# Hubei Huangshi Anavar HELP



## SirNuma (Jan 25, 2017)

Hi guys, 
I just bought that Hubei anavar pills (50 pills-10 mg). I can't find any thread about it and no idea if it is legit. Please if anyone tried it help me with that... the package is purple


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## CardinalJacked (Jan 25, 2017)

I've heard only the red package with yellow dots on it is legit


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## SirNuma (Jan 25, 2017)

I have this one


P.s.
Damn can't post links...


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## Jin (Jan 25, 2017)

SirNuma said:


> Hi guys,
> I just bought that Hubei anavar pills (50 pills-10 mg). I can't find any thread about it and no idea if it is legit. Please if anyone tried it help me with that... the package is purple



What are you planning on doing with 50 10mg pills?

You can lab max it or run it. No other way to tell. Many companies will sell dbol as anavar because it's much cheaper. Anavar won't raise your e2 levels much whereas dbol is an estrogen bomb. If you gain significant weight right off the bat (water weight), then it's most likely not anavar. 

If you don't want to run it, send it to me and I'll let you know what I think it is.


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## Flyingdragon (Jan 25, 2017)

I disagree, Most labs looking to scam customers will send Win instead of Var....


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## SirNuma (Jan 25, 2017)

Jin said:


> What are you planning on doing with 50 10mg pills?



I bought 5 packages.... want to run 60 mg ED 6 weeks

You can lab max it or run it. No other way to tell. Many companies will sell dbol as anavar because it's much cheaper. Anavar won't raise your e2 levels much whereas dbol is an estrogen bomb. If you gain significant weight right off the bat (water weight), then it's most likely not anavar. 

If you don't want to run it, send it to me and I'll let you know what I think it is.


I hope it isn't DBol cz I'm already at 240 lb, thats my first cycle.
How much Dbol needs to kick in?


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## Jin (Jan 25, 2017)

Flyingdragon said:


> I disagree, Most labs looking to scam customers will send Win instead of Var....



No need to disagree. We're both right. Many labs send dbol and most send winny


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## DocDePanda187123 (Jan 25, 2017)

Jin said:


> No need to disagree. We're both right. Many labs send dbol and most send winny



Dbol is easily differentiated from Anavar bc of the bloat. That doesn't make sense.


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## MrRippedZilla (Jan 25, 2017)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> Dbol is easily differentiated from Anavar bc of the bloat. That doesn't make sense.



I've seen analytical testing that shows just as much bunk winny as var with Dht, methyl test and other compounds being found in its place.

Then again, I've also seen test prop being labelled as EQ...Lots of funky stuff pulled by some labs.


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## automatondan (Jan 25, 2017)

SirNuma said:


> I bought 5 packages.... want to run 60 mg ED 6 weeks
> 
> I hope it isn't DBol cz I'm already at 240 lb, thats my first cycle.
> How much Dbol needs to kick in?



I hope you are not planning on taking a var only cycle.......?????? Please tell us you are not.... (But dont lie!)


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## SirNuma (Jan 25, 2017)

I was... can you explain me what's wrong with that and what i need first?


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## automatondan (Jan 25, 2017)

SirNuma said:


> I was... can you explain me what's wrong with that and what i need first?



First off, are you a female or a dude?

Oral only cycles are not recommended for guys (at all) due to the cycle lacking testosterone (which would be okay if you were a lady)... But, if you are a dude, and you start popping a var only cycle thinking to yourself "var is supposed to be a very mild steroid and so it is the safest" but in reality, you will shut down your natural testosterone production by taking var and that leaves you with very little to no test being produced naturally. Var is not strong enough to replace your natural testosterone. Its just not wise dude. Plus, doing all this to you body for very little gains seems like a waste to me. Thats why we and many others in the know recommend a testosterone only first cycle. Run testosterone ONLY at 500 mg per week for 12-15 weeks. Have an AI on hand BEFORE you start your cycle as well as a proper PCT (Nolva & Clomid). Dont mess around with an oral only cycle, var only is for girls only.


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## SirNuma (Jan 25, 2017)

automatondan said:


> First off, are you a female or a dude?



