# NPP vs Deca



## Beefcake (Oct 3, 2016)

Thinking of doing a Deca test cycle but it's cheaper to do NPP and test.  Which will have better results?  And at what dosage??


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## DocDePanda187123 (Oct 3, 2016)

Its the same compound just different esters....


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## DF (Oct 3, 2016)

Love deca! 600mg/week min!


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## Beefcake (Oct 3, 2016)

Do you run NPP twice a week like Deca?


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## ToolSteel (Oct 3, 2016)

Deca once a week. 

Npp twice.


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## Beefcake (Oct 3, 2016)

So I could run test e and NPP at 600 twice a week or lower doses!  I've done test Deca at 600 before with a dbol Kickstarter


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## ToolSteel (Oct 3, 2016)

Correct. The PP ester isn't that far off from enenthate.


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## Maijah (Oct 3, 2016)

I've heard 2mgs per lb of bodyweight is the ideal dosage for deca/npp. However I have ran it at twice that and the gains were definitely noticeable.


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## Uncle manny (Oct 3, 2016)

How's the shut down on nandy?


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## PillarofBalance (Oct 3, 2016)

Uncle manny said:


> How's the shut down on nandy?



Pretty hard for some. It's partly how I wound up on trt. Hell even dropping it and going back to trt sucks.


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## Beefcake (Oct 3, 2016)

I loved Deca no sides at all for me.


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## Seeker (Oct 3, 2016)

Which one you choose will depend on a couple of factor. 
The length of your cycle
Your intended goal of the cycle. 

Yes deca and npp are the same compounds but If your goal is to bulk and run a longer cycle I would run the deca at a higher dosage. 
If you're looking to run a shorter cycle with other goals in mind besides hulking I would run the NPP at a lower or more moderate dose.


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## ECKSRATED (Oct 3, 2016)

500-600 of deca is wonderful. Best steroid out there!!!!

Seek is right. Longer cycle to with deca shorter go with npp


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## Beefcake (Oct 3, 2016)

Looking for a12-14 week cycle.  Lean bulking cycle.


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## Seeker (Oct 3, 2016)

Then you should go with the NPP.


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## Onk (Oct 3, 2016)

ToolSteel said:


> Deca once a week.
> 
> Npp twice.



you and your low pinning tendency!

I pin deca 2x/wk and npp EoD! 

Between dorso glutes, ventro glutes, lats, delts, pecs and quads there's more than enough spots to rotate between


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## ToolSteel (Oct 3, 2016)

Onk said:


> you and your low pinning tendency!
> 
> I pin deca 2x/wk and npp EoD!
> 
> Between dorso glutes, ventro glutes, lats, delts, pecs and quads there's more than enough spots to rotate between


Lol. If it works for you and you don't mind the extra pokes, then party onward my friend.


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## PillarofBalance (Oct 3, 2016)

Onk said:


> you and your low pinning tendency!
> 
> I pin deca 2x/wk and npp EoD!
> 
> Between dorso glutes, ventro glutes, lats, delts, pecs and quads there's more than enough spots to rotate between



You might actually be shortchanging yourself here.  Peak plasma levels will be higher with a lesser pinning frequency. And with deca it's such a long ester you don't need to worry about bottoming out come the end of the week.


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## ECKSRATED (Oct 3, 2016)

If I'm running more than a lube dose of deca than I'll pin twice a week. Yea I said lube


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## Jada (Oct 4, 2016)

Beefcake said:


> Looking for a12-14 week cycle.  Lean bulking cycle.



That's a tease,  I say 18 weeks.


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## Onk (Oct 4, 2016)

PillarofBalance said:


> You might actually be shortchanging yourself here.  Peak plasma levels will be higher with a lesser pinning frequency. And with deca it's such a long ester you don't need to worry about bottoming out come the end of the week.



But wouldn't, on average, levels be the same? Peak may be higher but there's also a time when they're lower after the 4 day mark, compared to the new shot in e3.5d bringing in a new consistent peak.


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## gymrat827 (Oct 4, 2016)

Jada said:


> That's a tease,  I say 18 weeks.



