# Winter Bulk Cycle, am I taking to much?



## BigGainz (Dec 29, 2017)

Hey what's up guys, seeking some advice and this is my third cycle.
I'm 28, 6 foot and 230 points at around 15 percent body fat
My first cycle was just Test E at 600 mg per week. My second was Test E at 600, Tren E at 400 mg per week and had a 50 mg per day dbol Kick start for 4 weeks

My goals for this cycle are to gain mass, size, and power. I really enjoyed my results from my prior cycles and this is why I'm kicking it up a notch. I plan on eating a ton of food with a minimum of 350 grams of protein per day.

So here's the cycle:

Weeks 1-12 - 1200 mg of Test E
Weeks 1-12 - 800 mg of Tren E
Weeks 1-4 - 50 mg of Dbol 
Weeks 1-4 - 100 mg of Anadrol
Every 3rd Day 1 mg of Arimidex
Also have nolvadex on hand for Anadrol sides just in case after doing some reading

Once again I'm trying to gain mass, size, and power. I've read conflicting ideas on stacking dbol and drol but want to give it a try. 

I have all these on hand and plan on starting tomorrow, does this seem like a good Cycle? I know perhaps not for a third one but I really want to push myself to the limits for the next 3 months. 

Thanks in advance for any input.


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## Seeker (Dec 29, 2017)

Good luck having any type of appetite with that cycle. Being on a  well planned surplus is key to any bulk no matter how much AAS you're taking. Ok,  What happens after?  You gonna pct? Cruise? What? How do you plan on keeping any gains you get from this blast?


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## BRICKS (Dec 29, 2017)

That's a pretty heavy cycle.  IMO you don't need that much sh*t.  Like Seeker said above, dietary surplus is the key.


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## BigGainz (Dec 29, 2017)

Seeker said:


> Good luck having any type of appetite with that cycle. Being on a  well planned surplus is key to any bulk no matter how much AAS you're taking. Ok,  What happens after?  You gonna pct? Cruise? What? How do you plan on keeping any gains you get from this blast?



I always have an appetite. I do plan on running a caloric surplus. I have to figure out what my activity level is going to be, I work in the city and was walking 6 miles minimum just between work and the gym but I'm changing job sites.

Eating 4000+ calories is no problem for me. As far as PCT I was going to run Nolva and Clomid at 40/40/20/20 and 100/100/50/50 respectively.  I can extend longer if need be. Or I could taper down the dosages and cruise, but id prefer to come off entirely. My last cycles I've lost little strength, but they havnt been as intense either.

As far as keeping gains I just kept eating heavy and working out hard and saw minimal loss. I usually was back to where I was at my peak 2-3 months pay pct.


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## Bro Bundy (Dec 29, 2017)

thats way to much gear..do u plan on going pro? good luck eating


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## BigGainz (Dec 29, 2017)

Bro Bundy said:


> thats way to much gear..do u plan on going pro? good luck eating



I really wanted to see what would happened if I doubled what I did last cycle. I honestly added the drol in as a last minute thing when I was ordering my arimidex and dbol.

From what I've read going from 500-600 mg of test to over a gram gives considerable results but going from 1 gram to 2 gives significantly diminished returns. 

I could drop the drol and dbol to 50 and 25. I'm really just testing what it'd be like. And why call be? And No I'm not pro...


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## Seeker (Dec 29, 2017)

For the most part people who run cycles like that don't pct. It's pointless. These are people who have made the choice of either competing and trying to get their pro card, or hardcore lifters who pretty much blast and cruise year long. Running a cycle of that nature just to pct after is a waste. I'm sure you do have a good appetite but you've never ran dbol/drol/ and high tren together either.  Just d rol alone is known for wrecking an appetite. But hey man, good luck.


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## SFGiants (Dec 29, 2017)

Ditch the orals they are not needed with tren

You do well with lest test and tren

You seem to like the high test in a tren cycle so why not just eat more food and do something like this

750mg Test
400mg Tren

Or

800mg Test
600mg Tren

You don't need to go far off your last cycle just more food

When you come off don't lower the damn calories too much, you will eat more on the cycle and lose a little off but will lose a lot in time fast if you lower calories too much.

AI on tren is a good idea!


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## SFGiants (Dec 29, 2017)

Seeker said:


> For the most part people who run cycles like that don't pct. It's pointless. These are people who have made the choice of either competing and trying to get their pro card, or hardcore lifters who pretty much blast and cruise year long. Running a cycle of that nature just to pct after is a waste. I'm sure you do have a good appetite but you've never ran dbol/drol/ and high tren together either.  Just d rol alone is known for wrecking an appetite. But hey man, good luck.