Male. Height 1.89 mt Weight 114 kg, 4 years lifting


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## Jin (Jan 25, 2017)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> Dbol is easily differentiated from Anavar bc of the bloat. That doesn't make sense.



And OP is about to run an oral only cycle. Fact is most people that take AAS are poorly informed and many UgL are out to make a quick buck. Dbol is one of the cheapest compounds to manufacture.


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## Jin (Jan 25, 2017)

SirNuma said:


> Male. Height 1.89 mt Weight 114 kg, 4 years lifting



What's your approximate BF? If it lowish, those are good stats for only 4 years lifting.


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## TrickWilliams (Jan 25, 2017)

If you had a vagina this might be a good idea.

You need test as a base. Your going to shut yourself completely down. Oral only is never a good idea. Never.


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## SirNuma (Jan 25, 2017)

Jin said:


> What's your approximate BF? If it lowish, those are good stats for only 4 years lifting.



It's about 16%


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## automatondan (Jan 25, 2017)

SirNuma said:


> It's about 16%



If you look on page one, I edited my post and answered your question.


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## SirNuma (Jan 25, 2017)

TrickWilliams said:


> If you had a vagina this might be a good idea.
> 
> You need test as a base. Your going to shut yourself completely down. Oral only is never a good idea. Never.



I wanted just to cut some fat... guess that's not a good idea..


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## TrickWilliams (Jan 25, 2017)

SirNuma said:


> I wanted just to cut some fat... guess that's not a good idea..



Cut some fat with your diet. Do some cardio. Thats all you need. Not anavar.

Tell us some more about yourself. Age, training, whats your diet currently like?


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## automatondan (Jan 25, 2017)

SirNuma said:


> I wanted just to cut some fat... guess that's not a good idea..



How old are ya dude? (im not being a dick, im curious about TRT...)


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## ToolSteel (Jan 25, 2017)

SirNuma said:


> I wanted just to cut some fat... guess that's not a good idea..


Steroids don't burn fat. They build muscle. 

You're closer to 20-22% bf at minimum, likely 25. 

Diet is what you need here. Shortcuts lead to disappointment.


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## Seeker (Jan 25, 2017)

You have no business taking steriods at all. No Anavar, no test as a base, nothing!  Doesn't . matter how tall, short, skinny, or fat you are.  You have no idea what you're doing. Educate yourself before you hurt yourself.


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## SirNuma (Jan 25, 2017)

TrickWilliams said:


> Cut some fat with your diet. Do some cardio. Thats all you need. Not anavar.
> 
> Tell us some more about yourself. Age, training, whats your diet currently like?



Sorry for my English that'smy third language lol

Well

I'm 21 years old, been training for 4 years (3 years weight lifting, 1 year cardio... I was fat).
I went from 103 kg to 77 kg first year then I gained weight and now I'm stuck at 114 kg.
I'm training 6 days a week
I found that the most beneficial training for me is hit every muscle group twice a week, except legs and shoulders , I'm hitting them once.

I'm trying to keep my diet clean, expecially last 4 month, cause i want some fat cut. I'm eating mainly: chicken, eggs, rice, yogurt 0% fat and cheating every Saturday.

Hope it helps a bit


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## TrickWilliams (Jan 25, 2017)

Seeker said:


> You have no business taking steriods at all. No Anavar, no test as a base, nothing!  Doesn't matter how tall, short, skinny, or fat you are



Im in the same boat as Seek. You have no idea what your doing. Your to young anyway. Spend a few more years educating yourself. Stick around here, read and learn. Stay in the gym and keep making gains naturally. The time will come when you know exactly what you should be doing. You wont have any questions. Till then man, stay away.


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## SirNuma (Jan 25, 2017)

Seeker said:


> You have no business taking steriods at all. No Anavar, no test as a base, nothing!  Doesn't . matter how tall, short, skinny, or fat you are.  You have no idea what you're doing. Educate yourself before you hurt yourself.



I guess you are right, I'm just young and wanted to see my best shape


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## SirNuma (Jan 25, 2017)

automatondan said:


> If you look on page one, I edited my post and answered your question.



