# Anabolic dosages for first timers



## Humphrey (Sep 15, 2021)

One thing I want to bring up is the way a lot of advice given to young gym junkies is the dosage they require to grow. How you need 4-500 mig of test as a starting dose. This is bullshit. The male body on average makes 7mig of test per day. For a first coarse start low and grow. Get the most out of minimal . If you can't grow of 1ml of test e per week it's probably your diet and lack of quality workouts, not the juice. Stop relying on the 
Gear and start training like you want gains.
Nothing is for free.


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## GreatGunz (Sep 15, 2021)

*I think this philosophy comes from how you grow when your are brand new to gear……I personally only did 4-500mgs test only cycles for first couple years.*


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## Bro Bundy (Sep 15, 2021)

No one is saying you can’t grow on 1 ml . I see it this way if your gonna risk your health and shut down your natural production of testosterone might as well get the most out of it and use a dose that will bring some nice gains . 1 ml is just a bit more then a trt dose . I grow just fine on 125 mg of test too.


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## Humphrey (Sep 15, 2021)

GreatGunz said:


> *I think this philosophy comes from how you grow when your are brand new to gear……I personally only did 4-500mgs test only cycles for first couple years.*


Agree bro.  As you grow then you can up the gear when needed. An overnight accomplishment never lasts but a lifetime commitment and you will get and keep the results


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## Humphrey (Sep 15, 2021)

Bro Bundy said:


> No one is saying you can’t grow on 1 ml . I see it this way if your gonna risk your health and shut down your natural production of testosterone might as well get the most out of it and use a dose that will bring some nice gains . 1 ml is just a bit more then a trt dose . I grow just fine on 125 mg of test too.


I do agree but how many of us only shut the system down once. We get addicted and constantly gear up. I've got the dreaded stretch marks under the arms from growing 2 quickly when starting out and they will never go away. Now that I'm older I realise that i would have got the same results with less sides had I been in such a rush for mass.


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## Send0 (Sep 15, 2021)

Bro Bundy said:


> No one is saying you can’t grow on 1 ml . I see it this way if your gonna risk your health and shut down your natural production of testosterone might as well get the most out of it and use a dose that will bring some nice gains . 1 ml is just a bit more then a trt dose . I grow just fine on 125 mg of test too.


The problem with this assumption nos that it implies that everyone has the same level of androgen receptors to make full use of the a full 500mg. 

If we're talking someone who trained natty for 10 years, then they could probably make full use of that dose. If we're talking about someone with 3 years of training... then probably not so much.

There other outliers too, those that over respond, those that under respond, those who are sensitive and get too many sides over a certain dosage, etc.

I agree with the OP that most are quick to throw out the generic "do 500mg of test", without trying to understand the background of the person question first.

With that said..  500mg is sure to cover anyone, if a person doesnt feel like going through the hassle of evaluating what is a better starting dose for them.


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## Bro Bundy (Sep 15, 2021)

Counting who got how many angrogen receptor is going to deep for me .. Who even knows where the 500 mg of test even came from or who started that ?? There are no real rules to this aas game ..My philosophy is if your gonna  do it do it all the way .. I’m sure a newb will get good results on 300 mg or 400 too .. just happens to be 500 everyone recommends


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## Humphrey (Sep 15, 2021)

Well said mate. It just gets to me when a newbe posts his first course of 250mig of test and certain people jump in saying that you won't grow unless you take at least 500. 
Like you said, not everyone is the same. Start low if you don't grow up it a little. Why waste gear if your sweet spot is lower than 500.


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## Bro Bundy (Sep 15, 2021)

Humphrey said:


> Well said mate. It just gets to me when a newbe posts his first course of 250mig of test and certain people jump in saying that you won't grow unless you take at least 500.
> Like you said, not everyone is the same. Start low if you don't grow up it a little. Why waste gear if your sweet spot is lower than 500.


Most if not all new user don’t think that way . They are to excited and want to get huge . Last thing they are thinking of is wasting gear


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## Bro Bundy (Sep 15, 2021)

I still get good results on 300 to 400 mg too by the way


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## Humphrey (Sep 15, 2021)

Bro Bundy said:


> I still get good results on 300 to 400 mg too by the way


Same here bro. I honestly prefer lower test and let the other compounds do there work


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## Bro Bundy (Sep 15, 2021)

Humphrey said:


> Same here bro. I honestly prefer lower test and let the other compounds do there work


I was always a higher test or even with the other compounds guy like 500 test 500 deca . I tried the lower test higher other compounds and didn’t like how I felt .A lot  people love the lower test way specially  if you have estrogen issues


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## Send0 (Sep 15, 2021)

Bro Bundy said:


> Counting who got how many angrogen receptor is going to deep for me .. Who even knows where the 500 mg of test even came from or who started that ?? There are no real rules to this aas game ..My philosophy is if your gonna  do it do it all the way .. I’m sure a newb will get good results on 300 mg or 400 too .. just happens to be 500 everyone recommences


Everything you said is very true. No one can know amount of AR a person has. When I make custom recommendations, I always use a person's weight and  body fat to make assumptions of what dose I think may be good for them...  but it's not like I really know.. I admit it's just a guess.

I think this is why the 500mg recommendation is so popular. It takes the guess work out of the equation. That's probably why we all still blindly recommend bit. You know what they say... If it ain't broke, then don't fix it. 😁


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## Send0 (Sep 15, 2021)

Bro Bundy said:


> I was always a higher test or even with the other compounds guy like 500 test 500 deca . I tried the lower test higher other compounds and didn’t like how I felt .A lot  people love the lower test way specially  if you have estrogen issues


I'm the same way... Higher test, or at least equal test, just feels better to me in general.


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## GreatGunz (Sep 15, 2021)

Low test mgs (125-200mg) is the long game the one I am presently on with future torches planned…….BUT I’m a patient man.


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## TomJ (Sep 15, 2021)

Send0 said:


> If we're talking someone who trained natty for 10 years, then they could probably make full use of that dose. If we're talking about someone with 3 years of training... then probably not so much.


I fall square into this category. I trained natty for over 10 years and am on my first cycle at 500mg. 

While I can't speak much further on the topic since my personal, first hand, experience with enhancent is in it's infancy. I can say I agree that in most cases, people taking the plunge don't need to go to 500mg. I feel insane on 500 and can imagine that half the dose would still be insane feeling. That being said, there's a lot of really good arguments for doing ~500 that people have had over the years and I don't necessarily think there's anything wrong with starting at that dose. It's all based on the users experience and goals.


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## TomJ (Sep 15, 2021)

Humphrey said:


> Well said mate. It just gets to me when a newbe posts his first course of 250mig of test and certain people jump in saying that you won't grow unless you take at least 500.
> Like you said, not everyone is the same. Start low if you don't grow up it a little. Why waste gear if your sweet spot is lower than 500.


I feel like this is a lot of old school philosophy that's on its way out. 

As someone newer to the game, I'm seeing a lot of people sharing your sentiments against the cookie cutter 500 test starter cycle. I did a sickening amount of research and reading before I got started and would have to say the majority of what I saw shared your line of thinking. 

Only time I saw the old "you won't grow on less than 500" were people being satirical


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## Bro Bundy (Sep 15, 2021)

I’ve never seen anyone say you won’t grow on anything less then 500 mg.. It’s up to the user to pick what dose he wants to use .. After a few cycles you should know what test is about and what dose you should use


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## Bro Bundy (Sep 15, 2021)

Send0 said:


> Everything you said is very true. No one can know amount of AR a person has. When I make custom recommendations, I always use a person's weight and  body fat to make assumptions of what dose I think may be good for them...  but it's not like I really know.. I admit it's just a guess.
> 
> I think this is why the 500mg recommendation is so popular. It takes the guess work out of the equation. That's probably why we all still blindly recommend bit. You know what they say... If it ain't broke, then don't fix it. 😁


A persons size and weight really doesn’t matter much when it comes to what dose they should use


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## Bro Bundy (Sep 15, 2021)

You gotta experiment a little now and then .. I tried a gram of test once . I got kinda dizzy and felt like shit on it so I knew that wasn’t for me .. experiment cause no one really has the correct answer on what is the best dose


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## Limited Money (Sep 15, 2021)

Humphrey said:


> I do agree but how many of us only shut the system down once. We get addicted and constantly gear up. I've got the dreaded stretch marks under the arms from growing 2 quickly when starting out and they will never go away. Now that I'm older I realise that i would have got the same results with less sides had I been in such a rush for mass.


If you don't like your stretch marks have you considered using Vitamin E to reduce or make them go away.  I don't know to much about it but its what a lot of women do to get rid of the pregnancy stretch marks.  I haven't cycled yet but have loads of stretch marks on my pecs, biceps and hamstrings from bulking to hard trying to keep up with my peers that were using sarms.


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## Humphrey (Sep 15, 2021)

Limited Money said:


> If you don't like your stretch marks have you considered using Vitamin E to reduce or make them go away.  I don't know to much about it but its what a lot of women do to get rid of the pregnancy stretch marks.  I haven't cycled yet but have loads of stretch marks on my pecs, biceps and hamstrings from bulking to hard trying to keep up with my peers that were using sarms.


I actually grew that quick that I would bleed under my arms from lifting so heavy and I put on 15kg in 6wks . First coarse 30 year's ago.  They are there for life bro. Thanks for the advice though.


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## Migmaster (Sep 15, 2021)

Humphrey said:


> Same here bro. I honestly prefer lower test and let the other compounds do there work


Exactly. Why jack up test dosages just to take Ai's. Add a compound or 2 with it. Keeps sides way down


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## Badleroybrown (Sep 15, 2021)

I hate when people say” I am new to the game of AAS”. AAS use is not a game. It is your Health first, your Mental well being second and the legality third” if you are one that considers this a game, it should be re evaluated. 
I am not being a douche, but it is early and I am grumpy. Also even though we only have the internet, we learn a lot about each other and I only want everyone be safe..


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## MuscleMedicineMD (Sep 15, 2021)

200-250mg of Test E Transformed me. 33lbs in 8wks @18yo while studying/class premed top school eating almost nothing (laughable compared to my diet/nutritional life today at least). And for the next 6yrs I stayed at 250 Test, adding only small amount of 'anabolics' (+200mg)..
-For the past 20yrs I havent been shy to tell all newbies on boards, and advise accordingly. "250-300mg is a proper starting point for virgins to the game" (for the millionth time).. go up when NEEDED (define)

FACTORS: I'd put genetics and age at the top of that list.
1. Your response to various hormones & levels seems to change with age. fact. 
2. Genetics. We all know there are (dare I say it) "hyper-responders" to AAS. What happened to Me v. my 2 best buddies when we all started the same cycle at 18, was worlds apart. Ive seen this a million times since those days with clients. Most ProBBers fall into that category, often sited would be Kevin Levrone, Phil H, Nick Walker etc etc. 

