# 8 Weeks in Blast - Can't Gain Anything



## username1 (Oct 3, 2012)

I started TRT back in February. I had started working out and working with 3J before I got on TRT few months prior. I was probably near 180 lbs. I'd guess close to 20% BF, didn't have it checked at the time. Over time and after starting TRT, I came down to 15% BF and 162 lbs. after a certain point, no matter how much I worked out, I can't go under or over this 162 lbs. I've fluctuated a bit over up to 166 lbs. since I started my blast on August 1st. However, I weighed myself today and am at 162.8 lbs. It's kind of making me depressed and don't know what's going on. I'm working with spongy now, after working with 3J and trying to gain and not being able to I was wondering if it's him (but I did consider it being me as well, because of how much I'm eating) and now after working with Spongy for a month or so, it's clear to me that I am the problem. 

I don't want to list my meal plan because I'm working with spongy but, I eat 6 times a day, with an occasional missed meal. Lately, usually no protein shakes unless it's to replace a meal because of my schedule or work but, it's occasional I'm getting all my protein mostly from food. I eat a big meal every 2 hrs. going to the grocery store every week, it feels like I'm spending more money eating at home now than I used to when I used to eat out. I have no problem turning down the junk food I used to eat, I take my food to work now and eat what's on my meal plan.

3J had said that I might have an over-active thyroid and so I had it checked and my TSH came out just slightly higher than the cut-off but, the thing is that if your TSH is high that means you're supposed to have trouble losing weight. When your TSH is low is when you're supposed to have problems gaining weight. So, it doesn't make any sense that I'm having problems gaining with an elevated TSH. I'm on vitamin d shots now to see if it will help with TSH. I've been on these shots for a month I guess, not really noticing any difference. Haven't had my blood checked to see where my TSH is. 

So my TRT dose was test cyp 210mg E5D when I first started, then I brought it down to 210mg E7D. Because at E5D my blood test showed i was 1500+ My blast that I started on Aug. 1st was at 420mg E7D (split in two shots Mon/thurs), and this week I'm increasing my dose to 540mg/E7D. The scripted test I get is 210mg/ml so that's the reason the numbers are like that. I'm supposed to start var at the end of this month I think, or next month. My blast was going to be 20 weeks at 420mg/wk but, since I can't gain anything, I wanted to increase it this week. Then in the last 6 weeks I was going to run the var. 

I've been planning my next blast and want to run NPP + tbol. I'm wondering if at the end of this blast I don't gain anything should I just keep going and start the NPP? I know after I'm done with the var I need to give myself a break to recover from the oral so initially I was planning on kickstarting my 2nd blast with tbol but, that was thinking that I was going to make gains after my first blast and give myself a break and come back to the 2nd blast later. However, I'm thinking if I don't make any gains, I don't want to just stop and waste time for nothing (though my health is important so if I have to, I will of course) so I figured if i just keep going and add the NPP then instead of kickstarting with tbol, I'll just run it at the end of the blast like I did the var, so that would give me enough time to recover from the oral. Would that work? Because I'm on TRT so it doesn't really matter how long I'm on? As long as I get my blood test done and everything seems fine? Or what about if I just add the NPP now? Because if I can't gain anything off 420/mg wk, 8 weeks in or if I give myself another 6 weeks on 540 mg/wk and don't see any gains, then continuing to run it seems pointless like I'm just wasting gear. If I add in the NPP then at least I can make use of the test.

As for training when I was on trt I was doing p90x but, then people told me it was shit and to go to the gym, so I started going to the gym when i started the blast. I've been working with a trainer at the gym that sets me up with the workout plans. Also the last two weeks I stopped doing cardio on Tues/Thurs. Even then I only walk on the treadmill, I don't run or even jog but, I would do about 1.5-2 miles and on varies inclines, elliptical after working out on resistance days. I thought maybe if I stop the cardio then it might help me to gain but, after checking my weight today I'm back down to 162.8.


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## username1 (Oct 3, 2012)

Also am I controlling my bloating that well that it seems like I'm not even gaining water weight? because my starting weight was 162. I drink about 1.5 liter to a gallon of water each night. I'm also taking an AI. Is that possible that I'm controlling my water weight that well? Only time I bloat is at night before I go to sleep, I look in the bathroom mirror and look bloated. I weighed myself last night and I weighed 169 lbs. then I woke up in the morning to 162.8


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## Hollywood72 (Oct 3, 2012)

I didn't start gaining until about week 8. Are you gaining definition/lean mass? The scale might not be where you want it but you could be burning fat and adding a little muscle. 