Thanks... checking


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## SirNuma (Jan 25, 2017)

ToolSteel said:


> Steroids don't burn fat. They build muscle.
> 
> You're closer to 20-22% bf at minimum, likely 25.
> 
> Diet is what you need here. Shortcuts lead to disappointment.



I was looking for a "help" i know there is no magic pill that make fat cut... and also it put 2-3 kg of muscle if I'm not wrong


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## Seeker (Jan 25, 2017)

SirNuma said:


> I guess you are right, I'm just young and wanted to see my best shape




Your  best shape is yet to come. Put in the work, stay consistent. Learn everything you can about training, eating, recovery. There's much to do.


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## automatondan (Jan 25, 2017)

ToolSteel said:


> Steroids don't burn fat. They build muscle.
> 
> You're closer to 20-22% bf at minimum, likely 25.
> 
> Diet is what you need here. Shortcuts lead to disappointment.





Seeker said:


> You have no business taking steriods at all. No Anavar, no test as a base, nothing!  Doesn't . matter how tall, short, skinny, or fat you are.  You have no idea what you're doing. Educate yourself before you hurt yourself.





SirNuma said:


> Sorry for my English that'smy third language lol
> 
> Well
> 
> ...



I agree with these guys. Sounds to me like you need to get your diet dialed in... And my post on page one was more for education than purely recommendation. I do recommend you dont do an oral only cycle (strongly), but I agree with these guys that you should not do any AAS at all at this point. I researched probably 100s and 100s of hours (years) before I ever felt like I even had a beginners understanding of AAS. 
Theres a difference between "eating clean" and having your diet dialed in 100%. Why dont you start a new thread with all the details of your diet and give us your goals and we can help you dial it in. Give us your macro break down as well as what kind of deficit your are working with... Maybe even start a training/weigh-loss log.


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## SirNuma (Jan 25, 2017)

automatondan said:


> I agree with these guys. Sounds to me like you need to get your diet dialed in... And my post on page one was more for education than purely recommendation. I do recommend you dont do an oral only cycle (strongly), but I agree with these guys that you should not do any AAS at all at this point. I researched probably 100s and 100s of hours (years) before I ever felt like I even had a beginners understanding of AAS.
> Theres a difference between "eating clean" and having your diet dialed in 100%. Why dont you start a new thread with all the details of your diet and give us your goals and we can help you dial it in. Give us your macro break down as well as what kind of deficit your are working with... Maybe even start a training/weigh-loss log.



Thanks, I did it in the Dieting and supplements section.


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## snake (Jan 25, 2017)

SirNuma said:


> Sorry for my English that'smy third language lol
> 
> Well
> 
> ...



Even without you giving me your numbers, there's no way you're even remotely close to your genetic potential. Now I'm not telling you to wait another 10 years until that happens but you do need to wait to start your AAS use. 

You find guys who started AAS use at your age, guys who started it 20 years later and guys that have never done them. The one thing they all have in common, they all will tell you that at 21 y.o. you're not where you need to be to play that Ace. 

Var only cycle; If you don't have a vagina at the start of the cycle, you will after it's over.


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## stonetag (Jan 25, 2017)

Ever heard of the sayings, wiping your ass before you shit, putting the cart in front of the horse, and I'm sure many others, well they all kind of apply here. You have got to research this stuff dude.


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## DocDePanda187123 (Jan 25, 2017)

Jin said:


> And OP is about to run an oral only cycle. Fact is most people that take AAS are poorly informed and many UgL are out to make a quick buck. Dbol is one of the cheapest compounds to manufacture.



There's nothin wrong per se with an oral only cycle.


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## Jin (Jan 25, 2017)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> There's nothin wrong per se with an oral only cycle.



Would you please elaborate?
Do you agree that oral only cycles aren't ideal for males?

I remain teachable.


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## DocDePanda187123 (Jan 25, 2017)

Jin said:


> Would you please elaborate?
> Do you agree that oral only cycles aren't ideal for males?
> 
> I remain teachable.



Oral only cycles aren't as bad as people make them out to be. if you're worried about passing a PED test they have shorter detection times also. In certain circumstances they could be ideal.