16-22 for deca.   Npp for 16 or less


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## saltylifter (Oct 4, 2016)

On npp right now and love it


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## SFGiants (Oct 4, 2016)

Deca is for very long cycles and pinned 2x a week

Npp is for shorter cycles and pinned every third day or like most Monday/Wednesday/Friday

You can do well on 500 to 800mg a week of deca and 400 to 600mg a week of npp

So for you I'd suggest this

500mg week Test
420mg week NPP (420 is an odd number to most but it's an easy measure without over using it, 420/3=140mg M/W/F)

Test for 24 weeks
NPP for 16 week

1st 4 weeks test only
Last 4 weeks test only

If you're going to do it do it smart and safe.


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## SFGiants (Oct 4, 2016)

Get some cialis also and run it at 20mg a day!


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## R1rider (Oct 4, 2016)

Npp, love it...


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## John Ziegler (Oct 5, 2016)

Seeker said:


> If you're looking to run a shorter cycle with other goals in mind besides *hulking* I would run the NPP at a lower or more moderate dose.



Was that a typo or you did that on purpose ?

At any rate that's really cool and will be saying it from now on.



SFGiants said:


> Get some cialis also and run it at 20mg a day!



Have been getting my trt together at the moment but would like to blast that Npp cycle you just outlined.

Any thoughts or recommendation on cabergoline doses, how to run it or use it if necessary ?


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## John Ziegler (Oct 5, 2016)

PillarofBalance said:


> Hell even dropping it and going back to trt sucks.



What dose were you running ?

How long were you on ? 

What sucked about it ?


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## BigJohnny (Oct 5, 2016)

I'm wanting to run some Deca after my fat loss, would 400 a week be sufficient or should I go higher. I have never used it before.


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## DocDePanda187123 (Oct 5, 2016)

Onk said:


> But wouldn't, on average, levels be the same? Peak may be higher but there's also a time when they're lower after the 4 day mark, compared to the new shot in e3.5d bringing in a new consistent peak.



If on average they're the same, why subject yourself to more frequent injections than is necessary for no reason?

William Llewellyn had something in his book Anabolics that referenced some evidence that less frequent pinning with higher peaks resulted in slightly better progress. I can't get the quote right now as I have an Ebook version of his text on my phone but the phone is crapped out and using my old phone now


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## SFGiants (Oct 5, 2016)

Zeigler said:


> Was that a typo or you did that on purpose ?
> 
> At any rate that's really cool and will be saying it from now on.
> 
> ...



I have never needed cabergoline and would only take pharm  grade, just keep estro at bay with aromasin.

If need take 1mg a week split in 2 doses.

http://aurapharm.com/dostinex_cabergoline.htm


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## Onk (Oct 5, 2016)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> If on average they're the same, why subject yourself to more frequent injections than is necessary for no reason?
> 
> William Llewellyn had something in his book Anabolics that referenced some evidence that less frequent pinning with higher peaks resulted in slightly better progress. I can't get the quote right now as I have an Ebook version of his text on my phone but the phone is crapped out and using my old phone now



1/ that's my point
2/ if that's true, then fair enough, will want to see that evidence, or if that's the book I can try to find it today sometime! thanks

my own 3/ though, pinning around 6-10cc a week, i usually split that into 3-4 injections anyway between whatever I'm running, be in test, deca, tren, mast, primo


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## DocDePanda187123 (Oct 5, 2016)

Onk said:


> 1/ that's my point
> 2/ if that's true, then fair enough, will want to see that evidence, or if that's the book I can try to find it today sometime! thanks
> 
> my own 3/ though, pinning around 6-10cc a week, i usually split that into 3-4 injections anyway between whatever I'm running, be in test, deca, tren, mast, primo



1) but you're the one pinning more frequently aren't you? At least when compared to TS and I. 

2) it's def in Anabolics. Don't remember which chapter but it's in there. When I get my phone fixed or buy a new one I'll get I for you. I can't update this old iphone to download iBooks to even get the book now lol. 