I'm sure the experts will have more to add but it might be helpful if you post your workout routine


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## username1 (Oct 3, 2012)

I started seeing definition on trt but, after a certain point it seems like things have stayed the same overall. 

Well, my workout plan is being updated by the trainer. Basically from August to now I was doing the same exercises Mon/Wed/Fri we just now are working on the plan where we're isolating muscle groups on different days. The last two weeks he's been updating the plan so I'll be doing Mon - Arms, Wed. Chest/Back and Fri. - legs. Because of his schedule it's taken the last two weeks to get my new plan setup. I'm going to go in tomorrow for chest/back day and if I see him schedule Thurs. to setup my arms day, so that way i can have my new plan completely setup. 

I will list all my exercises he has had me doing and what my new plan looks like so far, except for arms day because it's not setup yet.

Below was "phase 1" I did this for a month. I know the weight is light,  I had asked him about doing heavier weight and less reps and he mentioned it's to strengthen tendons. He even used the example of people juicing and getting huge muscles but, having weak tendons. I tried to follow what he said after he told me that but, prior to that I just didn't like lifting so light so I would try to do my max at times or at least to where it gets difficult in the last few reps. However, I'm seeing now people say on here and ology that to get the bodybuilder look you're supposed to do high rep exercises, and so I don't really care about strength that much not as much as I do about looking good, so I guess I should continue with the higher rep sets.

So this was it, but like I said most of the time I wasn't doing this weight. I should have probably been keeping track of it and writing down exactly what weight I was doing etc. 

Ok, so here was "phase 1" for one month on Mon / Wed / Fri.

Exercise / Weight / Reps / Sets

Seated Cable Row (Back) Closed Grip	40 lb.	10	3
Chest press / Precor machine	10 lb. (each side)	10	3
Side Dumbell Raise	5 lbs.	10	3
Rope Cable Push Down (triceps)	40 lbs.	10	3
Hammer grip dumbell curls	12 lbs.	12	3

Cardio - Resistance Days (Mon/Wed/Fri)

Lying side crunches		10 each side
lying crunches (elbows to knees)		10
push through crunches		10
medicine ball side twist	6 or 8 lb. ball	10 each side

Elliptical - 25 minutes - crossramp 10. resistance 6.

Cardio - non lift days (tues / thurs)

treadmill - various inclines (not going to list each and every) - about 40 min.

Phase 2 - one month: (Mon/Wed/Fri)

Go to 15 reps on each exercise before increasing weight.			

Squat Curl Press	15	10	3
Smith Machine Squats		15-25	   1
Cable Lat Extensions (Rope) -	50	10	3
Smith Machine Squats		15-25	    1
Hoist Bicep Curls	50	10	3
Hoist Seated Dip	50	10	3
Smith Machine Squats		15-25	   1
Precor Pec Flys	50	15	3
Close Grip Lat Pull Down 	70	10	3
Smith Machine Squats		15-25   1	1
Cable Core Rotation (High to Low)	20	10	2
Cable Core Rotation (Low to High)	20	10	2

Phase 3 (isolating muscle groups) - just started this last week and so far only legs and chest/back day has been setup. arms day should be setup by the end of the week hopefully.

Chest/Back - Wednesday				

Cable Fly Press (on knees)	30	10	4	One hand over, One hand under each rep
Smith Machine (bench press)	25	15	3	
Incline Dumbell Fly (2nd notch)	15	10	4	
Iso Cable Lat Pull (Knees)	40	15	4	
Seated Cable Row - Straight Bar Grip	50	10	4	alternate overhand/underhand grip
Cable Lat Extensions (EZ Grip Bar)	40	12	3	
Hyper Extensions	 n/a	10	3	

Legs - Friday

Leg Press	- I just started this for the first time last Friday and don't remember exactly which weight I did and he didn't write that part down. So, I have to double check. I think I started with 90 lbs. (i recall a 45 lb. weight on each side) and then supposed to do reps of 25/20/15/10 and increase weight each time and I think it's 50 lbs. each time because I recall adding a 25 lb. weight to each side each time but, I could be wrong and maybe I was adding 1 - 25 lbs. weight each time. So, I have to double check.
Leg Ext.	50	15	3	
Seated Leg Curls	70	15	3	
Body Weight Squats on Smith Mach.	n/a	25	4	alternate wide/close stance
Seated Bike				

I'm sure some of you might be having a good laugh at the weight I'm lifting lol but, then again I am 162 lb. and I've never in my life been athletic so that's the reason I am where I am.