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## SirNuma (Jan 26, 2017)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> Oral only cycles aren't as bad as people make them out to be. if you're worried about passing a PED test they have shorter detection times also. In certain circumstances they could be ideal.



Doesn't it shut down your testosterone completely? If yes how to recover?


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## SirNuma (Jan 26, 2017)

stonetag said:


> Ever heard of the sayings, wiping your ass before you shit, putting the cart in front of the horse, and I'm sure many others, well they all kind of apply here. You have got to research this stuff dude.



You are right dude, I'm just a noob


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## SirNuma (Jan 26, 2017)

snake said:


> Even without you giving me your numbers, there's no way you're even remotely close to your genetic potential. Now I'm not telling you to wait another 10 years until that happens but you do need to wait to start your AAS use.
> 
> You find guys who started AAS use at your age, guys who started it 20 years later and guys that have never done them. The one thing they all have in common, they all will tell you that at 21 y.o. you're not where you need to be to play that Ace.
> 
> Var only cycle; If you don't have a vagina at the start of the cycle, you will after it's over.



Don't have a vagina and don't want it... lol


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## DocDePanda187123 (Jan 26, 2017)

SirNuma said:


> Doesn't it shut down your testosterone completely? If yes how to recover?



All anabolic/androgenic steroids inhibit testosterone production yes. What do you mean how to recover?


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## SirNuma (Jan 26, 2017)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> All anabolic/androgenic steroids inhibit testosterone production yes. What do you mean how to recover?



I mean, how to back to normal levels after let's say only anvar cycle? Is the Clomid only ok?


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## DocDePanda187123 (Jan 26, 2017)

SirNuma said:


> I mean, how to back to normal levels after let's say only anvar cycle? Is the Clomid only ok?



You would do a PCT which would consist of clomid and/or nolva.


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## automatondan (Jan 26, 2017)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> Oral only cycles aren't as bad as people make them out to be. if you're worried about passing a PED test they have shorter detection times also. In certain circumstances they could be ideal.



Doc, you are not suggesting this guy to run an oral only cycle are you...?


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## SirNuma (Jan 26, 2017)

automatondan said:


> Doc, you are not suggesting this guy to run an oral only cycle are you...?



Hey bro, can i ask you 2-3 questions, maybe fb or WA.. i need some help but can't PM you


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## automatondan (Jan 26, 2017)

SirNuma said:


> Hey bro, can i ask you 2-3 questions, maybe fb or WA.. i need some help but can't PM you



Feel free to ask here. Once you reach 25 posts you can start PMing people (I believe)...


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## jennerrator (Jan 26, 2017)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> Oral only cycles aren't as bad as people make them out to be. if you're worried about passing a PED test they have shorter detection times also. In certain circumstances they could be ideal.



Totally agree, seen it a few times and dudes are just fine 

Is it recommended, of course not but to say it is absolutely wrong is incorrect...


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## SirNuma (Jan 26, 2017)

Jenner said:


> Totally agree, seen it a few times and dudes are just fine
> 
> Is it recommended, of course not but to say it is absolutely wrong is incorrect...



A lot of different opinions...


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## automatondan (Jan 26, 2017)

Jenner said:


> Totally agree, seen it a few times and dudes are just fine
> 
> Is it recommended, of course not but to say it is absolutely wrong is incorrect...



I hear what you guys are saying... I feel like *if you know what you are doing*, have planned it out properly, and have PCT and AI on hand, you could run an oral only cycle. I just feel like in this case, this guy isnt prepared and has a lot of learning to do before he even thinks of trying anything at all... Its just not wise.


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## Seeker (Jan 26, 2017)

Let's not confuse the op here. This is not the thread for discussion on proper oral only cycles. SirNuma, it's not for you.


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## SirNuma (Jan 26, 2017)

Seeker said:


> Let's not confuse the op here. This is not the thread for discussion on proper oral only cycles. SirNuma, it's not for you.



You are right, it was all about me new stuff anavar... legit or not, probably I'll burn it lol


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## jennerrator (Jan 26, 2017)

SirNuma said:


> A lot of different opinions...



