# Tren sides less with enanthate?



## FreeBirdSam (Jun 23, 2014)

I've read of a few guys having less sides (or more manageable) with a longer ester compared to acetate.  I'm about to blast some tren-e,  test, and may kickstart with some drol.  I've never tried tren-e, but dealt fine with the sides of ace. Just didn't like my ast/alt levels while on it..  I'm prepared this run with a boatload of NAC, But I'm curious how my insomnia may be this time..

Thoughts?


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## Bro Bundy (Jun 23, 2014)

never did A so i cant talk on that..but E was fine 600mg by week 12 i need a break ..it got crazy on me..great results..if u can do A i see no reason not to try E..I never got a cough just some night sweats and the usual tren sides like limp dick and feeling like shit mean as fuk..I find masteron helps alot with tren..infact ill never run tren without mast


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## Bro Bundy (Jun 23, 2014)

at 400 mg no sides..past that it gets hairy for me


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## IWannaGetBig (Jun 23, 2014)

cut out the carbs at night..you'll find it helps to decrease the sweats.


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## ECKSRATED (Jun 23, 2014)

One time i had the absolute worst sides ever on tren e. Then ran ace and had zero sides.Then ran e again and had zero sides . Every cycle can be different when it comes to sides. Only way to find out is to try it.


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## RowdyBrad (Jun 23, 2014)

I had no real difference on a or e. I pinned eod with both.


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## NbleSavage (Jun 23, 2014)

IWannaGetBig said:


> cut out the carbs at night..you'll find it helps to decrease the sweats.



This works for me too. When I run Tren, I try to keep me last meal to protein & fat.


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## woodswise (Jun 23, 2014)

Brother Bundy said:


> at 400 mg no sides..past that it gets hairy for me



^^^^^ This


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## losieloos (Jun 23, 2014)

Tren A is more pure and stronger.


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## hulksmash (Jun 23, 2014)

I've only done Tren E. 300-650mg (I want to say I did 700mg, but memory is fuzzy with that dosage).

-No cough.
-night sweats. Towel needed.
-ridiculously high libido and erections (people actually get limp with it??)
-increased irritability
-great fat loss
-great strength
-horrible for gaining large amounts of mass

For me, tren is overrated due to sides vs results.

I lost more fat and gained far more size in the same amount of time with 1.5-2g of test WITHOUT any of the specified side effects.

I want to give tren another chance, but at 800mg-1g.


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## Get Some (Jun 23, 2014)

lots of bad advice/statements in this thread lol

if you run a lower dose of t3 while on tren the night sweats/insomnia will be minimized


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## don draco (Jun 23, 2014)

I'd argue that tren is actually great for putting on muscle mass.  The mass gains just aren't as evident b/c it won't make you hold water & also seems to diminish fat gain in a caloric surplus.  Therefore, the majority of the weight you'll gain from tren is muscle.. and considering that significant muscle mass gains happen relatively slowly over long periods of time, it's no wonder that tren may be viewed as a 'horrible mass gainer.' Although this depends on what kind of 'mass' you're aiming for.  I could easily gain 20-30 lbs within the next few months on DDT.. but that doesn't mean that I've gained 20-30 lbs of muscle.  Strip away the fat and the water gain from that cycle & I doubt the total muscle mass gains would be much superior ( if superior at all ) to a cycle containing tren.  

As for the original question, the only way to know how it'll affect you is to give it a shot.  Maybe start low, at around 300 mg, and increase the dose as you see fit.  I kicked tren E with tren A and I was fine. 300/150 pw respectively.   The only sides I had were sweating and irritability.. nothing changed when I dropped the tren A.  If you were able to manage tren A, I doubt you'll have problems with tren E. But as I said, only one way to find out!


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## Seeker (Jun 23, 2014)

I ran both A and E and noticed no difference in side effects or potency. I really had none in terms of visible sides.  I did though have a one time tren cough with the A and I m gonna guess its because I pinned to quickly.  However, the esters A and E of tren basically serve to alter the release rate and half-life of the hormone. They do not alter the strenth, or potency of the drug.


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## FreeBirdSam (Jun 23, 2014)

Thank you guys, once again I find myself always learning here and I love it.  You guys rock!


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## don draco (Jun 23, 2014)

Seeker said:


> I ran both A and E and noticed no difference in side effects or potency. I really had none in terms of visible sides.  I did though have a one time tren cough with the A and I m gonna guess its because I pinned to quickly.  However, the esters A and E of tren basically serve to alter the release rate and half-life of the hormone. They do not alter the strenth, or potency of the drug.




