# Do you chase the "pump"?



## DocDePanda187123 (Jan 8, 2016)

I am a powerlifter. I am a disciple of POB. My workload has precious little room for chasing the pump in training. For as long as I can remember, I've never truly believed the pump was that important for either type of muscular hypertrophy, namely, sarcoplasmic and myofibrillar. Sure back in my younger days I liked getting a pump simply for the way it made me look immediately after and I have masochistic tendencies so I used to hammer the volume to get the pump. Regardless though, I never viewed it as anything to get too concerned over as reading so many objective and evidence based research told me it was a primarily waste of time (especially considering I always wanted to train for athleticism, strength, power, etc). 

I was reviewing some papers written by one of my favorite authors, Vladimir Zatsiorsky, Ph.D., and came across the following quote:



> Except for very special cases, when the aim of heavy resistance training is to achieve body weight gains, athletes are interested myofibrillar hypertrophy. Training must be organized in a manner to stimulate synthesis of contractile protein and to increase filament muscle density.
> 
> It is assumed that exercise activates protein catabolism (break down of muscle proteins) creatine conditions for the enhanced synthesis of contractile proteins during the rest period (break down and build up theory). During the strength exercise, muscle proteins are forcefully converted into more simple substances (breaking down); during restitution (anabolic phase) the synthesis of muscle proteins is vitalized. Fiber hypertrophy is considered to be a supercompensation of muscle proteins.
> 
> ...



Note the red highlighted part that the pump is not what triggers protein synthesis. Not only that, but it's also been known for years! Of course Zatsiorsky isn't the only person to touch on this but seeing as he is one of the greats, is an expert on biomechanics, training of athletes, etc, and he has performed some of the most important research in this field I chose to use him as the main reference in this post. 

My question, and hope for discussion, is do you chase the pump in the gym or do you largely ignore it? And why or why not? What do you think the pump does for you in terms of your goals that you cannot get from other training methods? How much importance do you place in the pump? Let's hear your guys' thoughts!


Cliff notes: the damned commies are debunking bro-tological BBing myths!!!!!!


Ref: INTENSITY OF STRENGTH TRAINING FACTS AND THEORY: RUSSIAN AND EASTERN EUROPEAN APPROACH
Vladmir M. Zatsiorsky, Ph.D.
Biomechanics Lab The Pennsylvania State University, University Park, Pennsylvania and Central Institute of Physical Culture-Moscow, Russia


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## monster-ish (Jan 8, 2016)

I don't ever chase the pump. I always train for strength. High weight lower reps. But I am able to achieve the pump doing this type of training any ways. Maybe it is because I do hit style training? Very short breaks in between sets. I'm not sure but I always have a massive pump after training a group of muscles. I never really believed in chasing the pump to get size. Training heavy to me is the ultimate size gainer. Nice read bro!


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## Uncle manny (Jan 8, 2016)

I start off pretty heavy(myofibrilur) then move into moderate weight 8-12 reps(sarcoplasmic) and then I'll finish the work out with a pump exercise or 2 maybe a few drop sets or supersets or just a few sets of 15-20 reps focusing on the squeeze. I think there is some benefit to doing this towards the end of the work out flush the muscle with blood, little endurance training. But I'd say the best way to go at hypertrophy, in my experience at least, is to use weight that's challenging. Also we have 3 types of muscle fibers type 1, 2, and 2x. I believe it's best focus on going after those type 2's and a maybe little bit of type 1.


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## thqmas (Jan 8, 2016)

One of my favorite books is Zatsiorskys' Science and Practice of Strength Training.

Notice that he says: "...does not, in itself, lead to the activation of protein synthesis.", which I think means that it may be a factor when used correctly with other factors.

For me, I never "chase the pump". Let's say that I get a pump in my bicep. The next day, I actually feel that my bicep have diminished in size. Don't know why...

I always presumed that real growth comes in correlation to some nervous system stimulation.

It may be old school and wrong, but I'm still a great believer in the "milo of croton" way, you eat properly, you lift heavier day by day, you grow.

Of course, for the more advanced, it can be week by week, months or years, depending on your bulks and periodization. Don't need to go linear like milo from some point.


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## ECKSRATED (Jan 8, 2016)

A pump is a good indicator that your hitting the right muscles I guess. If your training for bodybuilding purposes then a pump is will let u know if your hitting your intended muscle during certain exercises. With that being said I've never thought the pump is a indicator of a muscle growing. Hitting those muscle with heavy weights is what's gonna make them grow. 

