paid more. 

The media has also reported to us that these debts are “not fair”. And honestly, the way they are set up, they really aren’t fair. Lol. It’s a bad loan. Plain and simple. But with no income and no collateral, wtf are people supposed to expect. 

It’s too easy to go to college and NOT see a bill. Kids don’t understand the value. So they fuck around. Nevermind that college doesn’t teach you how to do a job. It’s 4 more years of figuring shit out and using the noggin. I guess it teaches “problem solving” but I haven’t used anything from school. 

The Biden Admin is intent upon bankrupting the country. Allow the dollar to collapse and role in the paperless global currency. This is just one of the many WASTEFUL spending programs.


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## Hughinn (Apr 28, 2022)

BigBaldBeardGuy said:


> It’s because the MEDIA says these poor whittle angel kids went to college have an expensive college debt and….. oh my… STILL can’t find jobs. 😱
> 
> But we all know that’s bullshit. The graduates are different now. They EXPECT a huge salary with no experience whatsoever. They don’t prove their worth and get a salary increase based on merit. They cry about it and expect to get paid more.
> 
> ...



I just can't see how this idea makes sense.

I also don't see anyone for it except people who went to college and it didn't work out for them.

But we've all made career choices at times that didn't work out.  There's never any guarantee.    So why should everyone pay for the choices of a few that didn't work out?   I pay for my bad choices.  You pay for your own.

Why can't they?


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## shackleford (Apr 28, 2022)

Hughinn said:


> Sorry I offended you.
> 
> I really am trying to understand why this is a thing.
> 
> ...


because you work for a living. therefore, you must support all those who choose not to work. At least that seems to be the mindset of the gov.

i dont have a degree. but I worked 96 hours a week going through school to learn and earn my license. it was hard, but i paid my tuition and books, while supporting myself. No loan. I worked for what i got. isnt that the american way?


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## Test_subject (Apr 28, 2022)

If the government really wanted to help people, they’d fix the broken student loan system so people didn’t get into such huge debt in the first place.

Readily available student loans have driven the cost of tuition through the roof by giving students artificially high purchasing power. Colleges can charge whatever they want because the loans are impossible to default on and the lenders will give them to anyone for whatever amount they need.

Loan forgiveness is a vote-buying bandaid.


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## wsmwannabe (Apr 28, 2022)

Cronus said:


> Those are all rhetorical questions. The point I'm making is that this is the kind of shit our government should be doing. They waste so much of our tax dollars on things that only benefit corporations, wall street, etc. *I will always support when the government does something that improves citizens lives.*


I agree with that part, but student loan debt cancellation isn’t the correct application of this idea.


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## shackleford (Apr 28, 2022)

Cronus said:


> I will always support when the government does something that improves citizens lives.


My opinion is it isnt the governments job to hand out student loans. this is another example of the government being involved in private affairs when their time and our tax dollars would be better spent somewhere else.


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## Cronus (Apr 28, 2022)

shackleford said:


> My opinion is it isnt the governments job to hand out student loans. this is another example of the government being involved in private affairs when their time and our tax dollars would be better spent somewhere else.


I don't disagree with your opinion.

I'm of the opinion of if the government is going to fuck me, where option A is to line politician or corporate pockets, and option B is to put my tax dollars in a place where it can benefit someone even though I will never benefit from it, then I will pick option B.

Let's face it, the government are a bunch of thugs who shake us down for money. We will never get a real say. If I'm going to get fucked, but it's helping a real person, then I won't really bitch about it out loud.

Kind of like getting bent over with lube or without lube. After you get banged dry for pretty much your entire life, you won't complain that one time your rapist decides to use lube 😅


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## GSgator (Apr 28, 2022)

Nothings free. Have you look at the statistics of people that go to college they have it so much better than the people that don’t.

Fuck them if it takes  alittle bit longer to buy a home because they have  to pay off their college education then so be  . It’s not fair for non educated  tax payers to pay off some rich dude fucking daughters education.


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## Test_subject (Apr 28, 2022)

GSgator said:


> Nothings free. Have you look at the statistics of people that go to college they have it so much better than the people that don’t.
> 
> Fuck them if it takes  alittle bit longer to buy a home because they have  to pay off their college education then so be  . It’s not fair to tax payers to pay off some rich dude fucking daughters education.


The problem is that the cost of tuition has gone bonkers in the last 30 years. Inflation adjusted it’s 8-11x more expensive. 

People are taking on WAY more debt to get the same education.


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## GSgator (Apr 28, 2022)

Test_subject said:


> The problem is that the cost of tuition has gone bonkers in the last 30 years. Inflation adjusted it’s 8-11x more expensive.
> 
> People are taking on WAY more debt to get the same education.


Not  my problem they signed up they finish it they pay it that’s  American way so what wehave  to pay everybody’s house off now when interest rates go to 6%?


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## shackleford (Apr 28, 2022)

Cronus said:


> I don't disagree with your opinion.
> 
> I'm of the opinion of if the government is going to fucked me, where option A is to line politician or corporate pockets, and option B is to put my tax dollars in a place where it can benefit someone even though I will never benefit from it, then I will pick option B.
> 
> ...


I understand your decision based on those two choices. those arent the only two options though.

Before make your decision, maybe verify where this money for student loan forgiveness is actually coming from. I'm not sure its possible. i'd love to be smart enough to audit the gov and see exactly where every tax dollar goes. but believe me, no politician will pass anything that will affect their own bottom line.


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## shackleford (Apr 28, 2022)

Test_subject said:


> The problem is that the cost of tuition has gone bonkers in the last 30 years. Inflation adjusted it’s 8-11x more expensive.
> 
> People are taking on WAY more debt to get the same education.


this is one of the major issues with college education. this, and well, the education.


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## Cronus (Apr 28, 2022)

shackleford said:


> I understand your decision based on those two choices. those arent the only two options though.
> 
> Before make your decision, maybe verify where this money for student loan forgiveness is actually coming from. I'm not sure its possible. i'd love to be smart enough to audit the gov and see exactly where every tax dollar goes. but believe me, no politician will pass anything that will affect their own bottom line.


We have no options. This is forced on us.

My only other actionable option I have is to write my senator and congressman; which I've already done. I write them on just about everything. I've yet to see it make a difference, but I still do it.


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## GSgator (Apr 28, 2022)

At the end of this year we paid 150 grand for my wife’s college education. She completely restarted her career in her late 30s and she’ll be 50 when it’s paid off do we get a refund?? 

We are one among many that are in that scenario you just can’t do stuff like this it’s not fair.


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## Cronus (Apr 28, 2022)

GSgator said:


> At the end of this year we paid 150 grand for my wife’s college education. She completely restarted her career in her late 30s and she’ll be 50 when it’s paid off do we get a refund?? Where are one among mini that are in the scenario you just can’t do stuff like this it’s not fair.


You might. Try to apply, see if she qualifies, and take advantage of the situation if you can.

Edit: I just noticed you said refund. Disregard my post


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## GSgator (Apr 28, 2022)

Cronus said:


> You might. Try to apply, see if she qualifies, and take advantage of the situation if you can.


I seriously doubt that would happen i’m sure it’ll be all current loans. This will cost what $9 trillion from the taxpayers like I said nothings free.


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## Cronus (Apr 28, 2022)

GSgator said:


> I seriously doubt that would happen i’m sure it’ll be all current loans. This will cost what $9 trillion from the taxpayers like I said nothings free


I edited my post. Didn't notice you said refund; which to me means the loan is pretty close to paid in full? If that's the case then I agree, they won't do jack for you.


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## Redloh (Apr 28, 2022)

GSgator said:


> Nothings free. Have you look at the statistics of people that go to college they have it so much better than the people that don’t.
> 
> Fuck them if it takes  alittle bit longer to buy a home because they have  to pay off their college education then so be  . It’s not fair for non educated  tax payers to pay off some rich dude fucking daughters education.