I hate seeing people talk run tren and recover, WTF are you kidding me!

So spot on brother.

He is too young to understand all this though!


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## BigGainz (Dec 29, 2017)

Seeker said:


> For the most part people who run cycles like that don't pct. It's pointless. These are people who have made the choice of either competing and trying to get their pro card, or hardcore lifters who pretty much blast and cruise year long. Running a cycle of that nature just to pct after is a waste. I'm sure you do have a good appetite but you've never ran dbol/drol/ and high tren together either.  Just d rol alone is known for wrecking an appetite. But hey man, good luck.



Why would running this cycle to PCT be a waste? Because holding on to the gains would be really difficult. I don't wanna cruise cause I don't want my HPTA to be compromised for the rest of my life.  Would cutting the test down a bit and maybe just running Test by itself for another 3 or 4 weeks help me to hold onto the gains?

Should I Run Test at 900 mg and Tren at 600? Cut the orals in half or just take one? I'd probably keep the drol cause I've tried dbol.  I mean I have a lot of gear and can save some for later.


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## SFGiants (Dec 29, 2017)

BigGainz said:


> Why would running this cycle to PCT be a waste? Because holding on to the gains would be really difficult. I don't wanna cruise cause I don't want my HPTA to be compromised for the rest of my life.  Would cutting the test down a bit and maybe just running Test by itself for another 3 or 4 weeks help me to hold onto the gains?
> 
> Should I Run Test at 900 mg and Tren at 600? Cut the orals in half or just take one? I'd probably keep the drol cause I've tried dbol.  I mean I have a lot of gear and can save some for later.



Don't run any orals but the ai

test 16 weeks
tren 8 weeks

In this case I think something like this

500mg test week 1 to 8
500mg tren week 1 to 8
Test 750mg week 9 to 16

Gains are kept buy food, you will not save all the tren strength if done proper you will be stronger after then prior.

Biggest mistake mad is cutting calories off too much after a blast.


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## SFGiants (Dec 29, 2017)

Well then again if your coming completely off test you may lose a lot no matter what.


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## BigGainz (Dec 29, 2017)

Was just using the orals as a Kick start while I was waiting for the long esters to kick in


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## BigGainz (Dec 29, 2017)

SFGiants said:


> Don't run any orals but the ai
> 
> test 16 weeks
> tren 8 weeks
> ...



Thank you! This was constructive and I'll consider tweaking my levels down


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## SFGiants (Dec 29, 2017)

BigGainz said:


> Was just using the orals as a Kick start while I was waiting for the long esters to kick in



I'd run tren ace rather then e brother

Ace in days not weeks!


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## SFGiants (Dec 29, 2017)

Plus the tren is so harsh you don't want harsh orals

Tren a with test started 3 weeks prior


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## BigGainz (Dec 29, 2017)

SFGiants said:


> Plus the tren is so harsh you don't want harsh orals
> 
> Tren a with test started 3 weeks prior



I already have 6 Test 300s, 5 Tren 200s, 60 25 mg dbol and 60 a bombs so I'm stuck working with what I got.

I just liked the dbol on my second cycle I felt like the strength increase was nice and I was able to keep it because I started with it


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## PillarofBalance (Dec 29, 2017)

If you keep running tren do plan on getting trt. Nobody recovered from multiple tren runs. You would be in such a tiny minority of people if you did.


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## stanley (Dec 29, 2017)

been there got the t-shirt you will NOT eat enough to bulk on high doses of tren .dont care who you are .you are in for a rough ride trust me ,on high tren and a g of test. a very rough ride....... and you will come to the same conclusion as we all have.running that high is not worth the return you get.



BB  to me is like growing herb.they dont get bigger or fatter buds if i increase the feed ,but do get fat and big when feed correctly.


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## motown1002 (Dec 29, 2017)

If it were me, I wouldn't run any orals with Tren.  If I was determined on an oral, I would sub the tren with Deca or NPP and use the dbol on weeks 1-4.  dbol, drol and tren is way too harsh to run together.  As was said, you are going to have to eat a ton and drol wrecks your appetite.  I couldn't imagine trying to eat while on tren and drol.  Anyway, good luck on whatever you decide to do.  You got a lot of good advice so far.


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## BRICKS (Dec 29, 2017)

Why not just do 800mg or a gram of test and be done with it.  I got a 25 pound gain out of 600 mg of test over twelve weeks. How much more than that do you really think you're going to get?  It really is how you eat.