Yes...and it's always like this because some speak on the following:

1. Experience

2. Opinion

3. Bro science



automatondan said:


> I hear what you guys are saying... I feel like *if you know what you are doing*, have planned it out properly, and have PCT and AI on hand, you could run an oral only cycle. I just feel like in this case, this guy isnt prepared and has a lot of learning to do before he even thinks of trying anything at all... Its just not wise.



Agree, but all facts should be stated IMO....


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## SirNuma (Jan 26, 2017)

automatondan said:


> Feel free to ask here. Once you reach 25 posts you can start PMing people (I believe)...



Thanks bro.


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## DF (Jan 26, 2017)

Yea,  oral only cycle isn't that bad right doc?  Just don't take it with some apple cider vinegar.  Now that would not be good.  WTF?


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## DocDePanda187123 (Jan 26, 2017)

automatondan said:


> Doc, you are not suggesting this guy to run an oral only cycle are you...?



No, I'm not suggesting he run an oral only cycle. I would suggest he spend time here researching the topic more and AAS in general before he attempt any type of cycle. My point was just that oral only cycles are frowned upon heavily but in realty they're not all that bad. Injectables typically give you more results simply bc you can use much higher dosages and run them much longer than orals but that doesn't mean running a cycle of just an oral is wrong.


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## DocDePanda187123 (Jan 26, 2017)

DF said:


> Yea,  oral only cycle isn't that bad right doc?  Just don't take it with some apple cider vinegar.  Now that would not be good.  WTF?



Grapefruit juice might be worse than apple cider vinegar lol. And no, oral only cycles aren't that bad at all. What makes you think they are?


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## DF (Jan 26, 2017)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> No, I'm not suggesting he run an oral only cycle. I would suggest he spend time here researching the topic more and AAS in general before he attempt any type of cycle. My point was just that oral only cycles are frowned upon heavily but in realty they're not all that bad. Injectables typically give you more results simply bc you can use much higher dosages and run them much longer than orals but that doesn't mean running a cycle of just an oral is wrong.



Dammit Doc!!! Did you read the thread and even put it in perspective before you threw out "oral only cycles are not that bad".  This kid is a noob.  Who of course is looking for anyone to say that what he wants to do is ok.  Several of us have told him that what he is planning is not recommended.  He was getting decent advice in this thread & you toss this shit out here.  Then you come back to explain what you mean?!!! Come on!


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## MrRippedZilla (Jan 26, 2017)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> Grapefruit juice might be worse than apple cider vinegar lol. And no, oral only cycles aren't that bad at all. What makes you think they are?



I love you Doc but man...talk about lack of context. 
The OP has given no indication to suggest that oral only cycles may be better for him (detection times, etc), they provide inferior results due to the timeframe/dosing limitations inherent to most and, with anavar, why would a DHT-derivative as the sole method of androgen replacement be a good idea? AFAIC it isn't. 
And Bill Roberts doesn't have a clue about skeletal muscle anabolism and the time frames involved. Just in case you were going to chuck his ED, EOD, E2W oral cycling bullshit at me  


OP, you may want to spend some time researching what you put into your body before buying some pills and expecting to be spoon fed down the line. Just saying.


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## jennerrator (Jan 26, 2017)

Well, if you want to get technical.....this was the question....


"I just bought that Hubei anavar pills (50 pills-10 mg). I can't find any thread about it and no idea if it is legit. Please if anyone tried it help me with that... the package is purple"

I personally don't see where he asked for any "use" advice and I really don't see where Doc derailed the thread...moving it away from the original question...

Doc never told him to do an all oral cycle...no one did...there is nothing wrong with giving "all" information regarding the topic...


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## DF (Jan 26, 2017)

I know better than to bother from here in out.  I'm very disappointed


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## MrRippedZilla (Jan 26, 2017)

Jenner said:


> I personally don't see where he asked for any "use" advice and I really don't see where Doc derailed the thread...moving it away from the original question...
> 
> Doc never told him to do an all oral cycle...no one did...there is nothing wrong with giving "all" information regarding the topic...