In all fairness though, rich dude's daughter likely doesn't have student loans since dad managed his money well and set aside for her. And on the other end, the non-college folks who are busting their asses and making under $41775 (single), $55900 (HoH), or $83550 (married) won't see any change to their taxes since the standard deduction and other credits negate much of their taxes. The one's getting hit most unfairly are 1) went to college on loans, paid them off, and now earn in the 22% and 24% tax brackets, and 2) didn't go to college, busted their ass, and earn in the 22% and 24% tax brackets, and 3) went to college on loans, took out too much due to broken system and shit parental oversight, and now can't find employment that provides an income that draws down their loan balance.


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## GSgator (Apr 28, 2022)

Redloh said:


> In all fairness though, rich dude's daughter likely doesn't have student loans since dad managed his money well and set aside for her. And on the other end, the non-college folks who are busting their asses and making under $41775 (single), $55900 (HoH), or $83550 (married) won't see any change to their taxes since the standard deduction and other credits negate much of their taxes. The one's getting hit most unfairly are 1) went to college on loans, paid them off, and now earn in the 22% and 24% tax brackets, and 2) didn't go to college, busted their ass, and earn in the 22% and 24% tax brackets, and 3) went to college on loans, took out too much due to broken system and shit parental oversight, and now can't find employment that provides an income that draws down their loan balance.



I guess we’ll see they haven’t broken down how they’re gonna pay for it yet unless I’m missing something?


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## Test_subject (Apr 28, 2022)

GSgator said:


> Not  my problem they signed up they finish it they pay it that’s  American way so what wehave  to pay everybody’s house off now when interest rates go to 6%?


I didn’t say that. I actually said that I was against debt forgiveness. 

I said that the government should fix the problem rather than buying votes with a bandaid approach.


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## GSgator (Apr 28, 2022)

Test_subject said:


> I didn’t say that. I actually said that I was against debt forgiveness.
> 
> I said that the government should fix the problem rather than buying votes with a bandaid approach.


You didn’t say what did I accuse you of saying something? I’m rereading my post you quoted and I don’t see anything in there saying you said something.


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## Redloh (Apr 28, 2022)

GSgator said:


> I guess we’ll see they haven’t broken down how they’re gonna pay for it yet unless I’m missing something?


Oh it's going to be a clusterfuck for sure, given the current administration's inability to do literally any fucking thing right. Not saying I agree with blanket loan "forgiveness" at all either. Really just arguing the case for the young student loan borrowers who are seriously in a bad situation due to a broken system.

Same goes for the sub-prime folks in the early 2000s. Their fault for overleveraging and taking out bad loans, but surely the system wouldn't allow for such a horrible thing to occur?!


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## Test_subject (Apr 28, 2022)

GSgator said:


> I guess we’ll see they haven’t broken down how they’re gonna pay for it yet unless I’m missing something?


Seemed so from your post. 

I posted about tuition being 8-11x more expensive and you quoted me asking if we should pay people’s mortgages if interest rates go up. 

I was a bit confused because I was saying the opposite.


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## Iron1 (Apr 28, 2022)

They won't do loan forgiveness. 

Those loans are tied up into student loan asset-backed securities (SLABS) and sold on the equities market. No way wall street is going to give that up cushy gravy train, too much money to be made by selling more and larger loans to students.


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## GSgator (Apr 28, 2022)

HAHA seriously well my bad . That’s what I get then it’s crazy town right now my hotel room. I’m on vacation we’re getting ready to go walk the dogs  to eat and it’s complete chaos lol


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## Test_subject (Apr 28, 2022)

GSgator said:


> HAHA seriously well my bad . That’s what I get then it’s crazy town right now my hotel room. I’m on vacation we’re getting ready to go walk the dogs  to eat and it’s complete chaos lol


No biggy man. I did exactly the same thing to someone this morning.


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## Test_subject (Apr 28, 2022)

Iron1 said:


> They won't do loan forgiveness.
> 
> Those loans are tied up into student loan asset-backed securities (SLABS) and sold on the equities market. No way wall street is going to give that up cushy gravy train, too much money to be made by selling more and larger loans to students.


This man gets it. 

The government doesn’t want to fix the problem; they want to buy votes.


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## Achilleus (Apr 28, 2022)

Just keep convincing people that its the american way to keep getting fucked in the ass. Wallstreet loves each and everyone of you who sticks up for them, for no reason.. Its like they have people brainwashed to be cucks for them. 

The amount of money without scholarships and other benefits is stupid and doesn't come close to what they used to be. Targeting young people without any real world financial perspective along with just being young and dumb, is predatory. I probably should say I think college should cost something and not be free but not the rates we have today. I personally ain't affected since I went to community college first but have quite a few friends that went to expensive schools. Some were able to get good jobs and pay it off in time others are struggling.

Student loans are super predatory and there is no forgiveness whatsoever. If you don't pay them off before you retire, they take money from social security. Wouldn't be surprised if they try to go after the closest relative if the person dies. You can thank Joe Biden for making it this way too. Wait, does this mean that everyone against student loan forgiveness, actually just indirectly supported Joe Biden?


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## Hughinn (Apr 28, 2022)

Test_subject said:


> I didn’t say that. I actually said that I was against debt forgiveness.
> 
> I said that the government should fix the problem rather than buying votes with a bandaid approach.



Are you suggesting the government dictate what educational institutions are allowed to charge for an education?

If so, why is this a good idea, and how could it affect the quality?


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## Swiper. (Apr 28, 2022)

having trouble trying find it in the US Constitution where it says the government has the authority to be in the student loan business, still looking….


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## Hughinn (Apr 28, 2022)

American taxpayers and the government


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## lifter6973 (Apr 28, 2022)

Hughinn said:


> I don't understand the big push here for this.  Meaning, I don't get the logic behind it other than the democrat party purchasing votes.
> 
> Why is this something the government would consider?  The last time I looked, nobody was forced to accept a college tuition loan and those debts were accepted.  Not coerced.   Nobody was made to take on this debt.
> 
> ...


Well god damn @Hughinn we agree on something. I think the govt pushing to forgive student loan debt is absolute horse shit.


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## lifter6973 (Apr 28, 2022)

CJ said:


> Unless I'm wrong, the gov't can only forgive gov't owned student loan debt, not private loans.


Who's going to pick up the slack? You and I bro. Horse shit.


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## Human_Backhoe (Apr 28, 2022)

Student loans are racist!


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## CJ (Apr 28, 2022)

lifter6973 said:


> Who's going to pick up the slack? You and I bro. Horse shit.


I agree. I just don't think it covers ALL student loans.


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## Human_Backhoe (Apr 28, 2022)

Test_subject said:


> I didn’t say that. I actually said that I was against debt forgiveness.
> 
> I said that the government should fix the problem rather than buying votes with a bandaid approach.



The government isn't capable of operating, let alone fixing anything now. I think it's about time the citizen take a more active role in Gov accountability. If they are not willing to do that.....well you get what you pay for.


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## shackleford (Apr 28, 2022)

Achilleus said:


> Just keep convincing people that its the american way to keep getting fucked in the ass. Wallstreet loves each and everyone of you who sticks up for them, for no reason.. Its like they have people brainwashed to be cucks for them.
> 
> The amount of money without scholarships and other benefits is stupid and doesn't come close to what they used to be. Targeting young people without any real world financial perspective along with just being young and dumb, is predatory. I probably should say I think college should cost something and not be free but not the rates we have today. I personally ain't affected since I went to community college first but have quite a few friends that went to expensive schools. Some were able to get good jobs and pay it off in time others are struggling.
> 
> Student loans are super predatory and there is no forgiveness whatsoever. If you don't pay them off before you retire, they take money from social security. Wouldn't be surprised if they try to go after the closest relative if the person dies. You can thank Joe Biden for making it this way too. Wait, does this mean that everyone against student loan forgiveness, actually just indirectly supported Joe Biden?


i agree college tuition is way too expensive.

i also agree that during the 12 years of education prior to college, students should be taught real world skills like money management, loans, interest, investing, planning for a financial future, etc. of course in addition to other real world life skills that arent taught.