My cocks been getting pumped with blood for years and is still only 3 inches.


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## thqmas (Jan 8, 2016)

Try banging heavier chicks


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## Redrum1327 (Jan 8, 2016)

ECKSRATED said:


> A pump is a good indicator that your hitting the right muscles I guess. If your training for bodybuilding purposes then a pump is will let u know if your hitting your intended muscle during certain exercises. With that being said I've never thought the pump is a indicator of a muscle growing. Hitting those muscle with heavy weights is what's gonna make them grow.
> 
> My cocks been getting pumped with blood for years and is still only 3 inches.



so you know your getting the pump and hitting all the right muscles on a daily basis then , Snake has turned you for good now i knew it !!!!


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## ToolSteel (Jan 8, 2016)

I don't chase the pump. The pump chases me. In my ****ing back.


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## PillarofBalance (Jan 8, 2016)

Doc you are familiar with my day 4.  For most I suggest just enough work for a pump.  Not for protein synthesis but for joint health. Moving fresh blood in can bring relief to the joints. 

I think the pump and hypertrophy have been a causation without correlation kind of thing. Guys saw muscle growth after getting a pump. Doesn't mean pump caused it.


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## DF (Jan 8, 2016)

A few hypotheses, popular among coaches 20 to 30 years ago but completely disregarded today, include:

1. The blood over-circulation hypothesis suggests that increased blood circulation in working muscles is the triggering stimulus for muscle growth. One of the most popular methods of body building training, called flushing, is based on this assumption. It has been shown, however, that active muscle hyperemization (i.e. increase in the quantity of blood flowing through a muscle) *caused by physical therapeutic means *does not, in itself, lead to the activation of protein synthesis.

What is meant by what I have on bold?  Was this done by external application of heat?  Hot packs? electronic muscle stimulation? or is he talking about actual work done by the muscle to cause increased blood flow?


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## trodizzle (Jan 8, 2016)

I chase the pump simply for how my body looks when I have one. Veins popping, swole feeling, it's a nice feeling to a narcissist.


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## DocDePanda187123 (Jan 8, 2016)

ECKSRATED said:


> A pump is a good indicator that your hitting the right muscles I guess. If your training for bodybuilding purposes then a pump is will let u know if your hitting your intended muscle during certain exercises. With that being said I've never thought the pump is a indicator of a muscle growing. Hitting those muscle with heavy weights is what's gonna make them grow.
> 
> My cocks been getting pumped with blood for years and is still only 3 inches.



The penis isn't a muscle but what's important is that you're trying to make me a happier "partner"


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## DocDePanda187123 (Jan 8, 2016)

PillarofBalance said:


> Doc you are familiar with my day 4.  For most I suggest just enough work for a pump.  Not for protein synthesis but for joint health. Moving fresh blood in can bring relief to the joints.
> 
> I think the pump and hypertrophy have been a causation without correlation kind of thing. Guys saw muscle growth after getting a pump. Doesn't mean pump caused it.



Not as much as I should be lol. For most of the training leading up to my meet you had me skip day 4 bc of the elbow/forearm issues I had. 

You bring up a good point about the joints. Do you attribute this to the pump and blood flow, strengthening the muscles around the joint, a mixture of both?


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## DocDePanda187123 (Jan 8, 2016)

DF said:


> A few hypotheses, popular among coaches 20 to 30 years ago but completely disregarded today, include:
> 
> 1. The blood over-circulation hypothesis suggests that increased blood circulation in working muscles is the triggering stimulus for muscle growth. One of the most popular methods of body building training, called flushing, is based on this assumption. It has been shown, however, that active muscle hyperemization (i.e. increase in the quantity of blood flowing through a muscle) *caused by physical therapeutic means *does not, in itself, lead to the activation of protein synthesis.
> 
> What is meant by what I have on bold?  Was this done by external application of heat?  Hot packs? electronic muscle stimulation? or is he talking about actual work done by the muscle to cause increased blood flow?



It's hard to tell with the Russians bc they don't cite a lot of their references and work. 

A case could be made for either.


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## DF (Jan 8, 2016)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> It's hard to tell with the Russians bc they don't cite a lot of their references and work.
> 
> A case could be made for either.