Continuing the technicalities...

Do you not consider this follow up Q to be asking for use advice?


automatondan said:


> I hope you are not planning on taking a var only cycle.......?????? Please tell us you are not.... (But dont lie!)





SirNuma said:


> I was... *can you explain me what's wrong with that and what i need first?*



Doc didn't derail the thread but this:


DocDePanda187123 said:


> There's nothin wrong per se with an oral only cycle.





DocDePanda187123 said:


> Oral only cycles aren't as bad as people make them out to be. if you're worried about passing a PED test they have shorter detection times also. In certain circumstances they could be ideal.



Leaves a lot of room for misinterpretation and, since the OP gave no indication that his circumstances warrant an oral only cycle, was asking for trouble IMO.


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## jennerrator (Jan 26, 2017)

MrRippedZilla said:


> Continuing the technicalities...
> 
> Do you not consider this follow up Q to be asking for use advice?
> 
> ...



yes, those are follow-up questions after the topic was changed and before doc responded....


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## jennerrator (Jan 26, 2017)

The bottom line is:

Not everyone feels the same about things, that doesn't mean that they are wrong in what they are posting...just because someone doesn't agree or like it.

AGAIN...........neither of us told him to do an oral cycle....WE pointed out that he's not going to die from it....that's all...if said member feels that we "messed him up" by our comments...then he can PM me.


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## SirNuma (Jan 27, 2017)

Thank you guys for all advices you gave me, appreciated. I'll not run it for sure, at least not soon. I'm trying to learn as much as I can and I'm very happy to be here... I think the best I can do now is try to diet and do some cardio then I'll see


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## TrickWilliams (Jan 27, 2017)

SirNuma said:


> Thank you guys for all advices you gave me, appreciated. I'll not run it for sure, at least not soon. I'm trying to learn as much as I can and I'm very happy to be here... I think the best I can do now is try to diet and do some cardio then I'll see



Good for you on picking the right option. Thats what we all wanted to hear.


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## snake (Jan 27, 2017)

Jenner said:


> The bottom line is:
> 
> Not everyone feels the same about things, that doesn't mean that they are wrong in what they are posting...just because someone doesn't agree or like it.



I'm going to run that one by Zilla the next time he picks on my eggs. :32 (18):


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## snake (Jan 27, 2017)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> And no, oral only cycles aren't that bad at all. What makes you think they are?



My bloodwork?


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## DocDePanda187123 (Jan 27, 2017)

snake said:


> My bloodwork?



So you believe adding testosterone or another injectable steroid would actually improve your bloodwork compared to an oral only cycle???


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## DocDePanda187123 (Jan 27, 2017)

DF said:


> Dammit Doc!!! Did you read the thread and even put it in perspective before you threw out "oral only cycles are not that bad".  This kid is a noob.  Who of course is looking for anyone to say that what he wants to do is ok.  Several of us have told him that what he is planning is not recommended.  He was getting decent advice in this thread & you toss this shit out here.  Then you come back to explain what you mean?!!! Come on!



I'm sorry DF, but did you miss the part where I quoted and responded to ANOTHER,member (Jin) and not OP (SirNuma) about the oral only cycles? I would politely suggest getting your facts straight before getting angry with me bc from where I'm sitting, it's pretty obvious which one of us did not read the thread...


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## DocDePanda187123 (Jan 27, 2017)

MrRippedZilla said:


> I love you Doc but man...talk about lack of context.
> The OP has given no indication to suggest that oral only cycles may be better for him (detection times, etc), they provide inferior results due to the timeframe/dosing limitations inherent to most and, with anavar, why would a DHT-derivative as the sole method of androgen replacement be a good idea? AFAIC it isn't.
> And Bill Roberts doesn't have a clue about skeletal muscle anabolism and the time frames involved. Just in case you were going to chuck his ED, EOD, E2W oral cycling bullshit at me
> 
> ...



You're right about the context to some degree, but, like Tool, I can only take so long for a poop break so I wasn't able to go into as much detail as I would've liked and before I knew it, this shit storm erupted. Also about the context, as I told DF, take a look at who actually wanted to run the oral only cycle and who I quoted about it. 