But I also believe in paying my debts and I wouldnt expect someone else to pick up the tab.


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## 69nites (Apr 29, 2022)

I disagree with student loan forgiveness. I also disagree with student loans being exempt from bankruptcy protections. 

Student loans should carry the same risks as any other loan for the banking institution. 

Universities are selling a false bill of goods with no risks, and banks are giving loans for something unlikely to pay for itself. This has led to inflated prices and predatory loans


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## CJ (Apr 29, 2022)

How Big Government Broke Higher Education: The Student Loan Bubble, Explained  |  Hannah Cox
					

In his book "Bubbles and Crashes," author Brent Goldfarb says all bubbles tend to have three qualities.  The student loan bubble checks all three boxes.



					fee.org


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## GSgator (Apr 29, 2022)

Ep. 1757 Biden’s Most Destructive Move Yet - The Dan Bongino Show
					

For show notes, visit https://bongino.com/ep-1757-bidens-most-destructive-move-yet Check out our Clips channel for video highlights https://rumble.com/c/DanBonginoShowClips Sign up to receive Dan's da




					rumble.com
				




42min in he breaks it down good. We have complete morons running our Government  .


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## MindlessWork (Apr 29, 2022)

Seems it's law or medical school that's driving up loan balances...go figure. However those predatory for-profit schools are a big part of the problem.


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## notsoswoleCPA (Apr 29, 2022)

I'll feel like such a sucker for paying my own way through college if a law is ever passed to forgive student loans.

As for medical school debt, since the passing of the ACA, new doctors no longer get their loans paid off by working in a hospital for a few years when gaining their experience.  That was one of the things cut from most hospital budgets to make up for the anticipated shortfall from the insurance companies and the government in the post ACA world.  There is more to it than that, but that is the gist of it.  Source:  I worked in the hospital environment for ten years of my career.


----------



## wsmwannabe (Apr 29, 2022)

69nites said:


> I disagree with student loan forgiveness. I *also disagree with student loans being exempt from bankruptcy protections.*
> 
> Student loans should carry the same risks as any other loan for the banking institution.
> 
> Universities are selling a false bill of goods with no risks, and banks are giving loans for something unlikely to pay for itself. This has led to inflated prices and predatory loans


I didn’t think about that, but it’s certainly a way to get the lenders to be a lot more selective about who gets the loans and make their lending “more responsible”.


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## notsoswoleCPA (Apr 29, 2022)

69nites said:


> I disagree with student loan forgiveness. I also disagree with student loans being exempt from bankruptcy protections.


The reason they exempted student loans from bankruptcy protection was due to the abuse by recent graduates.  Think about it, a new graduate cannot find a job in their field, they petition the court for bankruptcy, and bam, student loans forgiven because they have no income to repay them at that point in time.  Back in the day, this happened WAY more than was ever publicized.  My business law professor in college told the class that he specialized in new student bankruptcies before the laws were changed.

Sure, it screws one's credit for seven years, but if they are living with mom and dad while getting their start in life fresh out of college, that is easy peasy!


----------



## Test_subject (Apr 29, 2022)

Human_Backhoe said:


> The government isn't capable of operating, let alone fixing anything now. I think it's about time the citizen take a more active role in Gov accountability. If they are not willing to do that.....well you get what you pay for.


Absolutely. It’s time for a bit of an overhaul.


----------



## Test_subject (Apr 29, 2022)

Hughinn said:


> Are you suggesting the government dictate what educational institutions are allowed to charge for an education?
> 
> If so, why is this a good idea, and how could it affect the quality?


No, what I’m suggesting is overhauling the student loan system so it doesn’t continue to cause hyperinflation of tuition.

Look up some statistics on average wages vs tuition prices over time when you get a chance.  They’re eye-opening.


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## JuiceTrain (Apr 29, 2022)

What's college?

Discuss...🧐


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## GSgator (Apr 29, 2022)

JuiceTrain said:


> What's college?
> 
> Discuss...🧐


I make more then my wife and I don’t owe 100’s of thousands. I went to trade school
for 5 years after work twice a week lol. Her job is definitely more let’s say stable and will never ever get slow or have a recession fuck it up.


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## Badleroybrown (Apr 29, 2022)

I tell
Everyone that is young and getting ready to move with life. Get a trade, learn how to work with your hands,
You can make as much if not mire
Money than someone who goes and spends thousands in a education that they prob will not use.
With the job market for skilled workers,
Laborers,  truck drivers so forth.
I know guys that drive trucks for construction company’s making $80,000 A year.
I know guys working for municipalities as highway workers making 75,000 a year.
I didn’t go to college and I do right by my family.
I pay my fair share of taxes as we all do.
My daughter is going to college in a few months and we are figuring out how we are paying for college.
Can’t get financial aid for her because we make too much money.
We will have to take student loans.
But she is going for education so she will be able to work when she is done.
And together we will pay these loans off.
She has a friend who’s let’s say from about if the border. She came here with her parents at a young age.
I know here parents are undocumented.
She is getting a full ride to a pretty expensive college.. because of her situation.
But let’s be clear. Her fam is not hurting . Her father has A construction company and her mother floats around in a Tahoe.
Go figure.🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬


----------



## GSgator (Apr 29, 2022)

Badleroybrown said:


> I tell
> Everyone that is young and getting ready to move with life. Get a trade, learn how to work with your hands,
> You can make as much if not mire
> Money than someone who goes and spends thousands in a education that they prob will not use.
> ...


Sounds like there living the American dream on our dime.


----------



## Test_subject (Apr 29, 2022)

GSgator said:


> I make more then my wife and I don’t owe 100’s of thousands. I went to trade school
> for 5 years after work twice a week lol.


Elementary and high schools need to start encouraging trades as much as they do university. 

Good tradesmen make good ass money.


----------



## BigBaldBeardGuy (Apr 29, 2022)

MindlessWork said:


> Seems it's law or medical school that's driving up loan balances...go figure. However those predatory for-profit schools are a big part of the problem.


Which “predatory for-profit schools”? Name names. 

Nevermind. I know you and I know you’ll ignore the question.


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## 69nites (Apr 29, 2022)

notsoswoleCPA said:


> The reason they exempted student loans from bankruptcy protection was due to the abuse by recent graduates.  Think about it, a new graduate cannot find a job in their field, they petition the court for bankruptcy, and bam, student loans forgiven because they have no income to repay them at that point in time.  Back in the day, this happened WAY more than was ever publicized.  My business law professor in college told the class that he specialized in new student bankruptcies before the laws were changed.
> 
> Sure, it screws one's credit for seven years, but if they are living with mom and dad while getting their start in life fresh out of college, that is easy peasy!


All I'm seeing is that banks gave out bad loans and people declared bankruptcy. 

If a recent graduate can't afford to pay their loans, that means the bank gave a bad loan.

If the job market doesn't support graduates getting a job and making their student loan payments it's a bad loan. You think the solution to a is to exempt them from bankruptcy, the actual solution is for them to be selective on what degrees and standard of student is eligible for a loan.

If you take out a business loan, you have to provide a business plan and market research to demonstrate that you can reasonably pay back your loan. A student loan should be no different.


----------



## Nodus1 (Apr 29, 2022)

Cronus said:


> Find someone else to argue with. Not me, not today, not ever.
> 
> My opinion is said, and I'm done. Have a good day.