I think the potency claims come from the fact that people often compare equivalent amounts of each ester ( ie. 400 mg tren E vs. 400 mg tren A ), but fail to acknowledge that the acetate ester (~83 mg available per 100 mg) provides more available hormone per mg than the enanthate ester (~68 mg available per 100 mg). A more appropriate comparison would be 400 mg Tren A vs. 490 mg Tren E. 

Combine that with the fact that the results from tren A appear almost instantaneously while w/ tren E they're more gradual, and it's no surprise that people believe that tren A is 'more potent' .. although that simply isn't the case.


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## Bro Bundy (Jun 23, 2014)

Get Some said:


> lots of bad advice/statements in this thread lol
> 
> if you run a lower dose of t3 while on tren the night sweats/insomnia will be minimized


what bad advice are u talking about..and why not correct them then?


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## GreatGunz (Jun 23, 2014)

I ran tren E by week 9 I was a mental basket case it hit hard (@600) by week 10-11 I dropped it.
I ran tren A and absolutely loved it ran it out to 14 weeks (@500) I ate whatever I wanted and was still shreading fat like a machine.
Ill try tren E again things were stressful for me when I ran it @ that time.


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## ECKSRATED (Jun 23, 2014)

Get Some said:


> lots of bad advice/statements in this thread lol
> 
> if you run a lower dose of t3 while on tren the night sweats/insomnia will be minimized


what's bad about it? People are giving their experiences with tren. How is that bad?


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## ECKSRATED (Jun 23, 2014)

Brother Bundy said:


> what bad advice are u talking about..and why not correct them then?



I Shoulda read page 2 before I posted.


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## Get Some (Jun 23, 2014)

losieloos said:


> Tren A is more pure and stronger.



Bundy would like for me to be a dick, so here goes...

this statement couldn't be further from the truth losie.... it's possible you meant something else but this comes across as tren A actually being more "pure" which could never be the case. Purity is a supplier issue, not an issue of which compound you are using. 

Also, it is not stronger, it just kicks in much quicker and the levels are a bit more volatile so it may appear stronger than Tren E. However, I assure you it is not.


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## Get Some (Jun 23, 2014)

hulksmash said:


> I've only done Tren E. 300-650mg (I want to say I did 700mg, but memory is fuzzy with that dosage).
> 
> -No cough.
> -night sweats. Towel needed.
> ...



Again, I've been requested to be an asshole so I'll try my best...

The sentence I have highlighted from your original post is literally one of the dumbest things I have ever heard in my entire life. Not a fukking chance in hell you would cut more fat with your arbitrary and largely varied doses of test vs a healthy amount of tren. 

You give a huge range (300-650mg) and then say you think it may have been 700... this makes perfect sense.

"horrible for gaining large amounts of mass" - why would you use tren to gain large amounts of mass? Can you honestly say that you were using a similar dose of test close to what you normally run during this, or was it all tren? 

The only sides you mention are night sweats and increased irritability yet you say it improves libido and sexual performance and is "Great" for fat loss and strength... then you go on to say that it sucks compared to test. It cannot both be great and suck. Also, I just don't believe all the factors were the same in those 2 cycles to have warranted the comment you made.

Please give tren another shot... but only if you want to recomp or cut up. Use deca and test if you want to bulk. For everyone else out there, don't pay attention to the high doses, tren is best served at lower doses in a cutting cycle

Bundy and ECKS... is that better? You guys get so insecure when someone mentions something without naming exactly who they are talking about. Chill out, proceed with your comments on the thread (of which I liked both of yours) and everything will be cool? 

The bottom line is if you look like you don't know what you are talking about or if you have your facts laid out like a jigsaw puzzle on an ant hill, it's really hard to count you as reputable and follow your story. I'm all for people participating, just put a little more effort in guys!!

For the record... I don't EVER get mad, this was simply an exercise


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## coltmc4545 (Jun 23, 2014)

My experience is that I have more sides on short esters then I do long esters, this includes prop, and npp, not just ace. It has nothing to do with more potency or whatever. I think it has to do with how quickly SE peak in the blood stream vs LE. That's the only logical thing I can think that would cause me more sides.


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## Bro Bundy (Jun 23, 2014)

Get Some said:


> Bundy would like for me to be a dick, so here goes...
> 
> this statement couldn't be further from the truth losie.... it's possible you meant something else but this comes across as tren A actually being more "pure" which could never be the case. Purity is a supplier issue, not an issue of which compound you are using.
> 
> Also, it is not stronger, it just kicks in much quicker and the levels are a bit more volatile so it may appear stronger than Tren E. However, I assure you it is not.



thank you sir!