Anavar wouldn't be my first choice if I were to run an oral only cycle as it doesn't aromatize in addition to what you said. 

As much as I admire Roberts, no, I wasn't going to throw that crap at you lol bc I don't buy the 2wk cycles either.


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## automatondan (Jan 27, 2017)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> So you believe adding testosterone or another injectable steroid would actually improve your bloodwork compared to an oral only cycle???



With all due respect, I believe Snake was speaking about blood work regarding liver values... (tho I may be wrong...)


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## DocDePanda187123 (Jan 27, 2017)

automatondan said:


> With all due respect, I believe Snake was speaking about blood work regarding liver values... (tho I may be wrong...)



I assumed he was talking about liver values but im comparing an oral only cycle (which is supposedly bad) to a cycle of Injectables including the same oral (which is magically better bloods wise). I'm asking him if he really thinks adding test or another injectable in addition to an oral will make his values any better than running that same oral as a standalone.


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## DF (Jan 27, 2017)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> I'm sorry DF, but did you miss the part where I quoted and responded to ANOTHER,member (Jin) and not OP (SirNuma) about the oral only cycles? I would politely suggest getting your facts straight before getting angry with me bc from where I'm sitting, it's pretty obvious which one of us did not read the thread...



Completely irresponsible!

Again to post that little tid bit in a noob thread not your best work.  Yes,  I am angry with you & disappointed.  If you didn't have time to elaborate then you shouldn't have posted.  Have you ever done an oral only cycle?  I have & definitely would NOT recommend it.  I'm sure at you'll keep posting up to justify your reasoning.


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## snake (Jan 27, 2017)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> So you believe adding testosterone or another injectable steroid would actually improve your bloodwork compared to an oral only cycle???



Well I can speak only to my own blood work but at a TRT level, yes. My best bloods have come back on 200 mg of test cyp/ week; better lipid profile mostly. That being a light dose in my opinion, lets take what I feel is even a light dose of Var, say as little as 25mg/wk. for 4 weeks; I promise you, the AST and ALT will be up at the end.

Flip this around Doc; next cycle run 8 weeks dbol and then 8 weeks of Var with a 400 mg/wk Test Prop. kick start.  There's a reason they limit orals and it's not just because they taste bad.


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## DocDePanda187123 (Jan 28, 2017)

DF said:


> Completely irresponsible!
> 
> Again to post that little tid bit in a noob thread not your best work.  Yes,  I am angry with you & disappointed.  If you didn't have time to elaborate then you shouldn't have posted.  Have you ever done an oral only cycle?  I have & definitely would NOT recommend it.  I'm sure at you'll keep posting up to justify your reasoning.



I really don't need to justify anything as your assumption from the beginning was wrong but I am sure you will continue to reflect away from that point. 

You claim I advised OP to run an oral only cycle. All I did was tell another member, not the OP might I remind you once again, that oral only cycles aren't as bad as everyone makes them out to be. 

To take a line from your playbook, if you're not going to bother to read to whom I am posting to, you shouldn't have posted. If you'd like to continue this conversation I ask that you redirect your disappointment and anger at yourself for your lack of reading comprehension.

To answer your question, I have run an oral only cycle.


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## DocDePanda187123 (Jan 28, 2017)

snake said:


> Well I can speak only to my own blood work but at a TRT level, yes. My best bloods have come back on 200 mg of test cyp/ week; better lipid profile mostly. That being a light dose in my opinion, lets take what I feel is even a light dose of Var, say as little as 25mg/wk. for 4 weeks;



Snake, you maybe missed my point. I'm not saying orals are not toxic to the liver. My point is, it's regurgitated everywhere that oral only cycles are bad and they should be ran with injectables, usually test, as a base. So my question to you was, does your blood work tell you that running dbol alone is worse than running test and dbol together for example? You can't compare orals only to injectables only bc that's not the contention. People say it's "safer" to run an oral with test. I'm asking, safer how? It's not like adding test is going to negate the negative effects of the oral...



> I promise you, the AST and ALT will be up at the end.