Get a load of this guy.  🤣 

I'd love to see a chunk of this loan forgiveness taken out of the billions of dollars in endowments these schools hold on to.


----------



## Badleroybrown (Apr 29, 2022)

On the other hand… and belive me what’s going on is a tragedy… but sleepy Joe wants to give Ukrain 33 billion dollars??? WTF.. aren’t we broke enough.. Dumb Fucked. Why not just send some troops in and handle the situation. Or how about slam some bombs in the Russian troops and there strongholds and end it fast.
Russia could never match the strength of our military. And the whole “Oh he is unstable and he is threatening a nuclear war” people that believe that Putin would do something like this are the same people that belive carina started in a wet market..

Open your eyes people.
Look what’s going on in China right now.
Why are the news networks plastering this all over the news… why is the us not saying they want to do anything over there…
Because China is a whole different animal and sleepy Joe and his cronies realize that in the last 2 years that China has become a super powerful with there milatary and we may have a hard time matching this…
Putin is desamating a country to prove a point and Chi is doing mass genicide with his people and blaming it on Corona… but yet we are still giving monies and letting China pound out asses..
Anyway so this rant is back to loans.
I don’t condone loan forgiveness but I do see how it could help millions..
And if you have people that have loans.hard working people and they are having a hard time to pay there loans then why not help out..


----------



## wsmwannabe (Apr 29, 2022)

Test_subject said:


> Elementary and high schools need to start encouraging trades as much as they do university.
> 
> Good tradesmen make good ass money.


I’m working on this with my 4 and 6 year olds now. I’m letting them know that college is optional. My MIL said she’s going to convince them otherwise 

My MIL raised 4 kids, 3 went to college, one flunked out, one doesn’t use her degree or even have a job (that one is my wife lol), and the 3rd one has a degree in communications but works as an insurance adjuster. She’s gonna have an impossible time convincing me and my two children that college is a must


----------



## lifter6973 (Apr 29, 2022)

Nodus1 said:


> Get a load of this guy.  🤣
> 
> I'd love to see a chunk of this loan forgiveness taken out of the billions of dollars in endowments these schools hold on to.


Why put it on the schools?


----------



## lifter6973 (Apr 29, 2022)

Badleroybrown said:


> On the other hand… and belive me what’s going on is a tragedy… but sleepy Joe wants to give Ukrain 33 billion dollars??? WTF.. aren’t we broke enough.. Dumb Fucked. Why not just send some troops in and handle the situation. Or how about slam some bombs in the Russian troops and there strongholds and end it fast.
> Russia could never match the strength of our military. And the whole “Oh he is unstable and he is threatening a nuclear war” people that believe that Putin would do something like this are the same people that belive carina started in a wet market..
> 
> Open your eyes people.
> ...


What about the hard working people who had a hard time paying their loans before now but did so anyway and had to do without many things yet eventually they did pay off their loans?
It is a bad precedent to set. 
I do agree we need to stop sending so much money to other countries.


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## RiR0 (Apr 29, 2022)

I’d rather them use money to pay off student loans or hell buy everybody a pizza anything instead of sending money to other countries.
I’d rather them pay off student loans than give tax breaks to billionaires, millionaires or churches


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## CJ (Apr 29, 2022)

RiR0 said:


> I’d rather them use money to pay off student loans or hell buy everybody a pizza anything instead of sending money to other countries.


I say neither. Once the gov't starts paying for college, it waters down its value. That degree becomes the new high school diploma. Then you need a Master's at a minimum to differentiate yourself. 

Keep the gov't out of as much shit as possible. More often than not, they end up making things worse, not helping.


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## RiR0 (Apr 29, 2022)

🤔 or better yet instead of any of this bullshit they just stop taking so much of our money.


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## RiR0 (Apr 29, 2022)

CJ said:


> I say neither. Once the gov't starts paying for college, it waters down its value. That degree becomes the new high school diploma. Then you need a Master's at a minimum to differentiate yourself.
> 
> Keep the gov't out of as much shit as possible. More often than not, they end up making things worse, not helping.


Maybe. Which degrees are really valuable any way? Some medical degrees, science based degrees, law degrees. 
The important ones will always be important.

Education shouldn’t be about how much you can afford


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## RiR0 (Apr 29, 2022)

This article says only 27% even work in the field they majored in 









						QoD: What % of college grads work in the field of their major? - Blog
					

Question of the Day for teachers and students: What percent of college graduates end up working in the field of their major?




					www.ngpf.org


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## CJ (Apr 29, 2022)

RiR0 said:


> Maybe. Which degrees are really valuable any way? Some medical degrees, science based degrees, law degrees.
> The important ones will always be important.
> 
> Education shouldn’t be about how much you can afford


I can't believe the parents who cosign for bullshit degrees/loans. 

I have ZERO intention of signing for my daughter's school loans. She will have some skin in the game, so if she fukks off or doesn't finish, it's on her and not me. 

If she does well in school, I'll help her pay them off on the back end, if I'm in position to and/or feel it's worth it. 

She wants to be a veterinarian, so school will be a necessity.


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## Test_subject (Apr 29, 2022)

I like the idea of making the loans easier to discharge via bankruptcy. That would make lenders consider their loans more carefully and lower the amount that they’re willing to lend. Schools would have to lower their tuition as a result or they’d have empty seats in classrooms.

As it is now, lenders will throw $100,000 at anyone to get their sociology degree because they’ll make their money back one way or the other.  Then they turn around and sell securities backed by the ever-increasing loans.


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## white ape (Apr 29, 2022)

Disclaimer: Didn't read all the posts. 

1) College shouldn't be as expensive as it is

2) I think STEM programs should be subsidized by the government. We need more people in STEM and these fields can benefit society as a whole

3) I completed my bachelors and MBA because I had the GI Bill. Literally the only reason I went to school was because of the GI Bill. I think a GI Bill type program should be extended into other types of things. Maybe young people could go work for the Conservation Corps or something and receive some sort of funding towards education. Basically there should be government programs where you go and work for 2, 3, 4 years (or whatever) for low pay that helps the US and in return you can receive education benefits. The military isn't for everyone and this would still be a way for young people to serve their county and get benefits.


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## 1bigun11 (Apr 29, 2022)

I would like to see the government, both state and federal, get out of the education business altogether.  The federal government has completely screwed up local education, to the point that my wife and I have pulled our kids from public school and my wife is home schooling them.  We have been doing it for two years and they are already testing two grades higher than the local public schools.

The reason I would like the government out at the local level is that my wife and I are still paying taxes to support the screwed up public schools.  Also, it is unfair for people who have no children to have to pay taxes to support a public school system that so often screws kids up more than it helps.  The argument that the public schools are churning out such fine citizens that all of society benefits fails miserably.  Let parents pay for their own babysitting service.

Like CJ said, the best way to screw up something is to get the government involved in it.


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## Dex (Apr 29, 2022)

Well, I have helped thousands and even saved multiple lives in my career. So, yeah, I believe my $148k student loan debt should be forgiven especially since $42k of it is interest.


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## RiR0 (Apr 29, 2022)

Dex said:


> Well, I have helped thousands and even saved multiple lives in my career. So, yeah, I believe my $148k student loan debt should be forgiven especially since $42k of it is interest.


Do you? Did you save their lives for free?


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## Dex (Apr 29, 2022)

RiR0 said:


> Do you? Did you save their lives for free?


It sure feels like it. The entire system is flawed. Overpaid athletes, underpaid healthcare workers. Everyone feels they deserve a tip for doing their easy job these days but the people who actually deserve tips don't get them. It is pretty sad.


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## Dex (Apr 29, 2022)

Oh, and yes I have saved a life for free.