This largely why I give less respect to mens Physique guys. I see national ams competitors and say.. "Umm..that was me after 1yr of training and eating like crap..no thanks" but maybe thats not fair, maybe some of those guys are like my buds and are killing themselves to even look decent..hell half the gym is juiced and I wouldnt even know they seriously lifted. Genetics rule. same goes for medicine/IQ but work ethic is the great counter-balance!

Cheers to cycles of 300 Test cycles,
MuscleMedicine, MD


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## Humphrey (Sep 15, 2021)

Badleroybrown said:


> I hate when people say” I am new to the game of AAS”. AAS use is not a game. It is your Health first, your Mental well being second and the legality third” if you are one that considers this a game, it should be re evaluated.
> I am not being a douche, but it is early and I am grumpy. Also even though we only have the internet, we learn a lot about each other and I only want everyone be safe..


Well said brother.


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## Humphrey (Sep 15, 2021)

MuscleMedicineMD said:


> 200-250mg of Test E Transformed me. 33lbs in 8wks @18yo while studying/class premed top school eating almost nothing (laughable compared to my diet/nutritional life today at least). And for the next 6yrs I stayed at 250 Test, adding only small amount of 'anabolics' (+200mg)..
> -For the past 20yrs I havent been shy to tell all newbies on boards, and advise accordingly. "250-300mg is a proper starting point for virgins to the game" (for the millionth time).. go up when NEEDED (define)
> 
> FACTORS: I'd put genetics and age at the top of that list.
> ...


Awesome words bro , massive respect to you.


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## Badleroybrown (Sep 15, 2021)

Humphrey said:


> Awesome words bro , massive respect to you
> 
> 
> Humphrey said:
> ...


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## Bro Bundy (Sep 15, 2021)

MuscleMedicineMD said:


> 200-250mg of Test E Transformed me. 33lbs in 8wks @18yo while studying/class premed top school eating almost nothing (laughable compared to my diet/nutritional life today at least). And for the next 6yrs I stayed at 250 Test, adding only small amount of 'anabolics' (+200mg)..
> -For the past 20yrs I havent been shy to tell all newbies on boards, and advise accordingly. "250-300mg is a proper starting point for virgins to the game" (for the millionth time).. go up when NEEDED (define)
> 
> FACTORS: I'd put genetics and age at the top of that list.
> ...


Why were even using gear at 18 ?


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## Badleroybrown (Sep 15, 2021)

Bro Bundy said:


> Why were even using gear at 18 ?


Nothing against this guy. I don’t know him .  His post are suspect. This is why I question everything this guy says.


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## Bro Bundy (Sep 15, 2021)

Badleroybrown said:


> Nothing against this guy. I don’t know him .  His post are suspect. This is why I question everything this guy says.


Anyone claiming to be a md or dr has always been suspect throughout the years I’ve been around ..


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## Badleroybrown (Sep 15, 2021)

YUP!!!!! With a whole BIO and everything. I believe It’s just a way for him to entice less knowledgeable people into his services.
 I Stand By This Statement


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 15, 2021)

I've been training for 10 years and going to start using steroids for the first time. I'll start with 500mg of test e and add in dbol later on. I think it makes no sense for me to start on 250mg. I think I will cruise with 150-200mg of test.


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## TomJ (Sep 15, 2021)

Badleroybrown said:


> I hate when people say” I am new to the game of AAS”. AAS use is not a game. It is your Health first, your Mental well being second and the legality third” if you are one that considers this a game, it should be re evaluated.



It's largely just a figure of speech meaning, "my first hand experience is limited" 

At the end of the day these are drugs drastically impact your body and mind and need to be taken very seriously. 
This is why I waited until I was 28 to start.


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## Bro Bundy (Sep 15, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> I've been training for 10 years and going to start using steroids for the first time. I'll start with 500mg of test e and add in dbol later on. I think it makes no sense for me to start on 250mg. I think I will cruise with 150-200mg of test.


Let’s do alittle test while your here .. Your a new user and getting ready for a first cycle .Im sure you did a good amount of research. What do you think about 300 mg as a first cycle ? Obviously u never used Testosteron before you really have no idea how 300 feels or 500 and what results your gonna get .. From my experience with the two doses I would much rather run 500mg to 300 knowing what I know about the 2 doses .. 300 mg won’t transform anyone to drastically. I personally think 500 is a perfect dose for a first cycle or a fifth  cycle


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 15, 2021)

Bro Bundy said:


> Let’s do alittle test while your here .. Your a new user and getting ready for a first cycle .Im sure you did a good amount of research. What do you think about 300 mg as a first cycle ? Obviously u never used Testosteron before you really have no idea how 300 feels or 500 and what results your gonna get .. From my experience with the two doses I would much rather run 500mg to 300 knowing what I know about the 2 doses .. 300 mg won’t transform anyone to drastically. I personally think 500 is a perfect dose for a first cycle or a fifth  cycle


From the research I've done: 300mg is fine, but the side effects are very similar to 500mg, but apparently the "gains" from 500mg is drastically increased from 300mg, so the generally suggested first time dose is 500mg. My source is reddit.com/r/steroids Very popular site on talking about steroids.


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## Bro Bundy (Sep 15, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> From the research I've done: 300mg is fine, but the side effects are very similar to 500mg, but apparently the "gains" from 500mg is drastically increased from 300mg, so the generally suggested first time dose is 500mg. My source is reddit.com/r/steroids Very popular site on talking about steroids.


500 just sounds more appealing.. I smell you


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## BrotherJ (Sep 15, 2021)

Bro Bundy said:


> I was always a higher test or even with the other compounds guy like 500 test 500 deca . I tried the lower test higher other compounds and didn’t like how I felt .A lot  people love the lower test way specially  if you have estrogen issues


500/500 test and deca is my sweet spot and with little to no side effects, at least for me. Everyone is different.


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## Badleroybrown (Sep 15, 2021)

Bro Bundy said:


> Let’s do alittle test while your here .. Your a new user and getting ready for a first cycle .Im sure you did a good amount of research. What do you think about 300 mg as a first cycle ? Obviously u never used Testosteron before you really have no idea how 300 feels or 500 and what results your gonna get .. From my experience with the two doses I would much rather run 500mg to 300 knowing what I know about the 2 doses .. 300 mg won’t transform anyone to drastically. I personally think 500 is a perfect dose for a first cycle or a fifth  cycle





Kingjpwn said:


> From the research I've done: 300mg is fine, but the side effects are very similar to 500mg, but apparently the "gains" from 500mg is drastically increased from 300mg, so the generally suggested first time dose is 500mg. My source is reddit.com/r/steroids Very popular site on talking about steroids.


I have ran very high doses of test and most compounds. Even worked up to 700 mg of tren a for a few weeks. Not smart, very stupid but it was a experiment.
Right now I am on 300mg o week of test cyp 1 shot a week and I am making killer gains. Sure I am not as tight as I want to be due to a little water, but fuck it. . This is all in the diet and training. 
Kingpin if this is truly you in your avi and you have never used anything before… 2500-300mg if test with a little dbol like you said will do wonders.


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## TomJ (Sep 15, 2021)

Badleroybrown said:


> Kingpin if this is truly you in your avi and you have never used anything before… 2500-300mg if test with a little dbol like you said will do wonders.


For real, I thought I got pretty far for being natty, this guy makes me look small


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 15, 2021)

Badleroybrown said:


> I have ran very high doses of test and most compounds. Even worked up to 700 mg of tren a for a few weeks. Not smart, very stupid but it was a experiment.
> Right now I am on 300mg o week of test cyp 1 shot a week and I am making killer gains. Sure I am not as tight as I want to be due to a little water, but fuck it. . This is all in the diet and training.
> Kingpin if this is truly you in your avi and you have never used anything before… 2500-300mg if test with a little dbol like you said will do wonders.


Yes it is me bro. I have used sarms, ostarine, rad-140, lgd-4033. The steroid cycle im about to do is first STEROID cycle. I'm gonna do the 500 test 20-40mg dbol. I don't believe the sarms I have taken are nearly as effective as steroids. What do you think?


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 15, 2021)

TomJ said:


> For real, I thought I got pretty far for being natty, this guy makes me look small


Technically I am not natty bro. I have used SARMs.


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 15, 2021)

Also want to point out, my genetics are pretty good. My father is the former bench press world champion and his total (sbd) is over 1000kgs. His bicep at biggest was 58cm.


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## TomJ (Sep 15, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> Technically I am not natty bro. I have used SARMs.


ahh i gotcha, still very impressive. I have no experience with sarms so i dont know how they legitimately compare to AAS. only what ive heard.


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 15, 2021)

TomJ said:


> ahh i gotcha, still very impressive. I have no experience with sarms so i dont know how they legitimately compare to AAS. only what ive heard.


Thank you bro! With ostarine I didnt lose any muscle on a cut. Lgd made me feel like a girl but people asked if im on steroids and rad made my hack squat 5x5 go from 140kg to 190kg in 10 weeks. People report no results from the sarms they bought from the same source I did, so I think there is a chance I'm a hyper responder to anabolics.


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## TomJ (Sep 15, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> Also want to point out, my genetics are pretty good. My father is the former bench press world champion and his total (sbd) is over 1000kgs. His bicep at biggest was 58cm.


thats a big fucking arm. lucky you bro!


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## Bro Bundy (Sep 15, 2021)

Badleroybrown said:


> I have ran very high doses of test and most compounds. Even worked up to 700 mg of tren a for a few weeks. Not smart, very stupid but it was a experiment.
> Right now I am on 300mg o week of test cyp 1 shot a week and I am making killer gains. Sure I am not as tight as I want to be due to a little water, but fuck it. . This is all in the diet and training.
> Kingpin if this is truly you in your avi and you have never used anything before… 2500-300mg if test with a little dbol like you said will do wonders.


I got up to 600 mg of tren and had to lower the dose . I got real toxic feeling and just overall felt like crap on that dose . 400mg has been much more tolerable


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## Migmaster (Sep 15, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> Also want to point out, my genetics are pretty good. My father is the former bench press world champion and his total (sbd) is over 1000kgs. His bicep at biggest was 58cm.


Damn


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## Bro Bundy (Sep 15, 2021)

Genetics are so damn important to have good results from the juice .


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## CJ (Sep 15, 2021)

TomJ said:


> For real, I thought I got pretty far for being natty, this guy makes me look small


Right!!!! 

Dude has great genetics and training mentality. He's going to blow up on a cycle, I'd bet he'd respond well to anything.


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## TomJ (Sep 15, 2021)

CJ275 said:


> Right!!!!
> 
> Dude has great genetics and training mentality. He's going to blow up on a cycle, I'd bet he'd respond well to anything.


i mean clearl;y if he got that big on a couple sarms cycles


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 15, 2021)

If you guys are interested, I'm starting the cycle on 23.11. and could post some results afterwards.