Way back when I was taking Physical therapy.  We studied the application of different types of electronic muscle stimulation.  Kinda like a tens unit on da juice using AC current.  There is a method called Russian stimulation that operated I think it was 2000-2500Hz.  This hurtz range was supposed to promote muscle hypertrophy.  You pretty much just apply current to the muscle to cause a strong muscle contraction.  I'm sure there are quite a few studies out there on it.  I highly doubt that it will cause any significant muscle hypertorphy in the trained individual.  However, I could see more of an application with paralysis or muscle wasting diseases.


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## DieYoungStrong (Jan 8, 2016)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> Not as much as I should be lol. For most of the training leading up to my meet you had me skip day 4 bc of the elbow/forearm issues I had.
> 
> You bring up a good point about the joints. Do you attribute this to the pump and blood flow, strengthening the muscles around the joint, a mixture of both?



According to King Louie, joints/tendons are strengthened by extremely high reps...which is why we do stuff like banded tricep pushdowns for 100 reps at the end of bench days - as an example.


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## Dex (Jan 8, 2016)

I like feeling the "pump". However, it doesn't always happen and feels anticlimactic when I can't get it.


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## trodizzle (Jan 8, 2016)




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## ToolSteel (Jan 8, 2016)

DieYoungStrong said:


> According to King Louie, joints/tendons are strengthened by extremely high reps...which is why we do stuff like banded tricep pushdowns for 100 reps at the end of bench days - as an example.


High reps and equipoise


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## PillarofBalance (Jan 8, 2016)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> Not as much as I should be lol. For most of the training leading up to my meet you had me skip day 4 bc of the elbow/forearm issues I had.
> 
> You bring up a good point about the joints. Do you attribute this to the pump and blood flow, strengthening the muscles around the joint, a mixture of both?



My own hypothesis has something to do with the fascia stretch helping to relieve hypertonicity which lessens the constant strain on the tendons which reduces inflammation.  The additional blood flow and contractions also help bring in fresh supplies for healing and remove the debris.


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## DF (Jan 8, 2016)

Blood flow is an important part of muscle growth & repair ? No?  Sure blood flow it self is not going to stimulate hypertrophy.


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## DocDePanda187123 (Jan 8, 2016)

DieYoungStrong said:


> According to King Louie, joints/tendons are strengthened by extremely high reps...which is why we do stuff like banded tricep pushdowns for 100 reps at the end of bench days - as an example.



Yes, I was wondering as to the actual mechanism of action. Is it the pump that does this or is the pump just a by product? I'm just curious by nature and would like to hear both sides.


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## DocDePanda187123 (Jan 8, 2016)

PillarofBalance said:


> My own hypothesis has something to do with the fascia stretch helping to relieve hypertonicity which lessens the constant strain on the tendons which reduces inflammation.  The additional blood flow and contractions also help bring in fresh supplies for healing and remove the debris.



By debris you mean metabolic by products right?


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## DocDePanda187123 (Jan 8, 2016)

DF said:


> Blood flow is an important part of muscle growth & repair ? No?  Sure blood flow it self is not going to stimulate hypertrophy.



No, my question, maybe worded wrong in the OP, is it a direct benefit, indirect, are there better ways to make use of training time and recovery abilities, how much should one focus on the pump if hey do, etc.


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## DF (Jan 8, 2016)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> No, my question, maybe worded wrong in the OP, is it a direct benefit, indirect, are there better ways to make use of training time and recovery abilities, how much should one focus on the pump if hey do, etc.



Ah, gotcha

My thought and training style has changed a bit over the years.  I will say I used to chase that pump.  It felt pretty damn good.  Meaning that my whole workout was based on feeling that pump.  Now, if I were to shoot for that it would be on my last exercise of that muscle group.  For example a light bi curl with slow reps & squeezing thoughout or while doing light flies for chest & high reps.


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## MrRippedZilla (Jan 8, 2016)

I think its unwise to completely discount the "pump" as a contributor to muscle growth until we have a better understanding of the underlying mechanisms, which we don't right now. 

There is some data indicating protein synthesis does actually occur as a result of cellular swelling in muscle fibres:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9457175

There are theories suggesting cellular swelling causes an increase in satellite cell proliferation:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10683092

We know metabolic stress is a contributor to growth and pump training certainly leads to this through lactate accumulation amongst other things.... 
IMO increased glycogen storage capacity can also lead to enhanced growth and cellular swelling certainly causes this....