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## lifter6973 (Apr 29, 2022)

Dex said:


> Well, I have helped thousands and even saved multiple lives in my career. So, yeah, I believe my $148k student loan debt should be forgiven especially since $42k of it is interest.


Give me a break. Yes the interest is outrageous but you think you should be off the hook for 106K? It's this kind of mindset that fucks our country financially. However, @Test_subject has  great point that banks giving these ridiculous loans is a big problem as well.


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## wsmwannabe (Apr 29, 2022)

Dex said:


> Well, I have helped thousands and even saved multiple lives in my career. So, yeah, I believe my $148k student loan debt should be forgiven especially since $42k of it is interest.


When you took out your loans, were you unaware you had to pay them back? When you took your job, we’re you expecting loan forgiveness? Was it written anywhere, or even verbally agreed to?


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## Dex (Apr 29, 2022)

lifter6973 said:


> Give me a break. Yes the interest is outrageous but you think you should be off the hook for 106K? It's this kind of mindset that fucks our country financially. However, @Test_subject has  great point that banks giving these ridiculous loans is a big problem as well.


But you agree with our taxes going towards bailouts to help all of the billion dollar companies? Sure, that is clearly a better option.


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## Dex (Apr 29, 2022)

wsmwannabe said:


> When you took out your loans, were you unaware you had to pay them back? When you took your job, we’re you expecting loan forgiveness? Was it written anywhere, or even verbally agreed to?


Yep, I was expecting it. However, Obama stopped it in 2009.


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## lifter6973 (Apr 29, 2022)

wsmwannabe said:


> When you took out your loans, were you unaware you had to pay them back?


I was in debt for pretty much the same amount as him. I paid it all back including the interest. I had many many lean years. My wife didnt owe as much as me but we were in our 40s before both were paid off.
Things are so much better now financially but that was a bitch of a burden. To think that people now want this wiped cleaned is maddening to me.


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## lifter6973 (Apr 29, 2022)

Dex said:


> But you agree with our taxes going towards bailouts to help all of the billion dollar companies? Sure, that is clearly a better option.


Check out my previous post. I just don't get why some people struggled and still paid back their loans while others think they are entitled to have the loan forgiven. I don't agree with bailouts either.


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## FlyingPapaya (Apr 29, 2022)

Were you not at one point in time able to file bankruptcy on student loans?


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## Dex (Apr 29, 2022)

lifter6973 said:


> Check out my previous post. I just don't get why some people struggled and still paid back their loans while others think they are entitled to have the loan forgiven. I don't agree with bailouts either.


I don't agree with 90% of what the government has done in the past two years. Many have lost their jobs and business due to lockdowns. And if they can afford to give themselves a $40k a year pay adjustment on an outrageous salary, loans can easily be dropped.


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## Dex (Apr 29, 2022)

FlyingPapaya said:


> Were you not at one point in time able to file bankruptcy on student loans?


IDK, maybe only private loans and not federal?


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## Test_subject (Apr 29, 2022)

FlyingPapaya said:


> Were you not at one point in time able to file bankruptcy on student loans?


You still can, technically, but it’s next to impossible to actually do it.  You have to prove undue hardship and jump through a ton of hoops.


----------



## FlyingPapaya (Apr 29, 2022)

Mmmm how come?


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## lifter6973 (Apr 29, 2022)

Test_subject said:


> You still can, technically, but it’s next to impossible to actually do it.


You can not file bankruptcy on Federal loans. Private, yes.


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## Dex (Apr 29, 2022)

Test_subject said:


> You still can, technically, but it’s next to impossible to actually do it.  You have to prove undue hardship and jump through a ton of hoops.


I'm assuming it would be easier to take out a private loan, pay off student loans, then put the private loan in chapter 7 or 11 a couple years later.


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## lifter6973 (Apr 29, 2022)

Dex said:


> I don't agree with 90% of what the government has done in the past two years. Many have lost their jobs and business due to lockdowns. And if they can afford to give themselves a $40k a year pay adjustment on an outrageous salary, loans can easily be dropped.


You are using another reason to justify a bad decision on your part. What about all the people who paid back their loans or the people who didn't go to an expensive college because they knew they couldn't afford it and decided the loans were more than they can pay back?
You don't see how this is giving the shaft to people that were responsible?


----------



## Test_subject (Apr 29, 2022)

lifter6973 said:


> You can not file bankruptcy on Federal loans. Private, yes.


You can have federal student loans discharged by bankruptcy in theory. In practice it’s almost impossible.

You have to prove undue hardship and other things.


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## lifter6973 (Apr 29, 2022)

Dex said:


> I'm assuming it would be easier to take out a private loan, pay off student loans, then put the private loan in chapter 7 or 11 a couple years later.


ohhhh, I didn't think of that. That has to be something to combat that scenario but it sounds like a plan nonetheless.


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## Dex (Apr 29, 2022)

lifter6973 said:


> You are using another reason to justify a bad decision on your part. What about all the people who paid back there loans or the people who didn't go to an expensive college because they knew they couldn't afford it and decided the loans were more than they can pay back?
> You don't see how this is giving the shaft to people that were responsible?


Oh, I feel you and understand that. That is why giving college away for free is just as upsetting for the people who paid or couldn't go due to costs.


----------



## Test_subject (Apr 29, 2022)

lifter6973 said:


> ohhhh, I didn't think of that. That has to be something to combat that scenario but it sounds like a plan nonetheless.


Completely destroying your credit for 7-10 years is a strong deterrent.


----------



## lifter6973 (Apr 29, 2022)

Dex said:


> Oh, I feel you and understand that. That is why giving college away for free is just as upsetting for the people who paid or couldn't go due to costs.


agree


----------



## Dex (Apr 29, 2022)

Test_subject said:


> Completely destroying your credit for 7-10 years is a strong deterrent.


The student loans, if unpaid, destroy it for even longer.


----------



## lifter6973 (Apr 29, 2022)

Test_subject said:


> Completely destroying your credit for 7-10 years is a strong deterrent.


LOL it sure is....but if you do it in your 20s, by the time you are in your 30s you are back on track.
I def don't advocate it but sometimes there are no other options. I mean fuck some of these debts people have, they will be paying their entire lives.


----------



## Test_subject (Apr 29, 2022)

Dex said:


> The student loans, if unpaid, destroy it for even longer.


Student loans count as debt and a credit liability, sure, and defaulting on any loan is bad, but declaring bankruptcy is way, way worse for your credit.


----------



## Rot-Iron66 (Apr 29, 2022)

I paid 250K over a 6 year period for the 2 kids colleges. Maybe Joe will re-imburse me?
Maybe I should have taken out loans and milked them until demtardz wiped them clean?
Hmmm...


----------



## GSgator (Apr 29, 2022)

CJ said:


> I can't believe the parents who cosign for bullshit degrees/loans.
> 
> I have ZERO intention of signing for my daughter's school loans. She will have some skin in the game, so if she fukks off or doesn't finish, it's on her and not me.
> 
> ...


We told our son you make A & B’s will pay for those classes but these are pre-Rec classes in a community college . Then we made it clear once your hit a University that’s on your own. Your younger and have the time we need to focus on retirement. He want to be a structure engineer.

What pissed me off is his first 2 years of Community college IMO should have gotten done  in high school  They  let these kids fuck off in high school and when they get to college there taking BASICS . Some buckle down with like head start and get a associates in high school but most don’t there teenagers. Fuck we are paying college prices for English 2 and algebra WTF.


----------



## wsmwannabe (Apr 29, 2022)

Dex said:


> Yep, I was expecting it. However, Obama stopped it in 2009.


So you were expecting it, but was it ever expressly written or spoken that your student loans would be wiped away?

My point is, if you just expect your loans to be paid for by our tax dollars without it ever having been agreed to before taking out the loans, that’s called entitlement and should get you nothing.