Hollywood72 said:


> I didn't start gaining until about week 8. Are you gaining definition/lean mass? The scale might not be where you want it but you could be burning fat and adding a little muscle.
> 
> I'm sure the experts will have more to add but it might be helpful if you post your workout routine


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## beasto (Oct 3, 2012)

Your not really going to get BIG GAINS on TRT. To me it sounds like your "crusing" and expect some gains (not knocking you at all by the way). The dosages for TRT are usually low. Now 500-750mgs of Test Cyp a week for a good 10wk+ run will yield you gains and move that damn stubborn scale you talk about. Eat your ass off and train hard and it will come. Since there is no use for PCT with TRT, all you have to do is cruise on 250mg's a week then jump it back up again.


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## DF (Oct 3, 2012)

Light weight higher reps are fine, however it should be a bit of a challenge for you to get those last few reps.  I'd give it more time to kick in.  Also I recommend taking some pics every 4 weeks to check your progress.  Looks like you have your diet set with Spongy & your hooked up with a trainer & your gear is script so no bunk.  Like I said just give it some more time maybe increase the weights a bit to challenge yourself for those last few reps.


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## LeanHerm (Oct 3, 2012)

Yeah man trt is not meant for body builders. It's more of a Heath thing. It will def help with mood and libido. It will help with muscle building but not as much as a guy on a real cycle. Most guys will drop bf more than anything.


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## PillarofBalance (Oct 3, 2012)

You aren't lifting heavy enough. And all that isolation isn't going to do a whole lot to make you grow. You need to keep in touch with spongy for tweaks to keep you growing.  And your test dose essentially brings you to a natural level. You're not blasting as far as I read.


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## ccpro (Oct 3, 2012)

PillarofBalance said:


> You aren't lifting heavy enough. And all that isolation isn't going to do a whole lot to make you grow. You need to keep in touch with spongy for tweaks to keep you growing.  And your test dose essentially brings you to a natural level. You're not blasting as far as I read.



I agree, I've made some good gains on trt levels but I am really pushing my weight at the gym...and eating!


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## Shane1974 (Oct 3, 2012)

I think your dosage is too low. Run the Test at 500 mg EW and see what happens. I bet you grow.


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## SFGiants (Oct 3, 2012)

Best movement to stimulate growth is the deadlift then squat.

I don't know where to begin but your an utter mess right now.

1 Eat more food 
2 Train harder
3 Train smarter

If your going to squat then squat and get your ass out of the Smith that making will hurt you more then help with squats.

If you don't want to free squat the mix it up with hack sleds, front squat machines and leg press and DEADLIFT!

You need 2 people 1 to teach you diet and 1 to teach you how to train, you will not learn this own your own as technique take learning as well as diet.

There is no such thing as a hard gainer just people that won't eat and or train proper.


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## grind4it (Oct 3, 2012)

Brother, a couple of things jump out to me. Some people (myself included) dont see the effects of test until they are 8+ weeks in. I usally see the benifits in week 7-9. Also, I would get a diffrent trainer. Yes, high reps are good but for most muscles groups after rep 10-12 it should be hard to impossible to continue.
When I first started reading your post I thought you might be in a recomp and I was going to say you need to stop watching the scales and start watching the mirror. But after reading everything. I think your trainer is not pushing you hard enough. This is very common. They are afraid that if you tear/hurt something you will sue the gym or them personally. I'm sure you had to sign a waiver but the stone cold reality is this is a worthless price of paper and they know it. Also, keep in mind in the state I live in (TX) it's a two day class to become a personal trainer. The only thing he has you doing that I agree with is the incline walking vs. cardio outside of that I don't think he has a clue. 
My suggestion is to get a new trainer, as Dfeaton recommended take bi weekly or monthly pictures and weekly measurements along with following spongy's diet to the letter. I think you said you are in the 400mg + of test range. If so you should gain. If not, get into that range anything less is not going to get you where you want to be. Adding Var or additional compounds will also help.
I didn't see any mention of your sleeping habits. I am assuming that you are getting at least 8 hours of sleep every night. If you are not; start tonight.