I'm not saying its a primary contributor or that people should be "chasing the pump" in the gym. 
I just think we should hold our horses before completely discounting its contribution to growth - I wouldn't be surprised if this turns out to be one of those things bros knew for years and science is simply playing catch up.


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## Seeker (Jan 8, 2016)




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## trodizzle (Jan 8, 2016)

I chase the pump alright...


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## NbleSavage (Jan 8, 2016)

If "pump chasing" can be extended to include days which focus on high volume, lighter weight, contraction-focused isolation training then I'm guilty.

Anecdotally, I saw an increase in size in my lower body when I incorporated this approach in addition to strength-centric training. 

In practice, I run a 5-3-1 style program for squats on one day, later in the week I do iso work (leg extensions...yes dammit, leg extensions...seated leg curls, single leg press work, even some abductor work). Similar for chest: bench press using 5-3-1 and later do volume work with dumbbells, dips, flies and hammer strength machine.

I'm not a competitive PL so my training allows for this kind of flexibility. If I were training to get on the platform again, I would likely lose the volume days. As it is, I look forward to those days as active recovery.

I tend to agree with RippedZilla that "pump" may not directly cause growth but may be a contributing factor.

YMMV.


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## DocDePanda187123 (Jan 8, 2016)

DF said:


> Ah, gotcha
> 
> My thought and training style has changed a bit over the years.  I will say I used to chase that pump.  It felt pretty damn good.  Meaning that my whole workout was based on feeling that pump.  Now, if I were to shoot for that it would be on my last exercise of that muscle group.  For example a light bi curl with slow reps & squeezing thoughout or while doing light flies for chest & high reps.



I'd personally agree with this. If the "pump" does indeed have some minor benefits then it should be used in accordance with how much benefit it provides. We know other factors play much larger roles so pump training shouldn't be the sole or primary focus. It seems to be with many people though.


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## DocDePanda187123 (Jan 8, 2016)

MrRippedZilla said:


> I think its unwise to completely discount the "pump" as a contributor to muscle growth until we have a better understanding of the underlying mechanisms, which we don't right now.
> 
> There is some data indicating protein synthesis does actually occur as a result of cellular swelling in muscle fibres:
> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9457175
> ...



I was hoping youd chime in! Great points btw. 

Brad Schoenfeld has an entire article about how the pump may benefit hypertrophy but it's been too long since I read it and forget the details and mechanisms he talks about.  

Now cellular swelling in muscle fibers and satellite cells have shown benefit I agree. Is the pump the only way to elicit cellular swelling? Are there other methods that maybe are more effective or efficient?


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## DocDePanda187123 (Jan 8, 2016)

NbleSavage said:


> If "pump chasing" can be extended to include days which focus on high volume, lighter weight, contraction-focused isolation training then I'm guilty.
> 
> Anecdotally, I saw an increase in size in my lower body when I incorporated this approach in addition to strength-centric training.
> 
> ...



Volume is critically important to PL Nble! To paraphrase Mike Tuchscherer, "intensity determines the training effect and volume determines the magnitude of that effect". I'm guessing you mean the "high volume, lighter weight, contraction-focused isolation training" you do?


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## NbleSavage (Jan 8, 2016)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> Volume is critically important to PL Nble! To paraphrase Mike Tuchscherer, "intensity determines the training effect and volume determines the magnitude of that effect". I'm guessing you mean the "*high volume, lighter weight, contraction-focused isolation training*" you do?



Nailed it.


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## MrRippedZilla (Jan 8, 2016)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> Now cellular swelling in muscle fibers and satellite cells have shown benefit I agree. Is the pump the only way to elicit cellular swelling? Are there other methods that maybe are more effective or efficient?



Various strategies based around the glycogen super compensation effect.

Plenty of recomp strategies (Duchaine's Bodyopus for example) are based around the idea of timing low carb/cal days to go with mod-high rep work (to deplete but still induce tension) and then saving the low rep/strength work for after the carb load to take advantage of the fact that your nice & full. 
Incorporating other techniques like drop sets in the right way (my HIIRT routine for example) can accomplish something similar.
Creatine can do it though to a lesser degree.
Compounds like DNP & Insulin may be useful - don't ask me about how it could be implemented since I've been going back & forth about it in my own mind for a while now


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## saltylifter (Jan 10, 2016)

When I train for powerlifting I'll go through my lifting routine but then I will do a couple sets that gets the blood into the muscle and I get that pump. 
I love the pump feeling. Leaving the gym with that muscle tearing look.


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