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## Bro Bundy (Jun 23, 2014)

Get Some said:


> Again, I've been requested to be an asshole so I'll try my best...
> 
> The sentence I have highlighted from your original post is literally one of the dumbest things I have ever heard in my entire life. Not a fukking chance in hell you would cut more fat with your arbitrary and largely varied doses of test vs a healthy amount of tren.
> 
> ...



I like shit like this GS u have years of experience..if u see something is off color always do your thing


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## Get Some (Jun 24, 2014)

Bundy, you know me too well my friend!


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## ECKSRATED (Jun 24, 2014)

Sorry get some I honestly didn't even comprehend tthose two posts. Must of skimmed over both of them .


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## ECKSRATED (Jun 24, 2014)

Bottom line is every cycle can be good or bad whether u ran the compound 35 times with no sides. Shit happens.


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## Get Some (Jun 24, 2014)

ECKSRATED said:


> Sorry get some I honestly didn't even comprehend tthose two posts. Must of skimmed over both of them .



No problem buddy, you are a good bro


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## Bro Bundy (Jun 24, 2014)

for me tren is a recomp cutting steroid imo..


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## ECKSRATED (Jun 24, 2014)

I gained 32 pounds on a 6 weeks cycle of tren one time.


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## Bro Bundy (Jun 24, 2014)

ECKSRATED said:


> I gained 32 pounds on a 6 weeks cycle of tren one time.



thats amazing...I did have more of a cutting diet when i used it..hard to eat on that shit man..deca i gained close to 30.Im just gonna use tren to cut..see how we are all different ..thats why everyone should share the experience and hold nothing back


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## ECKSRATED (Jun 24, 2014)

I was joking bundy.

my first run with tren I had the terrible anxiety and loss of appetite and insomnia and still gained a few pounds. It was my first time and I was thinking god Damm this shit is magic if I'm only eating once a day and still getting strong as fukk and bigger. Lol but that only lasted a few weeks then I couldn't take the anxiety anymore.


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## Bro Bundy (Jun 24, 2014)

ECKSRATED said:


> I was joking bundy.
> 
> my first run with tren I had the terrible anxiety and loss of appetite and insomnia and still gained a few pounds. It was my first time and I was thinking god Damm this shit is magic if I'm only eating once a day and still getting strong as fukk and bigger. Lol but that only lasted a few weeks then I couldn't take the anxiety anymore.



ita not a easy ride..but im also sure those who can somehow eat on it will gain just fine..I gained hell of alot more size using deca..Im natty lean so i look best using drugs like dbol deca


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## ECKSRATED (Jun 24, 2014)

Oh duck yea bundy. Deca makes me.grow like a weed. Never ran dbol but If i did run it with Deca i would be about 260. Lol. **** that noise


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## Magical (Jun 24, 2014)

Gonna start a Tren A run in October. Still planning it out but excited for sure and shit


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## NbleSavage (Jun 24, 2014)

Get Some said:


> Again, I've been requested to be an asshole so I'll try my best...
> 
> The sentence I have highlighted from your original post is literally one of the dumbest things I have ever heard in my entire life. Not a fukking chance in hell you would cut more fat with your arbitrary and largely varied doses of test vs a healthy amount of tren.
> 
> ...



I don't see this kind of dialogue as being an arse (only where you intentionally did so in a bit of a satiric way  )

Like Bundy said, I support Vets calling-out what they perceive as being inaccurate info, or at least adding that what was posted was not consistent with their own experiences. 

IME, and I've run Tren A and E many times, it is best used for recomp and cutting. I've tried bulking before on Tren E but had only minimal success. As you spoke of GS, far better for me was simply Deca & Test to put on size - hence the classic "Fall-Winter Bulker" and "Spring-Summer Cutter" approach to running Deca & then Tren. 

Always share, always ask for clarification. Disagree respectfully and state your reasons for doing so (as you did here well, GS). 

Peace.

- Savage


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## woodswise (Jun 24, 2014)

To the OP. 

Your question, whether pairing Tren with Test E would be better than Test A is a good one.

I have only paired Tren with long estered Test and have never had the terrible side effects described by many.  Night sweats yes.  Anything else?  Nope.

I speculate that my experience is due to two things.  1.  longer ester test is more stable in your system if you are not pinning EOD and this stability may help avoid some of the Tren sides;  2.  I am keeping my tren at 400mg/w.  When I go above that the sides start increasing.