Thanks for the compliments. My goal is to compete in classic physique. I have very similar physique to chris bumstead imo. Same lat insertions, same calf insertions (just measured calf size 43cm), chest also looks similar? not sure..., great arm genetics, my tricep insertions and "model" is also very good "horseshoe type". Waist / hip were both 72cm when I measured them last time with gf, weighed 103kg then.


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## TomJ (Sep 15, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> If you guys are interested, I'm starting the cycle on 23.11. and could post some results afterwards.
> 
> Thanks for the compliments. My goal is to compete in classic physique. I have very similar physique to chris bumstead imo. Same lat insertions, same calf insertions (just measured calf size 43cm), chest also looks similar? not sure..., great arm genetics, my tricep insertions and "model" is also very good "horseshoe type". Waist / hip were both 72cm when I measured them last time with gf, weighed 103kg then.


start a members journal, I would follow your progress


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 15, 2021)

TomJ said:


> start a members journal, I would follow your progress


If you are interested this is me at 103-104kg, the pics are taken this or last month. Last time I took sarms was 3 months ago.









						me at 103-104kg
					

me at 103-104kg album hosted in ImgBB




					ibb.co
				




The Images are half nude so click at ur own risk haha 

I also have no clue how to pose and the only leg picture is blurry xd


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## Badleroybrown (Sep 15, 2021)

Bro Bundy said:


> I got up to 600 mg of tren and had to lower the dose . I got real toxic feeling and just overall felt like crap on that dose . 400mg has been much more tolerable


I was going to add that in my other post.
I was up to a little higher on the tren. Worked up to 790mg a week. That lasted 2 weeks. I was a raging lunitic. I ramped it up from 200 to 700. Had to stop it all completely. Between the phycosis and the yellow sweat that was coming out of me at night I had to stop. My wife was ready to kill me in my sleep. She has to change the sheets daily’s. Finally she put a shower curtain under my sheet so I didn’t stain out 5000$ bed..
I am going to experiment soon. 175-200mg  of tren a week. With my trt dose of test @ 300mg a week. I want to see where that will take me with with my training. I will also be running gh prob 4-6 iu’s a day. If my $$ is ok I will most likely run it @ 6.. 
holding off for a month or so.
Hunting season coming up and I just brought a new gun. Don’t want to shell shock the wife.


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## Migmaster (Sep 15, 2021)

Badleroybrown said:


> I was going to add that in my other post.
> I was up to a little higher on the tren. Worked up to 790mg a week. That lasted 2 weeks. I was a raging lunitic. I ramped it up from 200 to 700. Had to stop it all completely. Between the phycosis and the yellow sweat that was coming out of me at night I had to stop. My wife was ready to kill me in my sleep. She has to change the sheets daily’s. Finally she put a shower curtain under my sheet so I didn’t stain out 5000$ bed..
> I am going to experiment soon. 175-200mg  of tren a week. With my trt dose of test @ 300mg a week. I want to see where that will take me with with my training. I will also be running gh prob 4-6 iu’s a day. If my $$ is ok I will most likely run it @ 6..
> holding off for a month or so.
> Hunting season coming up and I just brought a new gun. Don’t want to shell shock the wife.


None can prepare you for the tren night sweats. Lol


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## Badleroybrown (Sep 15, 2021)

Migmaster said:


> None can prepare you for the tren night sweats. Lol


Pillows have been thrown out. Sheets ruined. Got to a point where I was sleeping in a bathrob because I new I was going to wake up freezing and as wet as you would be if you got out of the shower.


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## Migmaster (Sep 15, 2021)

Badleroybrown said:


> Pillows have been thrown out. Sheets ruined. Got to a point where I was sleeping in a bathrob because I new I was going to wake up freezing and as wet as you would be if you got out of the shower.


My wife told me that the poison I was sweating out had to go. LoL. End of my tren usage.


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## Badleroybrown (Sep 15, 2021)

Migmaster said:


> My wife told me that the poison I was sweating out had to go. LoL. End of my tren usage.


Lmfao!!!! I think my wife has prob spoken with your wife… Tren is officially outlawed in my house… it is a very sore subject that I keep on the DL… few months Back I had test no ester, the smell that was coming off of me from that was not much better.. straight up toxic waste..


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## GreatGunz (Sep 16, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> I've been training for 10 years and going to start using steroids for the first time. I'll start with 500mg of test e and add in dbol later on. I think it makes no sense for me to start on 250mg. I think I will cruise with 150-200mg of test.


Why not?


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## GreatGunz (Sep 16, 2021)

Migmaster said:


> My wife told me that the poison I was sweating out had to go. LoL. End of my tren usage.


They hate it when you stain the sheets


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## GreatGunz (Sep 16, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> If you guys are interested, I'm starting the cycle on 23.11. and could post some results afterwards.
> 
> Thanks for the compliments. My goal is to compete in classic physique. I have very similar physique to chris bumstead imo. Same lat insertions, same calf insertions (just measured calf size 43cm), chest also looks similar? not sure..., great arm genetics, my tricep insertions and "model" is also very good "horseshoe type". Waist / hip were both 72cm when I measured them last time with gf, weighed 103kg then.


Bro we have a cycle and training journal areas here if you want to post your training and cycle as it happens also great to have if you run into a curve.One of us could most likely help u out


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 16, 2021)

GreatGunz said:


> Why not?


If I'm going to shutdown my HPTA at 300mg and 500mg doses, why don't go 500mg? The gains are linearly rising from 300 to 500 but apparently side effects are not (my source is reddit.com/r/steroids).


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 16, 2021)

GreatGunz said:


> Bro we have a cycle and training journal areas here if you want to post your training and cycle as it happens also great to have if you run into a curve.One of us could most likely help u out


Alright, I will do it when I start the cycle. I will for sure run into errors.


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## Humphrey (Sep 16, 2021)

GreatGunz said:


> Bro we have a cycle and training journal areas here if you want to post your training and cycle as it happens also great to have if you run into a curve.One of us could most likely help u





Kingjpwn said:


> If I'm going to shutdown my HPTA at 300mg and 500mg doses, why don't go 500mg? The gains are linearly rising from 300 to 500 but apparently side effects are not (my source is reddit.com/r/steroids).


Just say your training partner runs 500 with no sides doesn't mean you won't get sides. You might get conversion at 250. Sensitive nips and bloat.  Start low and play safe . You have no idea how your body is going to react. Blood can thicken to the point of cardiac problems at low doses on certain people.  Don't believe everything you read as it might work for the majority but you might get fucked over for life.


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 16, 2021)

Humphrey said:


> Just say your training partner runs 500 with no sides doesn't mean you won't get sides. You might get conversion at 250. Sensitive nips and bloat.  Start low and play safe . You have no idea how your body is going to react. Blood can thicken to the point of cardiac problems at low doses on certain people.  Don't believe everything you read as it might work for the majority but you might get fucked over for life.


I am going to take bloods week 6. What health markers do I look for to know about cardiac problems? Blood pressure and cholesterol? I also have AI and raloxifene with me. Going to start AI only if my nipples start to itch.


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## Humphrey (Sep 16, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> I am going to take bloods week 6. What health markers do I look for to know about cardiac problems? Blood pressure and cholesterol? I also have AI and raloxifene with me. Going to start AI only if my nipples start to


Haemoglobin, haematocrit. Roids cause red blood cells to grow and on some people it can accumulate quickly causing thick blood which makes it harder for the heart to pump. The heart is a muscle and can grow, stiffen and thicken with juice. This can make heart attacks easier to happen.  Most people can do a lot of courses without drama ,or like a friend of mine only done 2 courses and ended up needing medical attention.  Get yourself a cheap blood pressure machine for home and monitor as you progress through your cycle.


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 16, 2021)

Humphrey said:


> Haemoglobin, haematocrit. Roids cause red blood cells to grow and on some people it can accumulate quickly causing thick blood which makes it harder for the heart to pump. The heart is a muscle and can grow, stiffen and thicken with juice. This can make heart attacks easier to happen.  Most people can do a lot of courses without drama ,or like a friend of mine only done 2 courses and ended up needing medical attention.  Get yourself a cheap blood pressure machine for home and monitor as you progress through your cycle.


Yes! I have already bought a bloodpressure monitor. It says my bloodpressure is 135/85. So I guess that's on the high end?

Do you have any supplement recommendations to help with this problem? I have heard aspirin, dark chocolate.

My plan is to on week 6 go check estradiol (to adjust ai), liver values and lipids and haemoglobin and haematocrit as you suggested.

Will check the same values on week 11 as I start taking dbol.

Thanks in advance!

EDIT: btw my life has been very stressful for the past two or three days and I am pretty convinced that's why my bloodpressure is that high. I will check it daily and see if it lowers as the stress is gone.


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## Bro Bundy (Sep 16, 2021)

Damn Humphrey is like the grim reaper of anabolic androgenic steroids ...


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## CJ (Sep 16, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> If I'm going to shutdown my HPTA at 300mg and 500mg doses, why don't go 500mg? The gains are linearly rising from 300 to 500 but apparently side effects are not (my source is reddit.com/r/steroids).


I get horrific cystic acne at 500 mg, but at 300 mg I get very little mild acne.


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## Bro Bundy (Sep 16, 2021)

CJ275 said:


> I get horrific cystic acne at 500 mg, but at 300 mg I get very little mild acne.


And I’ve never had a single zit in over a decade.. Just to show how different everyone reacts to these drugs


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 16, 2021)

CJ275 said:


> I get horrific cystic acne at 500 mg, but at 300 mg I get very little mild acne.


Doesn't sound really good because with SARMs I got very mild "acne". My girlfriend told me that it's not acne and it's just "sweat bumps". That could have been true also. Think I really need to start changing the sheets 2 times a week.


Bro Bundy said:


> And I’ve never had a single zit in over a decade.. Just to show how different everyone reacts to these drugs


Man I wish I have no acne problem, it looks real bad.


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## CJ (Sep 16, 2021)

Bro Bundy said:


> And I’ve never had a single zit in over a decade.. Just to show how different everyone reacts to these drugs


I hate you. 😣

I've had to go to the ER to have a giant golf ball sized one sliced open, drained, stuff scooped out, then stuffed with gauze. 

Not fun.


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## Bro Bundy (Sep 16, 2021)

CJ275 said:


> I hate you. 😣
> 
> I've had to go to the ER to have a giant golf ball sized one sliced open, drained, stuff scooped out, then stuffed with gauze.
> 
> Not fun.