Good luck brother


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## coltmc4545 (Oct 3, 2012)

I see most trainers in my gym only train people for weight loss and to "tone up". Personally I wouldn't worry about any more cardio or high rep training. You want to pack on mass, train like a power lifter and eat like a power lifter. Everybody's different. Some people respond better to high reps low weight, some people respond better to low reps heavy weight, an some people respond better in the middle. Personally I cycle my training like I do a cycle. I go heavy and do 5x5's or 5/3/1 for 6-8 weeks, then go light and do 10-12 reps x 4 for 6 weeks, then do 8x4 for 6 weeks, then start all over. Go heavy but safe and drop that trainer and find a new one. You're not a 60 year old over weight woman and you don't need to train like one. Only thing it could be is training if you're with spongy and you're on pharm grade.


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## DF (Oct 3, 2012)

I'm curious as to what your workout history is as well?? I read that you were doing P90X, which maybe good to get into shape but not really a muscle builder routine.  Have you worked out in a gym before?? free weights ect....? b/c if you have not going light is the way to go until you get your form down.  No sense in trying to lift heavy when your all akward & off balance.  Bumping up to 500+ mg/week you should see something.  If you do have gym experience then talk it over with your trainer about your goals ect.... If he doesn't listen find another.  Another thing about lifting light is you could also increase your intensity.... by slowing the reps & focus on squeezing the muscle or doing super sets ect....


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## username1 (Oct 3, 2012)

Thanks for all the replies. First, to clear this up. I am not on TRT dose right now. I know I rambled a lot so maybe it was missed but, I have been on 420mg test cyp every week since August 1st. That's why I state I'm 8 weeks in my blast. I know enough to know what dose is a blast by now. This week I am increasing my dose to about 500mg week.

No, I don't have any workout history before this, I've gone to the gym before but, I never stuck with it in the past. I've tried to work with personal trainers in the past but, I ended up starting and then quitting a couple weeks in. Now, I'm determined and have made it a life time change and have been working out regularly 5 days a week and eating healthy for almost a year now. 

I guess about the liability thing with the trainer could be it, he has told me that if the weight feels light I can increase it. That's why I said that I wasn't actually doing the weights listed but, I should have been writing it down so I could tell you guys exactly how much I was doing. I'll start writing it down from now on.

Only thing is about this trainer is that he's not charging me anything, it's kind of a small neighborhood type of gym and initially when I went to sign up I had asked him about training, I asked if he could set me up with plans and maybe watch me for a week to see my form etc. and then let me work on my own. So, that way it's not costing me so much to work with a trainer. So, then he was like he'll hook me up and that he's on salary there and he just loves doing this stuff and so he's been setting me up on these plans and what-not and when he first sets up the plan he watches my form and shows me how to do the exercises then I do it on my own then we regroup. So, he doesn't charge me for any of this. I have talked to him about my goals and that I want to gain strength and LBM. So, he is supposed to be aware of what my goals are, we sat down and discussed all this before we started. I do know that when I first started working with a trainer a few years ago, I remember after my sessions I would be so sore like I'd have difficulty driving back home or brushing my teeth the next morning but, now I never get sore. Last week when I worked on chest/back I could feel some soreness in my pecs the next day but, nothing major. 

Also, I am in Texas. None of the trainers at the gym look like they are in shape, even mine but, he says it's because of his diet. He seems to have definition but, he's not big. He has told me that he was bodybuilding sometime ago and told me about when he was eating 18 eggs in the morning and what-not. However, honestly his lack of size does bother me he says he's been training for 15 years but, I don't know it just makes me think if he wasn't able to get himself big, how will I?

Again the issue I'm kind of in is that I cant really say much because he's doing all this without charging me. I guess it's going to be awkward now if I start coming in with another trainer. Either that or I guess I need to switch gyms, I wouldn't really like that type of awkwardness lol

Also about the reps, I do them slow and focus on the muscle.


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## Jada (Oct 3, 2012)

I agree with all the bros above, I think a new trainer would great for u, as long keep good form 
And lift heavy u will see muscle growth , diet part it's already good since u have the guru on board, ur test is official just need to bump up a little more and u should be gtg , once u get the right trainer ur gonna grow.