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## ECKSRATED (Dec 29, 2017)

U guys can't just automatically say his appetite will be shot with that cycle. It happens to alot of guys but not everyone. My buddies run more tren and drol than that and have no problems wth eating. Now with that said, they are very lucky and a very low percent of guys who don't get those sides. 

I would Def drop the dbol. Two orals with that much tren isn't needed. Not a huge oral fan anyways. If u can handle the drol and tren then you're gonna be strong and big as fukk. Good luck man.


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## Hurt (Dec 29, 2017)

That’s a heavy cycle for sure. Ultimately you’ve cycled in the past and it’s your life so do as you wish, but you’re doubling your previous dosages so what’s next? You going to double it again? Slow and steady is my opinion...you can increase your dosages minimally while upping your food substantially and see incredible gains. You don’t want to get to the point where you have to run 2g + of compounds just to see any results. Best of luck whatever you decide to do, though.


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## SFGiants (Dec 29, 2017)

Hurt said:


> That’s a heavy cycle for sure. Ultimately you’ve cycled in the past and it’s your life so do as you wish, but you’re doubling your previous dosages so what’s next? You going to double it again? Slow and steady is my opinion...you can increase your dosages minimally while upping your food substantially and see incredible gains. You don’t want to get to the point where you have to run 2g + of compounds just to see any results. Best of luck whatever you decide to do, though.



Agree, told him about the same thing.

Add a little more aas and a lot more food.

I hate the hard gainer BS, it's food and not willing to eat PLATES full.

At my largest 270lb my meal were double, 1 order of this one order of that.

Those large ass pizza's where a cake walk to pound down, what do you mean 1 burger WTF was that lol


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## ECKSRATED (Dec 29, 2017)

SFGiants said:


> Agree, told him about the same thing.
> 
> Add a little more aas and a lot more food.
> 
> ...



You fatass &#55357;&#56834;&#55357;&#56834;&#55357;&#56834;


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## SFGiants (Dec 29, 2017)

ECKSRATED said:


> You fatass &#55357;&#56834;&#55357;&#56834;&#55357;&#56834;



Um no, lol!

feel better at 250 but think I'm going to end up 235 with boxing now.


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## ECKSRATED (Dec 30, 2017)

SFGiants said:


> Um no, lol!
> 
> feel better at 250 but think I'm going to end up 235 with boxing now.



Haha I hear ya man. 235 is still a good weight and size. I wanna drop to 220 eventually and stay there.


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## SFGiants (Dec 30, 2017)

ECKSRATED said:


> Haha I hear ya man. 235 is still a good weight and size. I wanna drop to 220 eventually and stay there.



Even at 6ft 270 was too much to carry around, walking was a chore,

Rather be able to move around and knock punk kids out then huff and puff and take an ass whoopin lol

It's was great for my squat my training as of the last 2 months have been funcational to use for bowling as I'm a pro and boxing as I'm a novice.

Boxing training is the hardest shit I have ever had to do, mentally and physically.

In Powerlifting the hardest shit for my was speed squat day, that shit is so brutal I couldn't wait to deadlift next for speed because it meant squats where done.


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## ECKSRATED (Dec 30, 2017)

SFGiants said:


> Even at 6ft 270 was too much to carry around, walking was a chore,
> 
> Rather be able to move around and knock punk kids out then huff and puff and take an ass whoopin lol
> 
> ...



Boxing training is no joke man. That's good shit that you're getting into that. And that's badass you're a pro bowler. You think you're done competing for good in PLing?


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## SFGiants (Dec 30, 2017)

ECKSRATED said:


> Boxing training is no joke man. That's good shit that you're getting into that. And that's badass you're a pro bowler. You think you're done competing for good in PLing?



Yes, because it's counterproductive to bowling while the boxing isn't but' it's also counterproductive to boxing.

My trainer is an undefeated Pro and told me in the last weeks that I stopped lifting and broke up a lot of scar tissue I move much better.

In 2019 when I turn 50 I'm touring the PBA50 National Tour. That's the Bowling senior circuit.


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## BigGainz (Dec 30, 2017)

Hurt said:


> That’s a heavy cycle for sure. Ultimately you’ve cycled in the past and it’s your life so do as you wish, but you’re doubling your previous dosages so what’s next? You going to double it again? Slow and steady is my opinion...you can increase your dosages minimally while upping your food substantially and see incredible gains. You don’t want to get to the point where you have to run 2g + of compounds just to see any results. Best of luck whatever you decide to do, though.