If on the other hand, you were expecting it because it was part of your loan or schooling agreement, and it wasn’t paid for by tax dollars, that’s called getting fucked.

Even though I had the GI Bill, my total schooling cost the American tax payers about 40k and cost me 10k. This was for a degree in engineering that has paid for itself about 12 times in 7 years. I would never expect to get even my 10k back, even though my schooling was supposed to be fully paid for.


----------



## lifter6973 (Apr 29, 2022)

Test_subject said:


> Student loans count as debt and a credit liability, sure, and defaulting on any loan is bad, but declaring bankruptcy is way, way worse for your credit.


I did think of another deterrent for the private loan plan to pay off the student loan. 

It is much harder to get a private loan and finding a lender that agrees to a large loan for the purpose of paying off a student loan with no plan on how payments can be made would be extremely difficult to find. 

It would basically have to be a con job with a false strategy by the person applying.


----------



## DF (Apr 29, 2022)

IDK I'd like to see some type of program. I'm not in favor of forgiveness, but something to help ease the burden.  What 18 year old kid is in a position to know about debt in general? 

My daughter will be a college junior in the Fall.  I'm doing my best to give her the wisdom of my experience.  Specifically about a return on investment.  Paying $120k for a BS degree in something that will give you $40-50K a year... Is not good..LOL  Will she listen?  Ugh!


----------



## Test_subject (Apr 29, 2022)

DF said:


> IDK I'd like to see some type of program. I'm not in favor of forgiveness, but something to help ease the burden.  What 18 year old kid is in a position to know about debt in general?
> 
> My daughter will be a college junior in the Fall.  I'm doing my best to give her the wisdom of my experience.  Specifically about a return on investment.  Paying $120k for a BS degree in something that will give you $40-50K a year... Is not good..LOL  Will she listen?  Ugh!


It’s crazy man. The government doesn’t trust them to drink alcohol yet, but giving them a 100k loan is no problem whatsoever.


----------



## Badleroybrown (Apr 29, 2022)

lifter6973 said:


> What about the hard working people who had a hard time paying their loans before now but did so anyway and had to do without many things yet eventually they did pay off their loans?
> It is a bad precedent to set.
> I do agree we need to stop sending so much money to other countries.


Bro listen here.. 
I know what it is lie to pay student loans.
My wife after spending 60,000$ on her education that her father worked hard to pay for at a very good  school only to after we had kids decide to become a teacher . We  had to take 30,000$ out in loans to accomplish this. I am not bitching about paying those back.

The point I was making that with all the bullshit  money the government spends on stupid fucked up shit and I am not going to name it all. 
How bout the green new deal and build back better plan..
Take that useless and down it in something else hmmm like maybe student loans… 
Anyway what the fuck do I know.


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## 69nites (Apr 30, 2022)

white ape said:


> Disclaimer: Didn't read all the posts.
> 
> 1) College shouldn't be as expensive as it is
> 
> ...


The price is high due to the insane demand created by loans that are qualified via government backing. The majority of graduates do not work in their field of study. That's the majority of people taking out a loan for an education they do not use.

If people couldn't get a loan for useless degrees the demand drastically drops instantly and prices have to be cut to ensure full enrollment with increased scrutiny.

I'm 100% for tax subsidized higher education with conditions that you have to work in your field of study for a period of time and limiting the subsidies to what is necessary to fill the projected needs of the job market. It's not giving people something for free. It's about as a society investing in creating the best workers and improve the country's position in the global economy.


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## slicwilly2000 (Apr 30, 2022)

Why not do another stimulus package and give everyone $10k.  The people that have student loans can choose to spend it to pay off their loans while the rest of us can also get $10k and spend it on something else.  We are rewarding people that didn't make great decisions in life.  Why should the plumber that didn't go to college pay for the guy that went $150k in debt to get his gender studies degree only to become a fry cook at McDonalds?

Slic.


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## RiR0 (Apr 30, 2022)

69nites said:


> The price is high due to the insane demand created by loans that are qualified via government backing. The majority of graduates do not work in their field of study. That's the majority of people taking out a loan for an education they do not use.
> 
> If people couldn't get a loan for useless degrees the demand drastically drops instantly and prices have to be cut to ensure full enrollment with increased scrutiny.
> 
> I'm 100% for tax subsidized higher education with conditions that you have to work in your field of study for a period of time and limiting the subsidies to what is necessary to fill the projected needs of the job market. It's not giving people something for free. It's about as a society investing in creating the best workers and improve the country's position in the global economy.


What if they graduate and can’t find a job in their field of study? They’re just forced into unemployment?


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## RiR0 (Apr 30, 2022)

I just don’t think education should come with debt or a price tag.


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## BRICKS (Apr 30, 2022)

Let me see, pay for my own loans and pay for or help my kids with theirs, or pay for everyone else's for the rest if my fkn life?  Wow, tough decision.  Anybody unfavorably of this, what, not happy with the price of shit already?  Hey, I got a car that's not quite what I want.  Can somebody pay that loan off for me.  How about all the people in favor of this pay off my mortgage while we're at it.  Sorry to come a bit strong, but if you do the crime do the time mthrfkr.  Yes, I paid off my loans, and I also did time in the Navy to pay back my grad school loan.  Maybe those that want their loans forgiven should do some community service to pay that back.

Just like the guys that come on here, want to run cycles, want results now, nobody want to do the work.  

Little fired up, just finished legs and listened  all about our new "Minister of Truth". Pretty much fed up with the horseshit.


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## Redloh (Apr 30, 2022)

wsmwannabe said:


> When you took out your loans, were you unaware you had to pay them back? When you took your job, we’re you expecting loan forgiveness? Was it written anywhere, or even verbally agreed to?



Question wasn't addressed to me, but I wanted to comment on the first one as it relates to student loans in general (not the specific case wsmwannabe is referring to).

Repayment is an understood part of the arrangement, but unlike all other loans, repayment terms, rates, and monthly payment amount are NOT readily visible. The student simply goes into their school portal (same place where the add/drop classes, request transcripts, etc.) and then clicks on their accounts or financial aid tab. There's just an Accept/Deny button for the financial aid package showing this year's loans broken into fall/spring semesters. That's it.

If you want to find out what your cumulative loans are, you have to 1) figure out who your loan servicer is, which is a nightmare, 2) create and get approved for access to your account with them, and 3) view each year's loans individually.

Want to know what your current payment would be? Tough luck. Your servicer account will show $0 since you're currently enrolled. That mean's opening a loan payment calculator online (or use excel), input each loan's terms individually, and calculate. No freaking way the average 18, 19, 20 year old is doing this. Student loans should be just as transparent as regular loans so kids know what the hell they are getting into.


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## Redloh (Apr 30, 2022)

RiR0 said:


> I just don’t think education should come with debt or a price tag.


Agreed. I'm in favor of voc ed and career tracks in high school, one-time-attempt 2-year AS/AA degrees being free, select trade schools (electrical, plumbing, etc.) being free for one attempt, and BA/BS degrees, again one-attempt, being free but requiring aptitude placements to qualify. Don't qualify for a certain degree? Then for you there is a sticker price for that specific degree that is based supply/demand, or you can freely pursue the degree that you qualified for, or you can study and retake the placement until you pass (limited attempts per year to avoid blitzing and getting lucky).

Basically, higher education should be made as accessible as possible, aligned to the capability and interests of the individual, with a structured, minimally abusable way to access for those who are seriously interested.

Otherwise the U.S. will continue to fall further and further behind in STEM and debt.

I also like what @white ape said about the possibility of working a govt job for a few years and receiving a GI Bill-esque voucher for college. That's definitely something I could get behind too


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## JuiceTrain (Apr 30, 2022)




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## 69nites (Apr 30, 2022)

RiR0 said:


> What if they graduate and can’t find a job in their field of study? They’re just forced into unemployment?