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## username1 (Oct 3, 2012)

This was my main question that must have got missed in all my rambling. I'm wondering if I don't see any gains soon if I can add in NPP? I'm wondering if adding in a 19-nor will help me gain. However, by your replies it seems that it's my training but, let's say if it wasn't my training and I couldn't gain. Would I be able to do it like this:

*My blast that I started on Aug. 1st was at 420mg E7D (split in two shots Mon/thurs), and this week I'm increasing my dose to 525mg/E7D. The scripted test I get is 210mg/ml so that's the reason the numbers are like that. I'm supposed to start var at the end of this month I think, or next month. My blast was going to be 20 weeks at 420mg/wk but, since I can't gain anything, I wanted to increase it this week. Then in the last 6 weeks I was going to run the var. 

I've been planning my next blast and want to run NPP + tbol. I'm wondering if at the end of this blast I don't gain anything should I just keep going and start the NPP? I know after I'm done with the var I need to give myself a break to recover from the oral so initially I was planning on kickstarting my 2nd blast with tbol but, that was thinking that I was going to make gains after my first blast and give myself a break and come back to the 2nd blast later. However, I'm thinking if I don't make any gains, I don't want to just stop and waste time for nothing (though my health is important so if I have to, I will of course) so I figured if i just keep going and add the NPP then instead of kickstarting with tbol, I'll just run it at the end of the blast like I did the var, so that would give me enough time to recover from the oral. Would that work? Because I'm on TRT so it doesn't really matter how long I'm on? As long as I get my blood test done and everything seems fine? Or what about if I just add the NPP now? Because if I can't gain anything off 420/mg wk, 8 weeks in or if I give myself another 6 weeks on 540 mg/wk and don't see any gains, then continuing to run it seems pointless like I'm just wasting gear. If I add in the NPP then at least I can make use of the test.*


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## PillarofBalance (Oct 3, 2012)

Fuck trainers bro. You've got us!  If you've got a good bro on SI that you trust, PM him, exchange emails or something. Keep in touch. Have him (or her) guide you.


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## username1 (Oct 3, 2012)

Ok, I agree about the trainer so I will start looking for another.

Also, I was taking pics every month for a while but, like I said once I got to a certain point I stopped seeing changes so eventually I stopped taking the pics because I looked the same month after month and was just getting tired of not seeing any improvement month after month. Also, when I was taking the measurements, every week at one point I was getting tired of it for the same reason because they were the same week after week.


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## username1 (Oct 3, 2012)

If I could do it myself without a trainer that would be better because I was just kind of thinking what if my next trainer is also useless, then I will just keep going trainer to trainer and wasting time for nothing. Can anybody recommend me a workout routine with the weights I should be lifting? Or maybe I'll send spongy an e-mail I think he said he offers training assitance as well.


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## Shane1974 (Oct 3, 2012)

I am with POB on this one. Drop the trainer and do some research. Start with something simple like 3 sets of 8 of 3 or 4 different exercises. Kick that P90x shit to the curb, eat BIG, and when you go into that gym, leave everything else in life at the door and lift those weights like your life depends on it.


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## username1 (Oct 3, 2012)

I already said I stopped p90x once I started going to the gym. I have a plate of 12 eggs infront of me right now and just ate 3 cups of kashi cereal before this, I eat like this every two hrs., every day. I'm working with spongy, I believe my diet is in check. At times, I actually eat more than what he had down for me. I guess I need to work on my training, I sent him an email to see what he can tell me. I don't know as far as research where to start when it comes to training, there's so many different ways and strategies and what-not I have no idea where to start there because I lack experience in training my whole life so I wouldn't know where to begin. I hope spongy will be able to help me out.

Also somebody had asked me about rest. I always get at least 8 hrs of sleep. I work from home on the weekdays and so I don't have a set time to get up but, typically I go to sleep around 2am and wake up around 10:30am sometimes I end up sleeping in later.


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## Curiosity (Oct 3, 2012)

The thing about trainers, as has been mentioned, is that its pretty easy to get minimal credentials and be one. there are amazing trainers out there, but you gotta really see what their experience and education is. A bachelors in exercise science would be a good start. And i'd find somebody whos in good shape that you can look up to, you know they can get you there.


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## DF (Oct 3, 2012)

I would say that the training is the issue.  Even taking only around 400mg/week at 162 pounds something should be happening.  For now focus on your current cycle.  There are alot of different types of training methods.  Since your not experienced I'd just stick with something simple for large body parts 3-4 exercises 3 sets 8-12 reps.  My reference book when I started lifting 30 years ago was Arnolds encyclopedia.... I still have it btw 30 years later lol.  Anyway I'd be be more than happy to help you out if you'd like.  Feel free to pm me anytime.