BTW I have been on 600mg/w Test E and 400mg/w Tren E since January and am loving it.  This is one of my all time best cycles.  And I am cutting and have lost 50 lbs whilst gaining strength at the same time!


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## hulksmash (Jun 24, 2014)

Get Some said:


> Again, I've been requested to be an asshole so I'll try my best...
> 
> The sentence I have highlighted from your original post is literally one of the dumbest things I have ever heard in my entire life. Not a fukking chance in hell you would cut more fat with your arbitrary and largely varied doses of test vs a healthy amount of tren.
> 
> ...



-I gave a huge range because that's what I used over a course of 1.5 years- 300mg, 400mg, 500mg, and 600mg. Memory is only hazy with a 700mg dose.

-I said concerning a Sides vs. results, test is better in my opinion-no sides and just as good results (in the right dosage).

-Tren at 300-600mg had the same fat loss as test over a gram..and without the sides. Thus, I said test was better.

-you just said what I said-tren is not good for gaining mass and everyone knows that or should already. You don't have to tell me todo deca and test for mass because I already know that. I wanted the uneducated to know the basic common knowledge that tren is not good for mass building and that is why I reiterated that.


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## Get Some (Jun 25, 2014)

hulksmash said:


> -I gave a huge range because that's what I used over a course of 1.5 years- 300mg, 400mg, 500mg, and 600mg. Memory is only hazy with a 700mg dose.
> 
> -I said concerning a Sides vs. results, test is better in my opinion-no sides and just as good results (in the right dosage).
> 
> ...



Thank you for clarifying the dosage range, makes sense now.. just make that clearer in the beginning, you have no idea how stupid some people are and they will start to add numbers and do weird things and end up with a ridiculous dose lol

I agree that the sides from tren for most are pretty bad, but also for most (not for you apparently) sides with high dose test can be pretty damn bad as well. 

I'll stick to what I said and say that if your diet was the same there is no chance in hell you'd get more fat loss from even 2 grams of test vs 600mg of tren. So all I'm saying is that something is not adding up. I can take 600mg of tren, eat pizza all day, and still cut ridiculous amounts of fat in a short time. This is not what I would recommend, but I could do it!

you can gain plenty of mass on tren, but as I've said and you said also, there are better things out there. My questioning was more along the lines of "who told you to run a bulker on tren in the first place?" , not so much that you were wrong about anything. 

Give tren another shot if you are ever ready to run a cutter... if you never run a cutter, more power to ya brother!


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## hulksmash (Jun 25, 2014)

Get Some said:


> Thank you for clarifying the dosage range, makes sense now.. just make that clearer in the beginning, you have no idea how stupid some people are and they will start to add numbers and do weird things and end up with a ridiculous dose lol
> 
> I agree that the sides from tren for most are pretty bad, but also for most (not for you apparently) sides with high dose test can be pretty damn bad as well.
> 
> ...



I see what you mean as well because the variable of diet was not a control group, thus it would make my premise unusable.

I actually do want to run tren again but at a gram with the same diet I'm on now. Results would be ridiculously awesome, I'm sure.


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## Get Some (Jun 25, 2014)

hulksmash said:


> I see what you mean as well because the variable of diet was not a control group, thus it would make my premise unusable.
> 
> I actually do want to run tren again but at a gram with the same diet I'm on now. Results would be ridiculously awesome, I'm sure.



Yes, I'm sure a gram of tren would be a life changing experience, just make sure you keep that e2 in check!


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## hulksmash (Jun 25, 2014)

Get Some said:


> Yes, I'm sure a gram of tren would be a life changing experience, just make sure you keep that e2 in check!



Dat dere letro! Love that shit.


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## Cooper (Jun 25, 2014)

The reason I pin A is because I always want to make sure that my body is going to go haywire on me. I would personally rather pin a few times more throughout the week rather than deal with the sides of tren for weeks on end after I come off tren E.


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## #TheMatrix (Jun 25, 2014)

Trini is going to OD on tren.


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## Bro Bundy (Jun 25, 2014)

Cooper said:


> The reason I pin A is because I always want to make sure that my body is going to go haywire on me. I would personally rather pin a few times more throughout the week rather than deal with the sides of tren for weeks on end after I come off tren E.



this is bs...u dont go on with sides for weeks end like u said...within a week u feel better.the sides are not that bad were your body will go haywire


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## ECKSRATED (Jun 25, 2014)

Brother Bundy said:


> this is bs...u dont go on with sides for weeks end like u said...within a week u feel better.the sides are not that bad were your body will go haywire


This right here. And I know from experience. 5 days and the terrible sides were gone.


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