3) personally, at 10cc a week, I would do 2, maybe 3 injections a week. If they're all long esters id pin all my test one day and all my tren or deca another day and if I did a third day I'd pin another compound that day. Or split a third compound among the two pin days.


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## ToolSteel (Oct 6, 2016)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> 1) but you're the one pinning more frequently aren't you? At least when compared to TS and I.
> 
> 2) it's def in Anabolics. Don't remember which chapter but it's in there. When I get my phone fixed or buy a new one I'll get I for you. I can't update this old iphone to download iBooks to even get the book now lol.
> 
> 3) personally, at 10cc a week, I would do 2, maybe 3 injections a week. If they're all long esters id pin all my test one day and all my tren or deca another day and if I did a third day I'd pin another compound that day. Or split a third compound among the two pin days.


5ml barrels ftw. VG soaks it right up.


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## Bro Bundy (Oct 6, 2016)

I've done cycles where I pinned long esters once a week and cycles I've pinned twice.. I see no difference ..for me it depends on the oil amount how many pins a week I use


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## HollyWoodCole (Oct 6, 2016)

Yep, same here.  Sheer oil volume is what dictates that for me assuming the esters are longer.


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## NbleSavage (Oct 6, 2016)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> 1) but you're the one pinning more frequently aren't you? At least when compared to TS and I.
> 
> 2) it's def in Anabolics. Don't remember which chapter but it's in there. When I get my phone fixed or buy a new one I'll get I for you. I can't update this old iphone to download iBooks to even get the book now lol.
> 
> 3) personally, at 10cc a week, I would do 2, maybe 3 injections a week. If they're all long esters id pin all my test one day and all my tren or deca another day and if I did a third day I'd pin another compound that day. Or split a third compound among the two pin days.



I pin Deca 1x weekly. 7 day half life. Leaves more flexibility if I'm running other compounds with it (test, etc).


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## DocDePanda187123 (Oct 6, 2016)

NbleSavage said:


> I pin Deca 1x weekly. 7 day half life. Leaves more flexibility if I'm running other compounds with it (test, etc).



Dr. Scally has an article stating the half life of deca can be from 7 to almost 12 days. That's a pretty large window!!! I agree, I pin it once a week as well


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## SFGiants (Oct 6, 2016)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> Dr. Scally has an article stating the half life of deca can be from 7 to almost 12 days. That's a pretty large window!!! I agree, I pin it once a week as well



I pin my TRT test c once a week the half life is 8 days seems to be fine but a new thing for me I was always 2x a week, no difference so as far as advice i stick with my old protocol until my new one is months into play and my personal experience has changed.

We discussed this one before I'm one of personal experience over theory like yourself while I believe both are needed.

My personal experience with your theory is matching up so far, I always pined fast shit M/W/F stuff like tren ace not ed or eod and had great results I always thought the stabilization of blood levels was too extreme with people.


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## ToolSteel (Oct 6, 2016)

Heck I still pin once a week on blast. Can't tell any difference. At least no negative differences.


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## DocDePanda187123 (Oct 6, 2016)

SFGiants said:


> I pin my TRT test c once a week the half life is 8 days seems to be fine but a new thing for me I was always 2x a week, no difference so as far as advice i stick with my old protocol until my new one is months into play and my personal experience has changed.
> 
> We discussed this one before I'm one of personal experience over theory like yourself while I believe both are needed.
> 
> My personal experience with your theory is matching up so far, I always pined fast shit M/W/F stuff like tren ace not ed or eod and had great results I always thought the stabilization of blood levels was too extreme with people.



I've done test e, test cyp, tren e, and deca once a week and also twice a week. Never saw a difference. I did tren a 3x/wk I think but I didn't have enough of it to also try EOD or ed.


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## ECKSRATED (Oct 7, 2016)

Does any one have bloods from the seventh day during a blast if pinning once a week compared to twice a week? I always pin twice a week for long esters on a blast.