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## grind4it (Oct 3, 2012)

My final thoughts:

Bro, do the training yourself. It will take less time to build a program than it took to research the other compounds.

POB hit it on the head thier are reasources here for you to use. I'm sure I'll get flamed for this but fuck it; go over to bodybuilding.com and look at there routines you can search by goal, split, whatever.

Remeber to change your routine every few weeks (4-8 for me). Kinda like Tony Hortons muscle confusion theory.

To answer your question in regards to adding another compound to your cycle. Yes and no. Yes, you will see more gains than now. No, because you still are going to b disappointed due to your training.

Diet, training, sleep and gear that what it takes to grow. You cut any of these out and you will be heartbroken everytime.

Good luck,
Gind


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## coltmc4545 (Oct 3, 2012)

Yeah forget the npp bro. You've had blood tests to confirm your levels are over 1500. Your gear is good, you're in with a nutrisionist, as long as you're getting enough rest, it's you're training. You're not immune to testosterone. You can grow just fine on it. Hold off on the 19nors and get your training dialed in. You said you've been committed for a year now. Your joints and tendons and strong enough then. Put the little weights and machines down, drop your trainer cuz he doesn't know shit about getting big obviously, stack on some fuckin plates, and do bench, DL's, and squats. Focus on the big 3 with some secondary work and you'll grow brother.


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## jyoung8j (Oct 3, 2012)

If you have a android phone they have a app called jefit. It teaches u all the exercises for each body part and u can log ur weights.. perfect for beginners.. my girl uses it..


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## username1 (Oct 3, 2012)

Thanks for all the tips. Well, I really hope spongy will be able to help me out. I guess it seems training isn't really discussed here or ology right? Everything I learned was from these forums and everybody talks about gear, and there's lot of info on diet so that's how I learned everything. I guess I never really paid attention to how much of a science training is, everybody says 80% is diet so that's what has been my main focus all this time, I guess it's bullshit and it's all 50/50. 

It just pisses me off though, I got back from the gym and was doing the same routine for chest/back day and I feel the burn and everything but, it just sucks that there's such a right/wrong way to exercise. I mean if I want to work on a certain body part, and I just do that exercise why don't I see results? Why do I have to fucking find this secret method to working out to get results? Or have to everything a certain way, that just doing exercises themselves isn't enough. Also every route I take, is fucking wrong. I'm just doing everything wrong, I started p90x and people on the forums told me it was shit, so I gave that up went to the gym, now I'm at the gym and now I'm doing that wrong and everybody is saying I need to change what I'm doing again. Fucking sucks.


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## username1 (Oct 3, 2012)

Dfeaton said:


> I would say that the training is the issue.  Even taking only around 400mg/week at 162 pounds something should be happening.  For now focus on your current cycle.  There are alot of different types of training methods.  Since your not experienced I'd just stick with something simple for large body parts 3-4 exercises 3 sets 8-12 reps.  My reference book when I started lifting 30 years ago was Arnolds encyclopedia.... I still have it btw 30 years later lol.  Anyway I'd be be more than happy to help you out if you'd like.  Feel free to pm me anytime.



Appreciate the offer, sending a PM.


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## coltmc4545 (Oct 3, 2012)

Don't get discouraged. It's all learning. You have to learn how to eat, train, sleep, then gear. The 80% diet thing is true. If you train your ass off and do gear but don't eat right you won't grow. If you eat right and do gear but your training is sub par, you'll stop growing. We all hit plateaus. Just change things up. If something stops working for you, try something new. Hang in there bro. Lift your ass off and go heavy and you'll grow. And don't base growth off soreness either. Just because your not sore and can't walk or brush your teeth without hurting doesn't mean your not growing. It takes a ton of time. Just be patient and keep an open mind and you'll be good.