Ya no thanks I wouldn’t use gear if I had serious issues with it


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## CJ (Sep 16, 2021)

Bro Bundy said:


> Ya no thanks I wouldn’t use gear if I had serious issues with it


It's why I don't go over 400 Test, that's about the limit for me. When I added in NPP or Deca, it was fine, no additional issues. 

Anavar, Mast, and Winny didn't cause problems either. 

Low rise Tren was fine too, but I imagine if I upped it, I'd run into issues as well.


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 16, 2021)

CJ275 said:


> I hate you. 😣
> 
> I've had to go to the ER to have a giant golf ball sized one sliced open, drained, stuff scooped out, then stuffed with gauze.
> 
> Not fun.


Man that's some serious shit. I gotta start keeping good care of my skin health when I hop on.


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## CJ (Sep 16, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> Man that's some serious shit. I gotta start keeping good care of my skin health when I hop on.


Yeah, mine was hormonal acne, so NOTHING I did to take care of my skin help with the deep acne. 

Only oral antibiotics knocked it back, not even topical antibiotics did anything.


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## Bro Bundy (Sep 16, 2021)

CJ275 said:


> It's why I don't go over 400 Test, that's about the limit for me. When I added in NPP or Deca, it was fine, no additional issues.
> 
> Anavar, Mast, and Winny didn't cause problems either.
> 
> Low rise Tren was fine too, but I imagine if I upped it, I'd run into issues as well.


Pct is what gets a lot of people with acne .. That’s about the only time I remember getting a few zits on the back of my shoulder once


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 16, 2021)

CJ275 said:


> Yeah, mine was hormonal acne, so NOTHING I did to take care of my skin help with the deep acne.
> 
> Only oral antibiotics knocked it back, not even topical antibiotics did anything.


Have you tried accutane?


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 16, 2021)

Bro Bundy said:


> Pct is what gets a lot of people with acne .. That’s about the only time I remember getting a few zits on the back of my shoulder once


While on sarms I did nolvadex 5mg-10mg ED, so maybe that's what caused the acne, because first SARMs cycle I had no issues with any bumps.


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## CJ (Sep 16, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> Have you tried accutane?


No, I do not like the stories I hear from many who've used it. 

I'll just use less gear, I'm not really a fan of taking extra drugs to fight the unwanted side effects of other drugs I'm taking. I want to take the least amount of stuff as possible.


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 16, 2021)

CJ275 said:


> No, I do not like the stories I hear from many who've used it.
> 
> I'll just use less gear, I'm not really a fan of taking extra drugs to fight the unwanted side effects of other drugs I'm taking. I want to take the least amount of stuff as possible.


Alright. Will see what I will decide later on in my gear journey. I also like the mentality to not take that much drugs. I don't want that my blasts look like

1g test week 1-16
1g eq week 1-16
500mg deca week 1-16
100mg anadrol week 1-5
100mg anavar week 11-16

etc.


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## CJ (Sep 16, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> Alright. Will see what I will decide later on in my gear journey. I also like the mentality to not take that much drugs. I don't want that my blasts look like
> 
> 1g test week 1-16
> 1g eq week 1-16
> ...


Yeah, to me that amount of compounds is just crazy. Especially for a first cycle. 2.6 grams of gear. 😳😳😳

You have great genetics, you'd probably blow up off just 500 mg of Test per week, that's it. And keep your health risk waaaay down.

EDIT: I misread your post, I thought that you were thinking of running that cycle!  😂😂😂


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 16, 2021)

CJ275 said:


> Yeah, to me that amount of compounds is just crazy. Especially for a first cycle. 2.6 grams of gear. 😳😳😳
> 
> You have great genetics, you'd probably blow up off just 500 mg of Test per week, that's it. And keep your health risk waaaay down.
> 
> EDIT: I misread your post, I thought that you were thinking of running that cycle!  😂😂😂


Haha, no way, just giving example of something crazy I don't want to do. Although, I know when I goto a contest prep I think a lot of steroids are needed. 

My friend said some must haves are: winstrol, halo, tren, masteron, anavar, anadrol.

Happily, it's a long time until I have to make the decision to take that much gear.


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## Steeeve (Sep 16, 2021)

Badleroybrown said:


> I have ran very high doses of test and most compounds. Even worked up to 700 mg of tren a for a few weeks. Not smart, very stupid but it was a experiment.
> Right now I am on 300mg o week of test cyp 1 shot a week and I am making killer gains. Sure I am not as tight as I want to be due to a little water, but fuck it. . This is all in the diet and training.
> Kingpin if this is truly you in your avi and you have never used anything before… 2500-300mg if test with a little dbol like you said will do wonders.


Great post. Ive been cruising at 200 test cyp and 100 nan deca to see how that level would treat me prior to running 500/250 on cycle in november. Wasnt expecting much but the strength and recomp effects have for sure been noticeable to other people in my life.


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## eazy (Sep 16, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> Yes! I have already bought a bloodpressure monitor. It says my bloodpressure is 135/85. So I guess that's on the high end?
> 
> Do you have any supplement recommendations to help with this problem?


I use 5mg daily tadalafil and eat 2 stalks of celery per day. 

Some use telmisartan.


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 16, 2021)

eazy said:


> I use 5mg daily tadalafil and eat 2 stalks of celery per day.
> 
> Some use telmisartan.


Just took a nap and woke up with 110/61. Think it was just because of my stress the bp was so high.
And thanks for info!


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## CJ (Sep 16, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> Just took a nap and woke up with 110/61. Think it was just because of my stress the bp was so high.
> And thanks for info!


With your new monitor, take readings in the morning a few times per week. Not immediately after waking up, wait like 30 mins or so. Take the readings before any morning coffee or food. Write them down in a notepad app for reference, to spot any trends.


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## Send0 (Sep 16, 2021)

eazy said:


> I use 5mg daily tadalafil and eat 2 stalks of celery per day.
> 
> Some use telmisartan.


If anyone uses telimisartan, then I recommend pairing it with nebivolol, or other similar medication.

Lots of positive synergy between these two drugs... and have been show to stop and even reverse heart remodeling.


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 16, 2021)

CJ275 said:


> With your new monitor, take readings in the morning a few times per week. Not immediately after waking up, wait like 30 mins or so. Take the readings before any morning coffee or food. Write them down in a notepad app for reference, to spot any trends.


Do you happen to know any google play app to track morning weight / bloodpressure? That would be neat! I can also start a new thread somewhere to ask for ppls favorite apps.


Send0 said:


> If anyone uses telimisartan, then I recommend pairing it with nebivolol, or other similar medication.
> 
> Lots of positive synergy between these two drugs... and have been show to stop and even reverse heart remodeling.


Man, so many new drugs to introduce to system haha =)


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## CJ (Sep 16, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> Do you happen to know any google play app to track morning weight / bloodpressure? That would be neat! I can also start a new thread somewhere to ask for ppls favorite apps.


I just use the Notes app in my phone. Create a folder called Blood Pressure, put it in there. Nothing fancy.


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 16, 2021)

CJ275 said:


> I just use the Notes app in my phone. Create a folder called Blood Pressure, put it in there. Nothing fancy.


I'd actually like to try some app. Would be nice to look at the graphs they draw for example.


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## TomJ (Sep 16, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> I'd actually like to try some app. Would be nice to look at the graphs they draw for example.


would be pretty easy to work something like that up in Excel or google sheets. i dont know of any apps specifically, but ive also never looked


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 16, 2021)

TomJ said:


> would be pretty easy to work something like that up in Excel or google sheets. i dont know of any apps specifically, but ive also never looked


Yes I know =) but I'm thinking if there's some cool apps, which remind of the weigh ins etc.


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## Humphrey (Sep 17, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> Yes! I have already bought a bloodpressure monitor. It says my bloodpressure is 135/85. So I guess that's on the high end?
> 
> Do you have any supplement recommendations to help with this problem? I have heard aspirin, dark chocolate.
> 
> ...


Your bp is getting up there , what is your pulse. Once your pressure gets high this is when kidney drama can occur.  Nothing you can really take.  If that is resting rate you need to chill out a little and monitor. Take it easy brother and try not to stress if you can. 
You'll be OK .


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## Bro Bundy (Sep 17, 2021)

The grim reaper


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 17, 2021)

Humphrey said:


> Your bp is getting up there , what is your pulse. Once your pressure gets high this is when kidney drama can occur.  Nothing you can really take.  If that is resting rate you need to chill out a little and monitor. Take it easy brother and try not to stress if you can.
> You'll be OK .


Pulse was 61, I will start marking up the morning and evening bp / pulse. I think I have no problem in that but it's good to have something to compare to when I hop on.


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## Humphrey (Sep 17, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> Pulse was 61, I will start marking up the morning and evening bp / pulse. I think I have no problem in that but it's good to have something to compare to when I hop on.


That is an awesome pulse mate.


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 17, 2021)

Humphrey said:


> That is an awesome pulse mate.


Yes brother, I try to do cardio every day and I'm eating super healthy. The only thing that bothers me is that I have smoked since I was 13 and I quit smoking last year. I still get out of breath in the gym easily and have some breathing problems which SOMETIMES make me go light headed after squats. One thing is for sure that I can't use pre workouts. Max a cup of coffee, otherwise my heart starts beating like crazy. Whatever I have ever taken medication / drug wise, I have always responded VERY strongly. For example when I was younger, 400mg of ibuprofein made my nose bleed and puke. Also I did do some drugs when I was younger and we always tested the drugs on me - if they worked on me it was legit stuff, but let's not talk about my past drug use - it's in the past.


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## Humphrey (Sep 17, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> Yes brother, I try to do cardio every day and I'm eating super healthy. The only thing that bothers me is that I have smoked since I was 13 and I quit smoking last year. I still get out of breath in the gym easily and have some breathing problems which SOMETIMES make me go light headed after squats. One thing is for sure that I can't use pre workouts. Max a cup of coffee, otherwise my heart starts beating like crazy. Whatever I have ever taken medication / drug wise, I have always responded VERY strongly. For example when I was younger, 400mg of ibuprofein made my nose bleed and puke. Also I did do some drugs when I was younger and we always tested the drugs on me - if they worked on me it was legit stuff, but let's not talk about my past drug use - it's in the past.


Mate , most of us gym nuts don't do things by halves. The thing is that we learn from the past and move forward. Hopefully smarter than before.  It's no race this game we play with our bodies but too get where you want out of all the hard work and effort without injury in any way.  Too look in the mirror and say that it was all worth it instead of getting there in a shorter amount of time and ending up in a hospital bed loosing everything you worked for with no returns except a doctors bill and stress . Train and play hard but take the time to be smart and learn from your own experience. Dose low and work your way up and enjoy the ride. You don't go to the gym and lift your maximum wait cold, you warm up first and get the feel for it.  
You will get there brother.