I appreciate in the input. I really liked the results i achieved with my prior two cycles. Starting with just Test, then adding Tren for the second cycle with a dbol kick start.

I don't want to hit crazy amount where I'm running 2gs of test. Just doing after some reading, it seems like going up to a gram will give nice results. Anything after that seems to give way to much diminishing returns. Running 800 mg of Tren may be to much but I can always drop it to a lower amount if need be.

I know it's a lot of compounds but I'm dedicating the next three months to just eating and working out. I'm planning on hibernating other than stuffing my face and going to the gym.

It just seems like if I wanted to do a heavy cycle this would be the perfect time. I just moved to the city so I don't have any friends around and I'm at a point where I'm just focusing on me and bettering myself.  Bleh sorry for rambling, I'm really excited to see what happens when I put all this hard work in.

I always eat healthy and try to workout hard, but when I was on the last two cycles it just made me work that much harder cause I want to maximize my results.


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## BigGainz (Dec 30, 2017)

SFGiants said:


> Yes, because it's counterproductive to bowling while the boxing isn't but' it's also counterproductive to boxing.
> 
> My trainer is an undefeated Pro and told me in the last weeks that I stopped lifting and broke up a lot of scar tissue I move much better.
> 
> In 2019 when I turn 50 I'm touring the PBA50 National Tour. That's the Bowling senior circuit.



I'd imagine boxing is somewhat similar to wrestling training in terms of building endurance. Back in 08 when I graduated I was in the best shape of my life after wrestling for four years. You could told me to run a marathon and I wouldn't of blinked any eye.


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## ECKSRATED (Dec 30, 2017)

We'd like to see some before and after pics man. That cycle should bring a big change to anyone's physique.


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## Seeker (Dec 30, 2017)

I wasn't knocking the cycle. I was just  bringing up a point that these types of heavy cycles are not for the moderate average user. BigGains, this is a very harsh cycle to run. Monitoring blood pressure daily, getting bloods is a must through out, your lipids will most likely go to shit. You have be prepared to go on other meds to control these sides. An ai might help with bloat and estrogen but at this level you'll need to stay on top of blood work. And There s the pct. I just again, guys running cycles at that level have left pct long behind them.


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## BigSwolePump (Dec 30, 2017)

The answer to you question is yes. Unless you are a competitive bodybuilder with years of experience with AAS, you have no need to ever use that much gear on any cycle much less a third cycle. Even then, that is reckless.

Ask Rich Piana and Dallas McCarver. Oh wait, they died.


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## Gibsonator (Dec 30, 2017)

BigSwolePump said:


> The answer to you question is yes. Unless you are a competitive bodybuilder with years of experience with AAS, you have no need to ever use that much gear on any cycle much less a third cycle. Even then, that is reckless.
> 
> Ask Rich Piana and Dallas McCarver. Oh wait, they died.



Boom (drops mic and walks away)


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## SFGiants (Dec 30, 2017)

Seeker said:


> I wasn't knocking the cycle. I was just  bringing up a point that these types of heavy cycles are not for the moderate average user. BigGains, this is a very harsh cycle to run. Monitoring blood pressure daily, getting bloods is a must through out, your lipids will most likely go to shit. You have be prepared to go on other meds to control these sides. An ai might help with bloat and estrogen but at this level you'll need to stay on top of blood work. And There s the pct. I just again, guys running cycles at that level have left pct long behind them.



Donating blood too!


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## Hurt (Dec 30, 2017)

BigGainz said:


> I appreciate in the input. I really liked the results i achieved with my prior two cycles. Starting with just Test, then adding Tren for the second cycle with a dbol kick start.
> 
> I don't want to hit crazy amount where I'm running 2gs of test. Just doing after some reading, it seems like going up to a gram will give nice results. Anything after that seems to give way to much diminishing returns. Running 800 mg of Tren may be to much but I can always drop it to a lower amount if need be.
> 
> ...



Well good luck man. If you move forward with the cycle please consider logging it!


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## jrsgym (Jan 2, 2018)

I agree with some of the other guys, no need for all those compounds. Why not go with a gram of test EW? Maybe some dbol at beginning. Telling you from experience that the real fun with test is at a gram. Never felt the need to go any higher. 
Good luck on whatever you decide.


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## SFGiants (Jan 2, 2018)

jrsgym said:


> I agree with some of the other guys, no need for all those compounds. Why not go with a gram of test EW? Maybe some dbol at beginning.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Not for everyone, I hate it above 750mg.


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## Dan.F (Jan 3, 2018)

Then how about pct?


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