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## DF (Oct 3, 2012)

username1 said:


> Thanks for all the tips. Well, I really hope spongy will be able to help me out. I guess it seems training isn't really discussed here or ology right? Everything I learned was from these forums and everybody talks about gear, and there's lot of info on diet so that's how I learned everything. I guess I never really paid attention to how much of a science training is, everybody says 80% is diet so that's what has been my main focus all this time, I guess it's bullshit and it's all 50/50.
> 
> It just pisses me off though, I got back from the gym and was doing the same routine for chest/back day and I feel the burn and everything but, it just sucks that there's such a right/wrong way to exercise. I mean if I want to work on a certain body part, and I just do that exercise why don't I see results? Why do I have to fucking find this secret method to working out to get results? Or have to everything a certain way, that just doing exercises themselves isn't enough. Also every route I take, is fucking wrong. I'm just doing everything wrong, I started p90x and people on the forums told me it was shit, so I gave that up went to the gym, now I'm at the gym and now I'm doing that wrong and everybody is saying I need to change what I'm doing again. Fucking sucks.



I wouldn't say that your doing everything wrong Bro.  P90x has it's place & I believe that it maybe good for getting into shape, but like I said it's not going to get you where you want to be...but a good start.  As far as weight training most of these guys learned how years ago & it's second nature so that is probably why it's not discussed much on the forums.  Believe me I have trained/tried to train my share of noobs.  Just trying to get them to use proper form can be a challenge.  Most of the time complete noobs look like that baby horse that just fell out of it's mothers hooch...all fucking akward & shit...lol


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## jyoung8j (Oct 3, 2012)

Well said coltmc... takes yrs of training and learning.. keep ur head up and read away..


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## username1 (Oct 6, 2012)

I found a bodybuilders gym in my area, apparently Branch Warren trains (or used to) sometimes there, I went there and walked in and they have autographed pics of bodybuilders on there wall. I talked to the owner for a bit, they train athletes and bodybuilders, they train people for contests/competitions, and shows. When I walked in there was this guy at the desk he had the biggest guns I've ever seen lol they were like basketballs. There were some big people working out there, I've never seen people that big because it's just not common in day to day life. They also have trainers there that are bodybuilders or competed, so I think this may be a good option for me. Only thing is that it's an open-air gym so there's no climate control (AC/heat) which sucks in Texas because it gets so damn hot in the summer but, I guess I don't really have many options I think this could be the right place for me. 

Here's their website, what do you guys think? - http://metroflexplano.com
Here's some bios of their trainers - http://metroflexplano.com/gym/ they also have a trainer there that has a degree as what was recommended by somebody else here. 

Also this other website here - http://jaycutlerbest.blogspot.com/p/10-best-gyms-in-world.html#ixzz28TzzxSFd has that gym in the top 10 gyms and it says Ronnie Coleman has trained there, it says:

"Heavy-metal music thunders while heavy metal is hoisted. Car carcasses rust in the gravel parking lot. The floor is crumbling from abuse. Nothing is clean and nobody cares. If you want luxuries like air conditioning, you must be lost. These are reasons why Metroflex is the most hardcore gym in the world, but it's mostly because this is where seven-time Mr. Olympia Ronnie Coleman reps out 800-pound deadlifts and 600-pound rows on 110-degree days."


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## username1 (Oct 13, 2012)

so if I want to run the NPP how much should i take to increase my gains?


j/k lol i took your guys advise and tried to figure out my training issue. thanks to Dfeaton and our discussions through PM, he was going to give me a routine but, i'm glad he didn't take the "fuck trainers" approach and just give me something to do, he asked me about my intensity and i was honest that i felt like it's lacking compared to the trainers i've worked out before and he told me he feels that i need a one-on-one trainer.

so, i ended up finding a trainer (defeaton helped me with recommendations there also i sent their profiles etc) , had 3 sessions this week, mon/wed/fri. and man, what a difference in my workouts. especially the first day, i was getting so tired and exausted i felt like i was going to pass out lol but, i kept going (should have told her i wasn't feeling right but, didn't want to sound like a pussy lol) and i was feeling it on the drive back in my arms while driving. i remember that night i was having my last meal and watching sons of anarchy and feeling on top of the world. then during the night i felt the soreness so bad that it was waking me up out of my sleep. the next day i was pretty sore, not to where i couldn't brush my teeth but, like putting deodorent on, was definately feeling it, couldn't raise it completely. we did core that day also and i was really feeling getting up out of bed etc. 

i know as said you're not supposed to judge your workouts based on soreness but, it must have something to do with me because i do not feel those things at all working out on my own and i'm not making any gains so i'm guessing it's because i'm not training hard enough. having said that on leg day i didn't feel crazy soreness but, the day after i was feeling it just not painfully.