Any steroid, not just orals, can raise AST and ALT but nowhere did I state otherwise. Did you know that your AST can rise by 45% when comparing evening levels to afternoon levels? Did you know that strenuous exercise can cause your AST to go up  
By 300% and ALT somewhat less than that? As little as 2 alcoholic drinks can cause similar and and worse liver enzyme elevations than orals can? But on forums everywhere it's stated that you must take an oral with test and they insinuate, if not outright state, it's safer that way. Next time I'm drinking a corona I'm going to stack it with test to save my liver lol. <<< that joke isn't at your expense it's just that the other day I saw someone post that test actually helps protect the liver from oral steroids lol.

The problem is you're associating ANY elevation of AST or ALT as bad or dangerous. Zilla has an excellent post on here somewhere about explaining the limitations of AST and ALT testing and talks in depth about GGT which would be a better marker.

Finally, I'd like to point out that AST and ALT values of <100 IU/L are common, nonspecific, and without any accompanying negative symptoms, of zero clinical significance. Levels of 100-300IU/L are seen in numerous mild to moderate inflammatory physiological processes by the body and whether you should be concerned or not would depend upon any negative symptoms and/or whether those levels are sustained chronically or only elevated acutely. 



> Flip this around Doc; next cycle run 8 weeks dbol and then 8 weeks of Var with a 400 mg/wk Test Prop. kick start.  There's a reason they limit orals and it's not just because they taste bad.



Of course there's a reason to limit the length and dose or orals and if you can point me to where I've ever stated otherwise I will personally replace that contraption of yours that broke that makes that delicious Snake meat 

My var powder doesn't taste bad at all. I lick it right off the spoon.


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## ToolSteel (Jan 28, 2017)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> I really don't need to justify anything as your assumption from the beginning was wrong but I am sure you will continue to reflect away from that point.
> 
> You claim I advised OP to run an oral only cycle. All I did was tell another member, not the OP might I remind you once again, that oral only cycles aren't as bad as everyone makes them out to be.
> 
> ...



Stop being sp damn high and mighty. No one is impressed. As the vets pointed out, bringing it up in this thread was irresponsible.


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## DocDePanda187123 (Jan 28, 2017)

ToolSteel said:


> Stop being sp damn high and mighty. No one is impressed. As the vets pointed out, bringing it up in this thread was irresponsible.



So critical thinking/questioning long held beliefs is being high and mighty? Got it...

I am also now aware that answering someone's question and/or engaging them in the "wrong" thread is irresponsible. Going forward in the future, I would appreciate it if you would direct me to the "right" thread.


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## ToolSteel (Jan 28, 2017)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> So critical thinking/questioning long held beliefs is being high and mighty? Got it...
> 
> I am also now aware that answering someone's question and/or engaging them in the "wrong" thread is irresponsible. Going forward in the future, I would appreciate it if you would direct me to the "right" thread.


And that reinforced my point perfectly. Thank you.


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## DocDePanda187123 (Jan 29, 2017)

ToolSteel said:


> And that reinforced my point perfectly. Thank you.



Maybe, if we're considering your memory is selective.


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## SirNuma (Jan 29, 2017)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> Snake, you maybe missed my point. I'm not saying orals are not toxic to the liver. My point is, it's regurgitated everywhere that oral only cycles are bad and they should be ran with injectables, usually test, as a base. So my question to you was, does your blood work tell you that running dbol alone is worse than running test and dbol together for example? You can't compare orals only to injectables only bc that's not the contention. People say it's "safer" to run an oral with test. I'm asking, safer how? It's not like adding test is going to negate the negative effects of the oral...
> 
> 
> 
> ...



That was my what i was thinking... Do I get less sides running TRT with var or any oral?


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## DocDePanda187123 (Jan 29, 2017)

SirNuma said:


> That was my what i was thinking... Do I get less sides running TRT with var or any oral?



You're on TRT?


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## SirNuma (Jan 29, 2017)

DocDePanda187123 said:


> You're on TRT?



No I'm still natural


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## Jin (Jan 29, 2017)

SirNuma said:


> No I'm still natural



Keep reading! TRT is a treatment for a medical condition.


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