----------



## Kingjpwn (Sep 17, 2021)

Humphrey said:


> Mate , most of us gym nuts don't do things by halves. The thing is that we learn from the past and move forward. Hopefully smarter than before.  It's no race this game we play with our bodies but too get where you want out of all the hard work and effort without injury in any way.  Too look in the mirror and say that it was all worth it instead of getting there in a shorter amount of time and ending up in a hospital bed loosing everything you worked for with no returns except a doctors bill and stress . Train and play hard but take the time to be smart and learn from your own experience. Dose low and work your way up and enjoy the ride. You don't go to the gym and lift your maximum wait cold, you warm up first and get the feel for it.
> You will get there brother.


Yeah, my plan is to go first 500mg test / maybe 40mg dbol last 6 weeks, then cruise with 200mg of test and the blast again with 500mg test / 250 deca / 50 anadrol for 6 weeks. Going up slow and steady 

I do hope I get there, happily I don't have to stress about hospital bills because all healthcare is free in my country. Only thing you have to pay for example for 10 000 euros operation is 20 euros for service fee.


----------



## CJ (Sep 17, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> ... Whatever I have ever taken medication / drug wise, I have always responded VERY strongly....


Remember this when you do start to cycle. You will more than likely get plenty of results from lower doses. 

It probably works both ways also, you could possibly have side effects more quickly.


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## CJ (Sep 17, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> .... with 500mg test / 250 deca / 50 anadrol for 6 weeks.


Deca for 6 weeks is pointless. That's about how long it takes to build up to peak levels in the body, due to its long half life. 

So just when it gets going, you're going to stop? Deca is a drug you run for longer, like 14+ weeks. 

NPP is a much shorter half life version of Deca, both are Nandrolone as the base drug. It build up much more quickly, about 2 weeks. This drug can be run for shorter periods, but 6 weeks is still pretty short.


----------



## Kingjpwn (Sep 17, 2021)

CJ275 said:


> Remember this when you do start to cycle. You will more than likely get plenty of results from lower doses.
> 
> It probably works both ways also, you could possibly have side effects more quickly.


Yeah that's what I'm afraid of for real... But have to see to know...



CJ275 said:


> Deca for 6 weeks is pointless. That's about how long it takes to build up to peak levels in the body, due to its long half life.
> 
> So just when it gets going, you're going to stop? Deca is a drug you run for longer, like 14+ weeks.
> 
> NPP is a much shorter half life version of Deca, both are Nandrolone as the base drug. It build up much more quickly, about 2 weeks. This drug can be run for shorter periods, but 6 weeks is still pretty short.


I meant adrol for 6 weeks, deca for 16 weeks with test - the idea is that from my first blast I know the AI I need from test, I also know the side effects from test so anything new that comes is from the deca. Then until week 11 I'm supposed to know the deca's effects so add in Adrol.


----------



## CJ (Sep 17, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> Yeah that's what I'm afraid of for real... But have to see to know...
> 
> 
> I meant adrol for 6 weeks, deca for 16 weeks with test - the idea is that from my first blast I know the AI I need from test, I also know the side effects from test so anything new that comes is from the deca. Then until week 11 I'm supposed to know the deca's effects so add in Adrol.


Look into picking up some Cabergoline/Dostinex for potential prolactin issues from the Deca/Nandrolone in general. 

Again, an insurance policy that you hope to never need, but happy that you have some in case you need it.


----------



## Kingjpwn (Sep 17, 2021)

CJ275 said:


> Look into picking up some Cabergoline/Dostinex for potential prolactin issues from the Deca/Nandrolone in general.
> 
> Again, an insurance policy that you hope to never need, but happy that you have some in case you need it.


Yeah but, it's over half a year until I'm going to try the deca, so probably won't remember that then haha


----------



## Steeeve (Sep 17, 2021)

CJ275 said:


> Look into picking up some Cabergoline/Dostinex for potential prolactin issues from the Deca/Nandrolone in general.
> 
> Again, an insurance policy that you hope to never need, but happy that you have some in case you need it.


and brothers if you smoke the ganja AND do test/nandrolone get ready for the big boy prolactin swings


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 17, 2021)

Steeeve said:


> and brothers if you smoke the ganja AND do test/nandrolone get ready for the big boy prolactin swings


I smoke weed like once every 2 months? Sometimes 6... very rarely. Won't be a problem to stay away from weed haha =D what kind of effects does one get from prolactin swings?


----------



## Steeeve (Sep 17, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> I smoke weed like once every 2 months? Sometimes 6... very rarely. Won't be a problem to stay away from weed haha =D what kind of effects does one get from prolactin swings?


nah thats not nearly frequent enough. Prolactin in men can cascade downstream and cause effects that mimic symptoms of high e2. Gyno, loss of sexual libido, acne, etc are generally what I see. Luckily I came across a thread dealing with it from a newbie who was positive he was suffering from high e2 but he was clocking in at 25 with no AI. Low and behold prolactin was way elevated for a few reasons that he was able to manage and attenuate symptoms from


----------



## Kingjpwn (Sep 17, 2021)

Steeeve said:


> nah thats not nearly frequent enough. Prolactin in men can cascade downstream and cause effects that mimic symptoms of high e2. Gyno, loss of sexual libido, acne, etc are generally what I see. Luckily I came across a thread dealing with it from a newbie who was positive he was suffering from high e2 but he was clocking in at 25 with no AI. Low and behold prolactin was way elevated for a few reasons that he was able to manage and attenuate symptoms from


I'm going to be honest here, the amount of side-effects with roids is unreal. I know this is the path I'm going to take but I feel I have a rocky mountain to climb. Fortunately, I'm cool with challenges and I have excellent problem solving skills. Thanks for the answer. I will research all new compounds before taking them.


----------



## Steeeve (Sep 17, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> I'm going to be honest here, the amount of side-effects with roids is unreal. I know this is the path I'm going to take but I feel I have a rocky mountain to climb. Fortunately, I'm cool with challenges and I have excellent problem solving skills. Thanks for the answer. I will research all new compounds before taking them.


My best bit of advice to you is to not sweat the sides until they come. I personally know a dude who runs a gram of tren a week and claims zero sides (mental sides. I still tell him hes fucking his heart). Same with dudes on here doing 150 test and 500 deca with no deca dick or e2 issues. Also dudes on here who need long term AIs at 150 test a week because they happen to aromatize like no ones business. You just never know till you know


----------



## Kingjpwn (Sep 17, 2021)

Steeeve said:


> My best bit of advice to you is to not sweat the sides until they come. I personally know a dude who runs a gram of tren a week and claims zero sides (mental sides. I still tell him hes fucking his heart). Same with dudes on here doing 150 test and 500 deca with no deca dick or e2 issues. Also dudes on here who need long term AIs at 150 test a week because they happen to aromatize like no ones business. You just never know till you know


That's true. I shouldn't stress but I want to be cautious to do it ALL right at once. Don't want to be fucking around with my health you know.


----------



## Crom (Sep 17, 2021)

For me, I thought my TRT was broken. I wasn't seeing too many gains, consider even going off. some guys can do 125 mg a week and see a 1200 total where as I can do 200 mg a week and only see a 700.   It wasn't until I started pushing the 400 - 500 mark that I saw the changes and felt the benefits. Not everyone responds to low dose test. A lot of it is genetics.


----------



## Kingjpwn (Sep 17, 2021)

Crom said:


> For me, I thought my TRT was broken. I wasn't seeing too many gains, consider even going off. some guys can do 125 mg a week and see a 1200 total where as I can do 200 mg a week and only see a 700.   It wasn't until I started pushing the 400 - 500 mark that I saw the changes and felt the benefits. Not everyone responds to low dose test. A lot of it is genetics.


If I respond super well to sarms, does that mean I respond to test super well? For example after 2.5mg of LGD-4033 ED (usually dosed 5-20mg) people started asking if I started taking steroids. 10mg of rad got my hack squat sets from 140kg to 190kg in 8 weeks (10-20mg is the normal dosage).


----------



## Crom (Sep 17, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> If I respond super well to sarms, does that mean I respond to test super well? For example after 2.5mg of LGD-4033 ED (usually dosed 5-20mg) people started asking if I started taking steroids. 10mg of rad got my hack squat sets from 140kg to 190kg in 8 weeks (10-20mg is the normal dosage).


You very well could. I tried some Rad 140 and and MK677. Only thing I got was high blood pressure and bloat. Maybe I got bad shit? If that's your profile picture, sarms seem to be treating you well. Only way your going to know for sure is to run a cycle. Maybe just some test 300 - 500, see how you respond. 

       I saw a kid blow up on SARMS at my gym. Amazing how some people respond to that shit.


----------



## Kingjpwn (Sep 17, 2021)

Crom said:


> You very well could. I tried some Rad 140 and and MK677. Only thing I got was high blood pressure and bloat. Maybe I got bad shit? If that's your profile picture, sarms seem to be treating you well. Only way your going to know for sure is to run a cycle. Maybe just some test 300 - 500, see how you respond.
> 
> I saw a kid blow up on SARMS at my gym. Amazing how some people respond to that shit.


Yes its me I've done three sarms cycles. I don't want to use them again, I want the real stuff haha =) I will start 500 test, 30-40dbol for last six weeks starting at 23.11. I might also start my own journal here about my experiences.

And yeah, sarms have quite bad reputation on having lots of fake sellers. Some good ones are: deus, receptorchem, science.bio and chemyo.


----------



## Bro Bundy (Sep 17, 2021)

Steeeve said:


> and brothers if you smoke the ganja AND do test/nandrolone get ready for the big boy prolactin swings


This is bullshit ..


----------



## Bro Bundy (Sep 17, 2021)

Run your cycle the way you want 500 mg of test isn’t all that much to be honest .. I haven’t seen anyone have any major sides or issues at this dose in ten years of helping people with cycles .. If you have a lot of fear then this shit isnt for you ..


----------



## Robdjents (Sep 17, 2021)

Steeeve said:


> and brothers if you smoke the ganja AND do test/nandrolone get ready for the big boy prolactin swings


I smoke an ounce a week had no issues on npp


----------



## Crom (Sep 17, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> Yes its me I've done three sarms cycles. I don't want to use them again, I want the real stuff haha =) I will start 500 test, 30-40dbol for last six weeks starting at 23.11. I might also start my own journal here about my experiences.
> 
> And yeah, sarms have quite bad reputation on having lots of fake sellers. Some good ones are: deus, receptorchem, science.bio and chemyo.


Good luck on that. You look to have a good base already.


----------



## Send0 (Sep 17, 2021)

Steeeve said:


> and brothers if you smoke the ganja AND do test/nandrolone get ready for the big boy prolactin swings


I smoke, and use nand, and I don't get massive prolactin swings.


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 17, 2021)

Bro Bundy said:


> Run your cycle the way you want 500 mg of test isn’t all that much to be honest .. I haven’t seen anyone have any major sides or issues at this dose in ten years of helping people with cycles .. If you have a lot of fear then this shit isnt for you ..