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## Runningwild (Oct 7, 2016)

Maybe just different effects for different people.  I don't have and blood proof but when doing more frequent pins like npp m/w/f and longer esters 2 times a week I feel better with my mood.  Maybe it's psychological  but it works for me so that's what I do.  I would definetly prefer to pin less frequently though


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## Onk (Oct 7, 2016)

Runningwild said:


> Maybe just different effects for different people.  I don't have and blood proof but when doing more frequent pins like npp m/w/f and longer esters 2 times a week I feel better with my mood.  Maybe it's psychological  but it works for me so that's what I do.  I would definetly prefer to pin less frequently though



that's where the term "hormonal rollercoaster" comes from. The less frequent pinners experience higher highs, but lower lows.


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## SFGiants (Oct 7, 2016)

ECKSRATED said:


> Does any one have bloods from the seventh day during a blast if pinning once a week compared to twice a week? I always pin twice a week for long esters on a blast.



My trt of 130mg week test c pinned on Fridays drawn blood on Tuesday came up  945.


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## ECKSRATED (Oct 7, 2016)

SFGiants said:


> My trt of 130mg week test c pinned on Fridays drawn blood on Tuesday came up  945.



Do u know what it is seven days after? Just curious.


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## Runningwild (Oct 7, 2016)

Onk said:


> that's where the term "hormonal rollercoaster" comes from. The less frequent pinners experience higher highs, but lower lows.




Yea definitely, just see some people say they notice no difference


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## John Ziegler (Oct 7, 2016)

SFGiants said:


> My trt of 130mg week test c pinned on Fridays drawn blood on Tuesday came up  945.



How much do you weight sir ?


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## SFGiants (Oct 7, 2016)

Zeigler said:


> How much do you weight sir ?



240, lost 20lbs no longer 260 :32 (11):


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## ToolSteel (Oct 7, 2016)

ECKSRATED said:


> Do u know what it is seven days after? Just curious.


The answer you're seeking is highly individual; you know this already. 
Day 6 on 125/wk I still pulled over a grand.


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## DocDePanda187123 (Oct 7, 2016)

ToolSteel said:


> The answer you're seeking is highly individual; you know this already.
> Day 6 on 125/wk I still pulled over a grand.



Were you pooping when you typed this?


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## ToolSteel (Oct 7, 2016)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> Were you pooping when you typed this?


Actually yes lol


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## DocDePanda187123 (Oct 7, 2016)

ToolSteel said:


> Actually yes lol



So am I......#TwInzIEz


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## kingblasted (Oct 8, 2016)

Thanks for starting this thread beefcake.  Was wondering about both of these compounds myself.  Looks like I'll be going with deca


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## Runningwild (Oct 8, 2016)

I had mostly done deca in the past but once I did Npp I liked it much better noticed the positives quicker (due to the shorter ester) and noticed less of the sides.  Feel like npp is a little cleaner for me personally


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## ECKSRATED (Oct 8, 2016)

ToolSteel said:


> The answer you're seeking is highly individual; you know this already.
> Day 6 on 125/wk I still pulled over a grand.



I was asking sfg. And thank u for your answer because I think we're running the same gear


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## SFGiants (Oct 8, 2016)

ECKSRATED said:


> Do u know what it is seven days after? Just curious.



No but shouldn't be low.


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## DF (Oct 9, 2016)

On 125mg/5 days my range is between 900-1300.  Bloods taken on the day the pin is due.


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## Bicepticon (Oct 9, 2016)

DF said:


> Love deca! 600mg/week min!



I think 600+mg is the best too!


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## TriniJuice (Oct 9, 2016)

NPP > Deca
FtW....


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## Rip (Oct 9, 2016)

I've done Deca before and didn't like the side effects.
What do I need to have before starting?
I've read some things that said Caber and others that said Proviron. 
This description doesn't say anything about caber, but it mentions Proviron: 
The androgens contained in 400 mg/week also help to accelerate the body's regeneration............ The risk of potential water retention and aromatizing to estrogen can be successfully prevented by combining the use of Proviron with Nolvadex. 
I'm already doing TRT. 
Thanks DF




DF said:


> Love deca! 600mg/week min!


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