i had a discussion with the trainer about what my goals were (btw i'm not going to that bb gym above, this is another trainer) and i was already planning on going to the bb gym but, wanted to give her a chance because location is closer and i don't think i can workout in a gym without ac because if i get so exhausted and wanting to pass out now in ac gym, i might literally pass out in their gym. however, i thought she wouldn't be able to meet my expectations and so i had told her before we started that i might be going out of town next week (as my way out) but, damn i really liked the workouts. 

we were going to failure every set and even when i would try to give up early she would tell me, i need to see you struggle on that last rep. so i'm understanding that now and working out like that. right now we're still doing high reps sometimes because she's getting to know my strengths she doesn't want me to get hurt but, sometimes like for  free weight exercises we always start at the higher end of the weight and if i can't do it, then we keep coming down until I can. or if I start on the high end and my form starts messing up, then we stop and then go to a lower weight and continue.

next week we should be doing much more high weight / low rep exercises because she said today that she knows where my strength level is at. like next week she says we are going to do a 1 rep max benchpress just to see where I am, she always writes down all the reps/weight that i'm doing and then she adjusts accordingly for the next set.

i really hope this will turn everything around for me! i think this is exactly what i needed was to get familiar with working out properly and then hopefully in a few months i will be able to workout on my own once the intensity comes second nature to me. also we don't really take breaks, we go from one workout to the next, and i might stop for a drink of water and then that's it. so that's also the key, minimizing breaks, going through sets quickly and going to failure and struggling on that last rep for every routine.


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## username1 (Nov 13, 2012)

Just wanted to update this thread that it seems it indeed was the training. I've been working out with the trainer regularly and training hard. I even threw up once at the end of the training session lol I'm definately getting the feel for working out hard and soon hopefully I'll be addicted to the high of it that I won't need a trainer but, I somehow doubt that because I can tell that I'm the type of person that needs somebody there like a motivator or else I give up too early and don't go to failure. Plus, I don't have to worry about trying to figure out what exercises I should be doing etc. they can just tell me what to do based on my goals. Only thing is that it's expensive! However, will be so worth it a worthwhile investment into myself.

So, I'm gaining now, it's slow though but, it's fine with me. I'm not going to gain 15 pounds in 2 weeks like some people claim but, that's fine with me. Slow and steady is good with me, I don't want to get injured and since I don't have prior workout experience I don't want to put on too much at once where my skeletal structure can't support it. So, now my weight is fluctuating around 168-169. I always check my weight at the same time in the morning before my first meal, and in boxers. It looks like I'm gaining lean because I measured my stomach and it's the same size so I must not be putting on fat, must be lean. I can tell my back my shoulders and arms are getting bigger, seeing more muscle in my lats and back. Also, it's starting to get difficult for me to do delt injections because it's getting difficult to reach my arm around because I'm getting bigger. My strength is continuing to go up in the gym, every time I'm increasing weight and/or reps. Getting good comments from the trainer regarding my progress, everything is being written down so we can see how I'm progressing. I'm trying to focus more on gaining strength than I am trying to look at the scale. 

Really glad things are going on track now, feeling confident in where I'm heading and not stressing out or getting pissed off by not seeing results. 

Thanks for all the advise here, it got my ass in gear and got me to focus on my training instead of adding more compounds, and it's working.


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## DF (Nov 13, 2012)

Glad to hear the update User! Sounds like your training is going great.  Making good gains in size & weight.  Keep it up brother you'll be up over 170 in no time.  Oh yea, care to share a pic of that trainer with the fellow bro's here???


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## TR90125 (Nov 14, 2012)

Congrats on the gains!!!

I don't think there is any shame in using the right trainer if you think you need it.  I have a trainer and I have no doubt it was the right call.  Most of the bro's on here that say you don't need a trainer, well, don't need a trainer.  

Some quick facts from my last few weeks, before I took 3 weeks off due to back issues, I weighed 180.  After 3 weeks of no weight training on Spongy's diet with cardio, I weighed 174 and my body fat did not change.  I have completed 5 workouts since returning to the gym and I now weigh 177, body fat is down to 16% from 18%.

My trainer knows I want to recomp and hit 13% body fat while maintaining a weight of 180.  We lift to failure and then squeeze out a couple more.  The workouts never seem to be the same and I leave the gym smoked every time.  

So, like many said, sounds like you just needed to find the right trainer.


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## NbleSavage (Nov 15, 2012)

Great progress, Mate!


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