Thru would be able to because the number of people getting an education to be qualified would be limited to the demands of the job market.

If there's 10 jobs coming available and 10 graduates it's a given that they will be employed.

Good unions already do this in their apprenticeship programs. Apprentices and recent journeymen are rarely out of work in well managed apprenticeships. This is mostly because the contractor will be removed from the bidding pool for apprentices if they do not provide jobs for the requested apprentices.

Working outside your field of study would be a choice, and at that point you would be liable for the cost of your education.


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## BRICKS (Apr 30, 2022)

Redloh said:


> Question wasn't addressed to me, but I wanted to comment on the first one as it relates to student loans in general (not the specific case wsmwannabe is referring to).
> 
> Repayment is an understood part of the arrangement, but unlike all other loans, repayment terms, rates, and monthly payment amount are NOT readily visible. The student simply goes into their school portal (same place where the add/drop classes, request transcripts, etc.) and then clicks on their accounts or financial aid tab. There's just an Accept/Deny button for the financial aid package showing this year's loans broken into fall/spring semesters. That's it.
> 
> ...


And if our schools actually taught useful curricula like reading, writing, math, science, and a whole bunch of basic life skills such financial management, balancing a checkbook, etc...instead of boys can be girls and all the other woke shit maybe there'd be less of a problem.


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## shackleford (Apr 30, 2022)

GSgator said:


> We told our son you make A & B’s will pay for those classes but these are pre-Rec classes in a community college . Then we made it clear once your hit a University that’s on your own. Your younger and have the time we need to focus on retirement. He want to be a structure engineer.
> 
> What pissed me off is his first 2 years of Community college IMO should have gotten done  in high school  They  let these kids fuck off in high school and when they get to college there taking BASICS . Some buckle down with like head start and get a associates in high school but most don’t there teenagers. Fuck we are paying college prices for English 2 and algebra WTF.


look into modern states. its self learning online classes for basic college courses. then you go to a college and test out of the classes. its a cheap option and highschool students can work on college courses. 

im not sure if all colleges/universities will accept it though. 

i personally found it boring. but it beats paying alot of money to listen to a stupid af psychology 101 teacher spout out fake science bullshit, and go off on random tangent about nothing related to the course, just so i can check a box on a pre req list.

yes, im bitter about the way college education is structured.


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## slicwilly2000 (Apr 30, 2022)

BRICKS said:


> And if our schools actually taught useful curricula like reading, writing, math, science, and a whole bunch of basic life skills such financial management, balancing a checkbook, etc...instead of boys can be girls and all the other woke shit maybe there'd be less of a problem.



Those are racist.  They will be phased out in the future and employers will be unhappy when their new hires are not smart enough to read a ruler.  

Slic.


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## Swiper. (Apr 30, 2022)




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## shackleford (Apr 30, 2022)

slicwilly2000 said:


> Those are racist.  They will be phased out in the future and employers will be unhappy when their new hires are not smart enough to read a ruler.
> 
> Slic.


i worked in a factory briefly on an assembly line. they gave us tape measures in our orientation and every "little line" had a fraction of an inch marked beside it. i guess they just wanted to lower the bar instead of teach a skill.

edit. just so we're clear, i can definitly read a tape measure lol


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## GSgator (Apr 30, 2022)

Swiper. said:


>


I agree college doesn’t mean shit educated ppl are a dime a dozen these days .Now 40 years ago when a fraction of the population had a degree is had more value. Matter of fact out of all my  friends the educated ones are fucking retarded and have zero logic. All there thoughts and ideas  come from what they read or hear . They are incapable of creating  their own ideas .


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## shackleford (Apr 30, 2022)

Swiper. said:


>


He's not wrong.


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## shackleford (Apr 30, 2022)

GSgator said:


> I agree college doesn’t mean shit educated ppl are a dime a dozen these days .Now 40 years ago when a fraction of the population had a degree is had more value. Matter of fact out of all friends the educated ones are
> fucking retarded and have zero logic. All there thoughts and ideas  come from what they read or hear . They are incapable of creating  their own ideas .


its because they went through the college indoctorinaton program. the final brainwashing before being set free into the world.


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## Hughinn (Apr 30, 2022)

shackleford said:


> its because they went through the college indoctorinaton program. the final brainwashing before being set free into the world.



It used to be college educated people were more intelligent. 

I wonder if that's because college recruiting was based more on merit back then. 

I remember a time when you had to pass academic tests to be accepted.  Whether you could pay or not. 

That's not the case anymore.  That makes me wonder if the problem isn't just in the declining quality of the curriculum.  But also in recruiting practice?

It's definitely obvious the college graduates today or overall less qualified than before.


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## shackleford (Apr 30, 2022)

Hughinn said:


> It used to be college educated people were more intelligent.
> 
> I wonder if that's because college recruiting was based more on merit back then.
> 
> ...


i dont know whats going on, man. Or why. I am just very unsettled by what i see happening. It seems the primary goal of higher education is no longer to educate.


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## BRICKS (May 1, 2022)

shackleford said:


> i dont know whats going on, man. Or why. I am just very unsettled by what i see happening. It seems the primary goal of higher education is no longer to educate.


That's not limited to higher education but now K-12.  My mom was a teacher for a long time, elementary and Jr. High.  She's told me when she was teaching first graders back in the early 80s she got stuff in her curriculum that gave her pause and it wasn't right to be teaching kids that young that stuff.  Mom ditched that shit and stuck with appropriate first grade material.  Proceed until apprehended.


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## shackleford (May 1, 2022)

BRICKS said:


> That's not limited to higher education but now K-12.  My mom was a teacher for a long time, elementary and Jr. High.  She's told me when she was teaching first graders back in the early 80s she got stuff in her curriculum that gave her pause and it wasn't right to be teaching kids that young that stuff.  Mom ditched that shit and stuck with appropriate first grade material.  Proceed until apprehended.


It wasn't until i was out of school and grew up a little bit, that I looked back and really appreciated the good teachers I had. You mother sounds like she was one of the good ones.


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## slicwilly2000 (May 1, 2022)

shackleford said:


> i worked in a factory briefly on an assembly line. they gave us tape measures in our orientation and every "little line" had a fraction of an inch marked beside it. i guess they just wanted to lower the bar instead of teach a skill.
> 
> edit. just so we're clear, i can definitly read a tape measure lol



I have met high school graduates that were unable to read a tape measure, that's how bad things are getting in this country.  A college degree means nothing anymore.

Slic.


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## shackleford (May 1, 2022)

slicwilly2000 said:


> I have met high school graduates that were unable to read a tape measure, that's how bad things are getting in this country.  A college degree means nothing anymore.
> 
> Slic.


I was lucky that my father taught me things. i got nothing out of shop class. my wife and i talk about homeschooling and i wish i could manage the bills without her working so she could teach our future kid. I'm just not sure its possible though.


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## 1bigun11 (May 1, 2022)

shackleford said:


> I was lucky that my father taught me things. i got nothing out of shop class. my wife and i talk about homeschooling and i wish i could manage the bills without her working so she could teach our future kid. I'm just not sure its possible though.


I hear you. The biggest issue with most families is that both parents have to work these days just to survive. The problem is that schools suck at teaching and suck even more at parenting and many people are stuck with letting the schools do both for their kids for lack of other options.


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## Janoy Cresva (May 1, 2022)

Dex said:


> It sure feels like it. The entire system is flawed. Overpaid athletes, underpaid healthcare workers. Everyone feels they deserve a tip for doing their easy job these days but the people who actually deserve tips don't get them. It is pretty sad.