Brother, you have the FUNNIEST and most relaxing style to write stuff haha =) like your style.


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## Bro Bundy (Sep 17, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> Brother, you have the FUNNIEST and most relaxing style to write stuff haha =) like your style.


I’ve been funny for years


----------



## Humphrey (Sep 18, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> Yeah, my plan is to go first 500mg test / maybe 40mg dbol last 6 weeks, then cruise with 200mg of test and the blast again with 500mg test / 250 deca / 50 anadrol for 6 weeks. Going up slow and steady
> 
> I do hope I get there, happily I don't have to stress about hospital bills because all healthcare is free in my country. Only thing you have to pay for example for 10 000 euros operation is 20 euros for service fee.


Do your homework before you start stacking. Dbol at the end of a coarse ?  Dbol to kick start deca maybe if you have a few courses under your belt. Your body mate .
Enjoy


----------



## Kingjpwn (Sep 18, 2021)

Humphrey said:


> Do your homework before you start stacking. Dbol at the end of a coarse ?  Dbol to kick start deca maybe if you have a few courses under your belt. Your body mate .
> Enjoy


I explained my 10 month plan there. First cycle will be test and dbol (dbol at the end of the cycle when I'm cool with the side effects of test and AI dose dialed in.


----------



## Robdjents (Sep 18, 2021)

Humphrey said:


> Do your homework before you start stacking. Dbol at the end of a coarse ?  Dbol to kick start deca maybe if you have a few courses under your belt. Your body mate .
> Enjoy


Why not run dbol at the end or in the middle when the test is firing on all cylinders? Is there a medical reason he shouldn’t ?


----------



## TomJ (Sep 18, 2021)

Bro Bundy said:


> If you have a lot of fear then this shit isnt for you ..



I think just being cautious, as he should, and gathering as much information as he can before going in. 



Sent from my SM-G996U using Tapatalk


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## Humphrey (Sep 19, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> I explained my 10 month plan there. First cycle will be test and dbol (dbol at the end of the cycle when I'm cool with the side effects of test and AI dose dialed in.


If you have done research then you should not stack anything at all until you have done a few test coarses.  You should not require any AI' s at all . You won't know if you are going to get any sides on test until near the end or after your coarse. Doing an oral like dbol in your first coarse ( unless it's anivar) doesn't make sense. Dbol is fucking harsh on the body .  Dbol on most will push your blood pressure through the roof and yours is already elevated.


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 21, 2021)

Humphrey said:


> If you have done research then you should not stack anything at all until you have done a few test coarses.  You should not require any AI' s at all . You won't know if you are going to get any sides on test until near the end or after your coarse. Doing an oral like dbol in your first coarse ( unless it's anivar) doesn't make sense. Dbol is fucking harsh on the body .  Dbol on most will push your blood pressure through the roof and yours is already elevated.


I'm gonna do something with the test, I'm pretty confident by week 11 I already know how my body reacts to the testosterone.

I am a little unsure whether to go with dbol, anadrol or superdrol, but I've been thinking about dbol the most.

Thanks for answer.


----------



## eazy (Sep 21, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> I'm gonna do something with the test, I'm pretty confident by week 11 I already know how my body reacts to the testosterone.
> 
> I am a little unsure whether to go with dbol, anadrol or superdrol, but I've been thinking about dbol the most.
> 
> Thanks for answer.


you're already giant in your avi, dbol would be out of this world!


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## Send0 (Sep 21, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> I'm gonna do something with the test, I'm pretty confident by week 11 I already know how my body reacts to the testosterone.
> 
> I am a little unsure whether to go with dbol, anadrol or superdrol, but I've been thinking about dbol the most.
> 
> Thanks for answer.


I think dbol is a good first oral, just because it's tried and true.

I do like superdrol, despite the pumps I get from it, but I found that it mostly gave me strength gains and not so as much mass after I dropped it from a cycle in the past.

That's just my opinion. I don't play with orals much, there are much smarter people than me who will hopefully chime in with their opinions.


----------



## Robdjents (Sep 22, 2021)

Humphrey said:


> If you have done research then you should not stack anything at all until you have done a few test coarses.  You should not require any AI' s at all . You won't know if you are going to get any sides on test until near the end or after your coarse. Doing an oral like dbol in your first coarse ( unless it's anivar) doesn't make sense. Dbol is fucking harsh on the body .  Dbol on most will push your blood pressure through the roof and yours is already elevated.


Not requiring AI is somewhat of a misleading statement...your bloodwork will tell you if you need them or not. Be sure to have them on hand juuuust in case.


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## Kingjpwn (Sep 22, 2021)

Send0 said:


> I think dbol is a good first oral, just because it's tried and true.
> 
> I do like superdrol, despite the pumps I get from it, but I found that it mostly gave me strength gains and not so as much mass after I dropped it from a cycle in the past.
> 
> That's just my opinion. I don't play with orals much, there are much smarter people than me who will hopefully chime in with their opinions.


Yeah that's what I've read and I think Dbol would be fine for me.



Robdjents said:


> Not requiring AI is somewhat of a misleading statement...your bloodwork will tell you if you need them or not. Be sure to have them on hand juuuust in case.


Exactly, the thing is I will get bloods week 6 when test is saturated and estrogen should not be really moving from there and I will also get bloods week after I start dbol to dial in the AI with added dbol.

Anything else I should look for in the bloodwork? Liver, cholesterol?


----------



## Steeeve (Sep 28, 2021)

Send0 said:


> I think dbol is a good first oral, just because it's tried and true
> 
> 
> Kingjpwn said:
> ...






   Ive found this to be a helpful place to start on Anadrol and superdrol.


----------



## Steeeve (Sep 28, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> Yeah that's what I've read and I think Dbol would be fine for me.
> 
> 
> Exactly, the thing is I will get bloods week 6 when test is saturated and estrogen should not be really moving from there and I will also get bloods week after I start dbol to dial in the AI with added dbol.
> ...


what you watch for and look for side effect wise is going to depend on the compound. That video linked above from Steve goes deeply into side effects between the two compounds and how they interact with health markers in addition to some rough dosage practices.


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## MuscleMedicineMD (Oct 10, 2021)

MY ORIGINAL RELY POST: clearly no reason to be called a liar.. but naysayer's continue..


MuscleMedicineMD said:


> 200-250mg of Test E Transformed me. 33lbs in 8wks @18yo while studying/class premed top school eating almost nothing (laughable compared to my diet/nutritional life today at least). And for the next 6yrs I stayed at 250 Test, adding only small amount of 'anabolics' (+200mg)..
> -For the past 20yrs I havent been shy to tell all newbies on boards, and advise accordingly. "250-300mg is a proper starting point for virgins to the game" (for the millionth time).. go up when NEEDED (define)
> 
> FACTORS: I'd put genetics and age at the top of that list.
> ...


There is no need to add empty conjecture or pure speculation or to be rude (while saying 'no offense' lol)
I work a lot, the time I have to post here, I dont want to have to rebut snide remarks.  last time ideally.


----------



## Migmaster (Oct 10, 2021)

Kingjpwn said:


> Yeah that's what I'm afraid of for real... But have to see to know...
> 
> 
> I meant adrol for 6 weeks, deca for 16 weeks with test - the idea is that from my first blast I know the AI I need from test, I also know the side effects from test so anything new that comes is from the deca. Then until week 11 I'm supposed to know the deca's effects so add in Adrol.


Be careful with the Drol. It's a potent compound


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## Adrenolin (Oct 10, 2021)

I'll be that one... I'd say make the most of your first cycle, not just by running 500mg test, but also a few hundred mg of tren. The saying is true, you'll never make gains like the gains made in your first cycle.


----------



## MuscleMedicineMD (Oct 10, 2021)

Been very busy x 3wks; but remarks here, need addressing here from (mid-September)
FYI, in 9mo 226posts, I have NEVER UTTERED a BAD word about ANY member!  & still..


Badleroybrown said:


> Nothing against this guy. I don’t know him .


Personally, no. But Stanger's? Hardly.
AUG 23rd - 28th: you just sent me 7-8 PM's + your PICS for potential services from me..
BLB-"I just cant get my head around you";  I asked you not to waste my time; you assured me.
I was professional, w/full explanations.  BLB- "all good brotha. best to you" + friendly Convo. so..


Badleroybrown said:


> *HMMMMMM!!!!! 33lbs in 8wks?  His post are suspect. This is why I question everything this guy says.*


Q: WHY is this so unbelievable in YOUR mind??! (why post more baseless insults below?) It reminds me of my chubby friend, every time a skinny sexy girl walked by, she'd say "she's probably anorexic" 
AKA- "suspect". it's an Ego-Syntonic protection mechanism. that's your struggle subconsciously.


----------



## MuscleMedicineMD (Oct 10, 2021)

HERE IT is...(while digging found bunch of good stuff, wasnt wasted time
1st timer; TestE250mg/1ml in a single shot per wk 


*18yo; start @157lbs* (before photo: think- tall, 6'1, natty 18yo who lifts regularly at your gym)
*-- 8wks later-->191+lbs* (luckily taught how to train by competitive BBers/CPT/2 Gym owners)
(University studies were still #1 throughout, unavoidable/limiting factor)
-posted other pics Mo's ago from all those yrs @18-19,21,22-23, Recent; split btw 2threads)

how about Qs like: "whats starting wt? Height? BF% change on this cycle? any pics?"
-----.>BEFORE declaring: "HMMMMMM!!!!! ?? THIS is why I question EVERYTHING this guy says"

Regardless..
33lbs in 8wks (BF% changed little) = "Good-responder" (Hyper? idc what it's labeled)
*But certainly NOT your post*-insinuating: 'he's lying'.  I hope as strangers, *there's zero future rebuts*

Best-MuscleMedicine, MD


----------



## Send0 (Oct 10, 2021)

MuscleMedicineMD said:


> Q: WHY is this so unbelievable in YOUR mind??! (why post more baseless insults below?) It reminds me of my chubby friend, every time a skinny sexy girl walked by, she'd say "she's probably anorexic"
> AKA- "suspect". it's an Ego-Syntonic protection mechanism. that's your struggle subconsciously.


Speaking as a regular user here. Keep in mind I'm not questioning you, just offering perspective on this one part you quoted regarding gaining 33lbs in 8 weeks.

When I hear someone talk about their gains, I always assume lean tissue (i.e. excludes water weight). 

33lbs of pure lean tissue in 8 weeks, from someone who said they were hardly eating anything, just seems pretty crazy. Now if it was 33lbs inclusive of bloat/water weight, and also eating a healthy amount of calories, then that becomes much easier for me to wrap my head around... especially if combined with it being a first cycle.

With all that said... I understand the skepticism, but I am also aware that there are some in this world who are blessed with extreme.hyper response to anabolics. So I would never say it's impossible, just surprising with the context you wrote in your original post.


----------



## Bro Bundy (Oct 10, 2021)

Humphrey said:


> One thing I want to bring up is the way a lot of advice given to young gym junkies is the dosage they require to grow. How you need 4-500 mig of test as a starting dose. This is bullshit. The male body on average makes 7mig of test per day. For a first coarse start low and grow. Get the most out of minimal . If you can't grow of 1ml of test e per week it's probably your diet and lack of quality workouts, not the juice. Stop relying on the
> Gear and start training like you want gains.
> Nothing is for free.


It’s not that u can’t grow on one cc a week . I grow just fine on 125mg . It’s about going in all
the way when it’s time to go all the way . Your message is good less is more I get it . But sometime in like u have to dive in the deep if u want something bad enough. The sides at 250
Can be the same at 500 and your still shut down at 250 . You still need a pct at 250 so why not go for 500? 500 is a perfect first test dose without going over board. 250 is just alittle more then trt lets keep it real .


----------



## MuscleMedicineMD (Oct 10, 2021)

Send0 said:


> When I hear someone talk about their gains, I always assume lean tissue (i.e. excludes water weight).
> 
> 33lbs of pure lean tissue in 8 weeks, from someone who said they were hardly eating anything, just seems pretty crazy. Now if it was 33lbs inclusive of bloat/water weight, and also eating a healthy amount of calories, then that becomes much easier for me to wrap my head around... especially if combined with it being a first cycle.
> 
> With all that said... I understand the skepticism, but I am also aware that there are some in this world who are blessed with extreme.hyper response to anabolics. So I would never say it's impossible, just surprising with the context you wrote in your original post.


Send0 (appreciated btw) but Youre quoting my response w/o quoting his statement: it all context.
read again...Badleroybrown said:
"HMMMMMM!!!!! 33lbs in 8wks? His post are suspect. This is why I question everything this guy says."

I'm very socially adept. This was for sure NOT 1. healthy skepticism, NOT 2. phrased as a Question simply inquiring about context clarity (lean gains, diet or otherwise). NOT 3. anything innocent. a mistake.
**To chalk it up w/ such inaccuracies is completely obfuscating to me.

Furthermore, no one w/o a special tool, can accurately calculate "water-portion content" + "fat-portion content" to subtract and find total true "LEAN TISSUE" gained... That's why it's rarely referred to, which if it were, would *always* be prefaced or adjourned by "lean". This point is utterly moot. 

Also I make clear, he was never seeking the truth; I state - BLB-how about Q's like: "whats starting wt?"
-They werent asked bc he wasnt interested - he would have ASKED. 

MORE Evidence there's no innocent confusion based off a total assumption on his part???
-His NEXT 3 posts made fun of my "Bio/Intro", then stated Im a 'fake MD'="JUST A WAY to entice.." 

Lastly-Am I a stranger to him? Absolutely not, he just asked to me about Coaching HIM. He knows Im highly experienced=Someone who would NEVER be confused in saying "I gained 33 lbs of* pure, LEAN tissue *in 8wks!!! what delusional newbie would be so absurd? He damn well knows Im NEITHER new or absurd in speach.
likely to be continued....MuscleMedicine, MD


----------



## Send0 (Oct 10, 2021)

MuscleMedicineMD said:


> Send0 (appreciated btw) but Youre quoting my response w/o quoting his statement: it all context.
> read again...Badleroybrown said:
> "HMMMMMM!!!!! 33lbs in 8wks? His post are suspect. This is why I question everything this guy says."
> 
> ...


I could take the third paragraph you wrote personally; as I never expected you to do what you wrote, and it reads as a bit of a slap in the face... But this is the internet and who knows the intention of the text.

Most of us here aren't morons and don't have the expectations that you wrote _(people rarely get scanned, why would we expect an 18 year old to do that?)_. I'll just say that, like you mentioned in a post to another user, that I use the mirror and the scale to estimate my body composition and I have a good feel for how much water I'm carrying; if I'm feeling extra fancy I'll use my calipers and tape. I think you had an idea of what I meant by if it was lean tissue vs water weight.

Perhaps I should have just asked you when did you document those gains; immediately at the end of week 8, or after the post cycle maintenance period was completed. Personally I record my final results after maintenance.

To be clear, I don't care about the personal drama going on here. To be honest, it's actually so off putting that I don't care anymore about how the 33lbs were documented or determined to be the total gained from the cycle.

Good luck to both of you.


----------



## MuscleMedicineMD (Oct 10, 2021)

Adrenolin said:


> The saying is true, you'll never make gains like the gains made in your first cycle.


Hello there Adrenolin, while here I wanted to share diff ideas/erase misunderstandings poss. 

-1st cycles are NOT special biochemically/molecularly
-gains are often, not always- best.. not necessarily bc their 1st (naturally the 2 often align)
-It's bc, at your 1st cycle, you're usually the FURTHEST away from genetic/physiologic size ceiling!
(ex. My last cycle in Sept 2020 had best true muscle gain.. bc I was furtherest from prev biggest)

Older falsehoods Ive heard way back 20yrs ago,
-Evidence AR desensitize? nope. lessen as we age? research shows opposite 
ie. scalp AR show epigen changes gaining sensitivity; surgeons told me yrs ago but not my field
Great article on OLDER males as responsive as YOUNGER makes w androgens

*arguement for starting AAS younger which is basically accepted IMO, has been w/me x yrs. i did.

Im medicine, I read CT scans, EKGs, even EEGs; Any Mol.BIO guys to add info on age/AR genetics??

Part 1 of 2.. by MuscleMedicine, MD


----------



## Badleroybrown (Oct 10, 2021)

MuscleMedicineMD said:


> Been very busy x 3wks; but remarks here, need addressing here from (mid-September)
> FYI, in 9mo 226posts, I have NEVER UTTERED a BAD word about ANY member!  & still..
> 
> Personally, no. But Stanger's? Hardly.
> ...





MuscleMedicineMD said:


> Been very busy x 3wks; but remarks here, need addressing here from (mid-September)
> FYI, in 9mo 226posts, I have NEVER UTTERED a BAD word about ANY member!  & still..
> 
> Personally, no. But Stanger's? Hardly.
> ...


Bro don’t you dare come I. Here and FUCKING insinuate that I ever said I wanted your services. What I told you is you” I am not sure you are trying to sham people or not” I also told you that I would not be opposed to trying things out but first I would love to know some vetted members have used you first.”
Bro because your so Fn stupid all I was doing was trying to bring your lying bullshit to light. After you told me


----------



## Badleroybrown (Oct 10, 2021)

MuscleMedicineMD said:


> Hello there Adrenolin, while here I wanted to share diff ideas/erase misunderstandings poss.
> 
> -1st cycles are NOT special biochemically/molecularly
> -gains are often, not always- best.. not necessarily bc their 1st (naturally the 2 often align)
> ...


MY SESSION TIMED OUT SO I AM REPOSTING
Bro don’t you dare come Here and FUCKING insinuate that I ever said I wanted your services. What I told you is you” I am not sure you are trying to sham people or not” I also told you that I would not be opposed to trying things out but first I would love to know some vetted members have used you first.”
Bro because your so Fn stupid all I was doing was trying to bring your lying bullshit to light. Show me anywhere I told you yes to any of your shit. After you told me members that work with you are protected and so are there info. Big fucking deal I sent you a bio and a little about myself. No different in any log or another post that most of us have put out about ourself. Anyways you could not produce any vetted members except for one that you, without his knowledge posted pics of him and used him as your verifications. He never knew you posted pics as far as I know. I also found out that… yes your fucking gear is rotten infection filled. And yet you are still trying to push your services and gear… Bro all you do is try and push out all this data and and regurgitate it back to the community. I don’t give a fuck what kind of dr you are. Or if you are??? Hmmmm. All you do is push your services.. Why would a Big Dr try and make money selling gear on a UG bb community with personal training services. As far as I am concerned you are a fraud.. don’t ever insinuate things about me again you little fucking Punk


----------



## Badleroybrown (Oct 10, 2021)

BTW MmD if you want me to blow you up with the other pm’s I had with another member about your gear and not having permission to post his pics I will…


----------



## Send0 (Oct 10, 2021)

MuscleMedicineMD said:


> Send0 (appreciated btw) but Youre quoting my response w/o quoting his statement: it all context.
> read again...Badleroybrown said:
> "HMMMMMM!!!!! 33lbs in 8wks? His post are suspect. This is why I question everything this guy says."
> 
> ...





Badleroybrown said:


> MY SESSION TIMED OUT SO I AM REPOSTING
> Bro don’t you dare come Here and FUCKING insinuate that I ever said I wanted your services. What I told you is you” I am not sure you are trying to sham people or not” I also told you that I would not be opposed to trying things out but first I would love to know some vetted members have used you first.”
> Bro because your so Fn stupid all I was doing was trying to bring your lying bullshit to light. Show me anywhere I told you yes to any of your shit. After you told me members that work with you are protected and so are there info. Big fucking deal I sent you a bio and a little about myself. No different in any log or another post that most of us have put out about ourself. Anyways you could not produce any vetted members except for one that you, without his knowledge posted pics of him and used him as your verifications. He never knew you posted pics as far as I know. I also found out that… yes your fucking gear is rotten infection filled. And yet you are still trying to push your services and gear… Bro all you do is try and push out all this data and and regurgitate it back to the community. I don’t give a fuck what kind of dr you are. Or if you are??? Hmmmm. All you do is push your services.. Why would a Big Dr try and make money selling gear on a UG bb community with personal training services. As far as I am concerned you are a fraud.. don’t ever insinuate things about me again you little fucking Punk





Badleroybrown said:


> BTW MmD if you want me to blow you up with the other pm’s I had with another member about your gear and not having permission to post his pics I will…


Things are getting heated. I ask that if you continue the conversation that we reel it in before a line gets crossed. If that is not possible then please move the conversation to either PMs or the flame forum.

You're both welcome to continue your conversation here... but understand that I am now watching this thread for if a line gets crossed. Personally I don't like taking action against anyone, please understand this.

I don't want to put on the moderator hat. So I'm asking that you both help me out here.