This better not be a shot at bartenders you little bish. Come to my bar with that attitude and I'll run your beer through the dishwasher first


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## IHI (May 1, 2022)

Don’t see trade school students whining about having the rest of the country paying off their debt….but I think alot of that is because trade schools train them to start a career vs universities enddoctrinating kids to make them feel like victims and the world owes them


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## DeplorableCracker (May 1, 2022)

Cronus said:


> How do so many hardworking Americans support wars that just get our boys killed for no benefit to us?
> 
> How do so many hardworking American support corporate subsides that don't benefit the workers?
> 
> ...



Good take and I agree. Did you know the dollar is worth so little now that it was literally easier to purchase a house during the great depression than it is now? There’s not a family out there living in a halfway decent house in the suburbs where both parents aren’t working…Mine included. For every dumbass kid getting a bullshit degree, there is a good kid with a good degree saddled with debt for the rest of his life so jew bankers can rub their palms together basking in the glory that they will never be able to start a strong, nuclear family. Fuck this and fuck them.end foreign aid completely and wipe the debt clean for all i care.

p.s. I’m not some deadbeat, whiny millenial. I’m a 44 year old gen x software engineer with a sick wife, struggling to get by in a middle of the road house that some boomer could have gotten as a greeter at walmart 40 years ago.


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## DeplorableCracker (May 1, 2022)

Hughinn said:


> Sorry I offended you.
> 
> I really am trying to understand why this is a thing.
> 
> ...


Okay ask me.

If you’re this upset about helping the future generations of this country, but not equally as upset about sending hundreds of billions of dollars to Ukraine, which is a cesspool of deep state money laundering, and child trafficking ( hey, at least Zelensky got a 50 million dollar house in West Palm)…OR….billions of dollars to Israel every year so they can fund a giant wall around their country and fucking laser beam defense systems to protect their ethno state, while they simultaneously push anti-white policies here and flooding us with immigrants….OR the hundreds of billions of dollars we send to (Enter Country Name that Hates Us Here)…. Etc. Etc. Then I don’t know what to tell ya.


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## GSgator (May 1, 2022)

IHI said:


> Don’t see trade school students whining about having the rest of the country paying off their debt….but I think alot of that is because trade schools train them to start a career vs universities enddoctrinating kids to make them feel like victims and the world owes them


Most trade schools up here are a contract thru your union. You have to follow thru and give them so long when you complete it. If you fail out or you are to  dumb to Journey out . You do owe them but I don’t know how anybody else would be stuck with that bill.

Maybe the technical colleges you might be onto something there and your right you start making money. You still have to learn the shit those book dont do much. You can read books on how to bend  pipe all day until you get out in the field and start bending   it you don’t know nothing. I worked with a guy that did  some time let’s call it Bates tech college and to be honest since he was not in the trades. He could not pick up any or retain any information. When you’re going to school for a trade that you’re working at all day you know what your teachers are talking about and you can constantly learn that stuff at at work as well. I have apprentices always asking me questions and some of the shit I really don’t know because you only learned it in school. 
So even with the technical college if you’re in a trade you still need to get on job hours it’s best to go to school while you’re working in that trade .


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## GSgator (May 1, 2022)

Your best bet is a apprenticeship program if you want to master a trade. If you wanna work on jukeboxes or radio equipment stuff like that then go to technical college. A tech college won’t give you a journeyman card. That is by completing on the job hours sign by affidavits through your state then for a skilled trade you must pass the state exam. So if you go through a two year technical college. You’re coming out and you’re just as green as fuck as the guy who’s out there on his very first day.


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## notsoswoleCPA (May 1, 2022)

Oh, and my opinion on the whole student loan forgiveness thing is that they politicians are doing it to essentially buy votes from a certain base.  You know, the young who are in student loan debt up to their eyeballs...


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## GSgator (May 1, 2022)

notsoswoleCPA said:


> Oh, and my opinion on the whole student loan forgiveness thing is that they politicians are doing it to essentially buy votes from a certain base.  You know, the young who are in student loan debt up to their eyeballs...



The plus side is maybe these young adults could afford to buy homes. Buying a home and raising a family is the American dream and that’s been taken away from so many. 

IMO if people owned more homes and the vast population wasn’t renting  this country would be a lot more stable. It’s easy to manipulate people when they don’t really see good futures ahead  but I’m sure this is what they want .


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## DeplorableCracker (May 1, 2022)

GSgator said:


> Your best bet is a apprenticeship program if you want to master a trade. If you wanna work on jukeboxes or radio equipment stuff like that then go to technical college. A tech college won’t give you a journeyman card. That is by completing on the job hours sign by affidavits through your state then for a skilled trade you must pass the state exam. So if you go through a two year technical college. You’re coming out and you’re just as green as fuck as the guy who’s out there on his very first day.


True. I was making good money as a journeyman roofer before I went to school in my 30’s. I lucked out, knew all the right guys and only apprenticed for less then a year before taking the test and getting my card. One day I looked around and saw that all the old guys could barely walk and decided to go another route.

And don’t get me wrong i totally agree that universities are giant indoctrination  camps. I would literally write papers that I didn’t even believe just to appease liberal professors. I just think it’s time to start placing the blame where it belongs and not on 18 year old, impressionable kids getting garbage crammed down their throats at every turn.

And yes their are plenty of kids getting garbage ass degrees, but just on my street are kids getting engineering, finance, chemistry etc. and they’re gonna have to live with their parents til they’re 40. Its fucking absurd.


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## Swiper. (May 1, 2022)




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## GSgator (May 1, 2022)

The left is good at creating issues then having the solutions to fix them . If you look at that way you can see right thru the bullshit. Every major issue we have today has been artificially created by the government. I heard the economy is done 1.6% and for that to happen coming out of a shut down really takes alot of effort these are all issues purposely created but now they can’t fix it because they truly have no clue what their  doing.


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## GSgator (May 1, 2022)

Yes, The Left Lost Its Mind | Ep. 1484
					

Elon Musk tweets that the Left has gotten more radical, and the media are enraged; America is now one quarter away from recession; and the Biden administration continues to pursue insane economic poli




					rumble.com


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## Dex (May 2, 2022)

Janoy Cresva said:


> This better not be a shot at bartenders you little bish. Come to my bar with that attitude and I'll run your beer through the dishwasher first


No, I was a server during my undergraduate studies. I was speaking of every damn counter having a tip jar and every receipt or transaction having a tip calculator. FFS, most places here including our McDonalds starts at $18/hr and they want tips on top of it just for pushing a few keys while taking your order.


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## Redloh (May 2, 2022)

GSgator said:


> Your best bet is a apprenticeship program if you want to master a trade. If you wanna work on jukeboxes or radio equipment stuff like that then go to technical college. A tech college won’t give you a journeyman card. That is by completing on the job hours sign by affidavits through your state then for a skilled trade you must pass the state exam. So if you go through a two year technical college. You’re coming out and you’re just as green as fuck as the guy who’s out there on his very first day.


Not disagreeing with you, just adding some more flavor. Tech college for the traditional trades (residential anything, commercial/industrial electrician, pipe fitter, welder/machinist, etc.) is pretty bunk. OJT and apprenticeships definitely win. But for some of the arguably more lucrative and book-smarts heavy things (I'm not saying traditional tradesmen are not intelligent!) like electro-mechanical, automation/PLCs, turbine tech, NDT tech, etc., I'd say tech schools offer a high benefit:cost ratio relative to the time spent trying to learn on the job from an old-timer.

I did the latter route, and though I learned a wealth of tricks and skills on the job from some brilliant self-taught folks, it was painful. Maybe 1 in 10 of the guys I trained with back in the day understood any of the technical fundamentals, which greatly hindered their teaching and troubleshooting ability. After completing my degree, I really wished I had done it in the tech school > on the job as technician > BS engineering route to save time.

On another note, Germany has a very robust apprenticeship infrastructure that is like a combo tech school + traditional apprenticeship here. Our country could learn a thing or two...


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