----------



## Steeeve (Oct 11, 2021)

These threads are better than netflix most mornings


----------



## MuscleMedicineMD (Oct 16, 2021)

Badleroybrown said:


> MY SESSION TIMED OUT SO I AM REPOSTING
> Bro don’t you dare come Here and FUCKING insinuate that I ever said I wanted your services. What I told you is you” I am not sure you are trying to sham people or not” I also told you that I would not be opposed to trying things out but first I would love to know some vetted members have used you first.”
> Bro because your so Fn stupid all I was doing was trying to bring your lying bullshit to light. Show me anywhere I told you yes to any of your shit. After you told me members that work with you are protected and so are there info. Big fucking deal I sent you a bio and a little about myself. No different in any log or another post that most of us have put out about ourself. Anyways you could not produce any vetted members except for one that you, without his knowledge posted pics of him and used him as your verifications. He never knew you posted pics as far as I know. I also found out that… yes your fucking gear is rotten infection filled. And yet you are still trying to push your services and gear… Bro all you do is try and push out all this data and and regurgitate it back to the community. I don’t give a fuck what kind of dr you are. Or if you are??? Hmmmm. All you do is push your services.. Why would a Big Dr try and make money selling gear on a UG bb community with personal training services. As far as I am concerned you are a fraud.. don’t ever insinuate things about me again you little fucking Punk


PERFECT. (not only a cluster A/PPD, + likely sub-clinical MR..that post says it all lol)
I'm MATURELY trying to *deal with just 1 of your BS statements*..like an adult..
(I never even said a single nasty word about you or cursed) YET you are already adding 10 more BS lines..cursing, name calling and the rest of your childish temper tantrum...
--> this will take all month if you cant focus on your stupid, empty comments, ONE at a time.

YOU write ALL this extra non-sense, same old, BUT DONT WRITE 1 WORD about the
MAIN TOPIC = YOUR 1st COMMENTS..
IT was YOU who INSINUATED things about ME. It was YOU..for no good reason
_Badleroybrown supidly said:
"HMMMMMM!!!!! 33lbs in 8wks? His post are suspect. This is why I question everything this guy says."_

Picture= Me having just gained 34lbs in 8wks!!!






18yo, 1st timer- Test250 x 8wks. BF% changed little. NEVER said "LEAN only gains/no water"etc
34lbs. 8wks using Less THAN < your famous "TRT dose"---> already much better than You!

THIS WAS ALL YOU NEEDED to really comment on. (The preface was background for the post)
-Normal person ex reply: "Yeah, i really thought it was BS, but i jumped to conclusions. my bad"

but NOOOO *you have to add +10 more INSULTS to 3 previous INJURIES...like the ADHD trash-talker*


----------



## MuscleMedicineMD (Oct 16, 2021)

Badleroybrown said:


> Don’t you dare come Here and FUCKING insinuate that I ever said I wanted your services...


MMMD: _Your ENTIRE REPLY INSINUATES IT, REPEATEDLY_. LOL. tbh, You do NEED a COACH, BADLY! 

"What I told you is you” I am not sure you are trying to sham people or not” I also told you that* I would not be opposed to trying things out* but first I would love to know some vetted members have used you first.” *Bro because your so Fkn stupid all I was doing was trying to bring your lying bullshit to light." *
_MMMD: all by using YOUR ACTUAL LIES & BS!!!  Yep, you totally got me good! a Freudian genius! _

"Show me anywhere I told you yes to any of your shit?"
_MMMD: You SENT ME your PICTURES. Straight out of my directions on how to be evaluated. That is when I assumed you were serious!  "stupid"? _ well now i know you are a 2 faced liar. 100% clear.

"After you told me members that work with you are protected and so are there info."
MMMD: So 1. you are not a member working or potentially going to work with me YET 2. want to be "protected" like a member who is working with me?? Well. YOU ARE, that's why despite your unrequested insinuations & insults, I never shared ANY personal info or your flabby photos.

"Big fucking deal I sent you a BIO and a little about myself. No different in any log or another post that most of us have put out about ourself."
MMMD: 1. Its not! BIG DEAL= you denying it in the 1st sentence then confirming it the next 5 sentences including here, and bragging how it was all to trick me, DEMONSTRATES you have a serious fnking Personality disorder!   

 "Anyways you could not produce any vetted members except for one that you, without his knowledge posted pics of him and used him as your verifications. He never knew you posted pics as far as I know.
MMMD: 
1. So you have spoken to said vetted member who I Coached for 3+ months = NOT a fraud then.
BUT dont think in 3+mo of speaking everyday, we ever spoke about posting photos/details on the very forum we met at?? I didnt have an ADVERT at that time, but have endless text msgs of his complete happiness with our success together. 
2. FACT- Member clients do NOT want to be ID'd bc of potential harassment/bullying, by a small clique group (there are cliques, some are rude) OR  receive PM's bc of INTIMIDATION by guys like YOU, who surely let your neg feelings be known.  YOU've been mentioned BY NAME not surprisingly.
(3. Many non-members, also find me here, are legally afraid of even being on such a board..)

"I also found out… yes your fucking gear is rotten infection filled." 
MMMD: 1. I USE ALL MY OWN GEAR so making anything less than would be dumb. 2. My Coaching would be hurt greatly by subpar gear 3. Sterility is relatively easy and cheap to accomplish. 4. Ample LAB EXP & Operating EXP (>100 surgeries). SO THAT in particular has never been an issue. Production is a continual process of learning/perfecting my craft using client feedback. 

" Bro all you do is try and push out all this data and and regurgitate it back to the community."
MMMD: Regurg? like Mitral or Aortic? lol thats a sin im least-not at all guilty of.. you wouldnt even be able to differentiate Insights v. Book v. Article.. push out Data? show me this.. 

"As far as I am concerned you are a fraud.." 
MMMD:  What's left? they all have pictures/proof/posts/testimony attached. 
You on the other hand, have NO accomplishments. 
SO.. FOCUS on YOU, On things YOU CAN DO (Road work, eating carbs); LEAVE ME ALONE 


PART 1 of 2  by MuscleMedicine, MD


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## Adrenolin (Oct 16, 2021)

Staying tuned for part 2. 🍿


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## CJ (Oct 16, 2021)

I'm just hoping it ends soon, I'm probably going to have to spend my evening reading through the thread, and moving the battle posts to the flame forum. 🤢🤮


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## MuscleMedicineMD (Oct 16, 2021)

Badleroybrown said:


> *Why would a Big Dr try and make money selling gear on a UG bb community with personal training services?? *


(even your words are wrong, Coaching is not PT, I require 2yrs MIN GYM EXP=the #1 reason someone is turned away! While the least likely, only seen it 1x: Physique is beyond hope/saving=BLb case.nk)

1. IF I had NOT done this BEFORE medicine, I might not be. IF I were still MARRIED, I might not be.

**It's a old but renewed, fun, challenging, HOBBIE!!  Your CYNICISM &/or Jealousy BLINDS you:
Coaching isnt replacing this "BIG Dr's" career or income in even the tiniest of ways, currently.
(which is why I can charge so little/for time invested. $/MONTH is $TINYtiny/HR!!) it's much less than you'd TIP your waiter!! I'm Whole Foods + Pharma BUT @ Walmart disc.$$ prices!

2. COACHING MOTIVATES ME in a variety of ways & that motivation is reciprocated to the client.
-BBing was discontinued/sacrificed very young for me, in order to fulfill my Medical dreams.
-Helping clients succeed in competitive BBing, would be especially fulfilling.
-It's another challenging area to set goals in.. I seek wealth in accomplishments, not material stuff

3. My OWN Gear *guarantees* 100% the client is getting the correct products, correctly dosed, w/ ZERO chance of gear caused infection, AND cheapest anywhere bc I always match/beat prices to ensure best client outcome. Outsourcing doesnt protect the client/me. BUT may be only way one day.
-It is part of coaching to have items on hand as well.
- It also establishes possible future clients as they get to know you better via a product they can touch, coaching, like teaching, is less tangible. but lasts.

Hyp.Research: 26 AAS users, 3mo cycle, 50% get ME their last 2mo vs 50% get 60mg WINSTROL/d.
Pred.RESULTS: Coached clients gained Sig MORE during, ++ KEPT 33% MORE Post cycle! HUGE+

BLB- "don’t ever insinuate things about me again"
MMMD: So you can say anything you want about me, but even the truth about you is off-limits?

* EVERYTHING YOU WRITE ABOUT ME IS INSINUATION AFTER INSINUATION!! ARE YOU BLIND??
This all started with YOU writing BS about ME! for no reason but to flame

*DONT PM ME again. DONT WASTE other people valuable time!! DONT TALK about me!

2 of 2 by MuscleMedicine, MD


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## Steeeve (Oct 16, 2021)

Part 2 did not disappoint.


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## Badleroybrown (Oct 16, 2021)

1 of 1. Yes your right MMMD… you do you and I will do me… have a good day sir..*I know when I am intlegigtaly outsmertad… 
1. Of 1+1 =2. Not trying to keep this going. It was rong of me to inisignuate things about you. So much hate and wrong-doing towards people in society in general. So if this is your way of giving back to the community I commend you for giving back.. 🤙*


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## Badleroybrown (Oct 16, 2021)

MMMD… let’s call a Truce. What do you say?? Fist Bump. 🤛🤛🤙


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## MuscleMedicineMD (Oct 24, 2021)

Badleroybrown said:


> MMMD… let’s call a Truce. What do you say?? Fist Bump. 🤛🤛🤙


Gracious. Yes. I never understood the animosity in the 1st place; In fact- the 1st wk you joined here, I remember, I wrote you a compliment & told you 'I'm a massive Jimmy fan (jim croce) & can recite every song verse from "going back to Georgia to Alabama rain"  so I have a good feeling about you and welcome you' (recalling my pos.sentiment at the time).

Having you officially out of my hair/posts will have made the TIME spent replying here (+ones I didnt post just saved), that could have been spent helping members, somewhat worth it 
*The replies also served to inform members who may have wondered similarly, which is why the last Q got addressed individually.

OVER & DONE, 
any/all interaction/directed comments (pos or neg) ends hence forth,
Best to you as well- MuscleMedicine, M.D.

(BLB) quick note: "client", "as a Coach/Physician" isn't advertising, simply context for unfamiliar members to better gauge their interpretations; I dont have post#'s or "Board Med Doctor" to anchor my advice/reflect authenticity. As per my convos w higher-ups, I can PM but "pushing" services directly can-->my-often detailed- deletion-so I try to avoid this. My Coaching is extremely good for the price (this isnt Dave P. 2-3emails/MO >3x/$price, copy&paste info/diet), lots of guys would truly benefit from my style but are unfamiliar, unsure, too experienced, know it all, more gear=better investment etc. Thus, IF a post seem "pushy", it's just enthusiasm to reach more community members, not annoy ppl.


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## Gearwheel (Oct 24, 2021)

I did one cycle; 500mg test-e per week for 16 weeks. Would rather have started on 250 and titrate it up every 6 weeks for a longer cycle. Just to clearly set a reference for myself at which dose I get certain side-effects. 

Totally agree with you. Once you start a cycle, you're destined to start more cycles. So why not ease into it, give your body more time to adapt to all the physiological changes and give yourself more valuable and tangible information on how you react to certain dosages.


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