# who's the igf guru???



## jyoung8j (Mar 15, 2013)

Newbie to this wanting some good solid info on all I need to know.. dosing dosage duration etc thx j


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## gymrat827 (Mar 15, 2013)

post up what you using.... whats your plan and we ll make adjustments.  

ive used LR3 and DES quite a bit in the past


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## jyoung8j (Mar 15, 2013)

Was looking into lR3.. looking to put on size..


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## pirovoliko (Mar 15, 2013)

Didnt you post earlier this week that you were looking to drop 20 lbs of fat?   Now you want to add size and are going to depend on peptides for it???  Hmmmm....


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## gymrat827 (Mar 15, 2013)

go DES.  and PEG MGF will be needed as well.


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## jyoung8j (Mar 15, 2013)

Well ultimately I want more muscle size and b lean.. and from what I hear is hgh or igf helps with this.. idk I thought that's y this site was here was to inform ppl and let ppl learn.. so I'm asking questions based on experiences I hear.. didn't kno there's anything wrong with tht.. I put tons of work into this diet training etc and wanna get myself to best of its ability... so if u can give advice on igf feel free to post if not back off..


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## jyoung8j (Mar 15, 2013)

Whts the difference between two..  what dose do you suggest.. still haven't figured out the science of mixing seems complicated but everyone says its easy..lol


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## gymrat827 (Mar 15, 2013)

PEG MGF 2 days a wk @ 400mcg on off days.  sub q

igf DES IM pre & post WO in muscles trained @ 50mcg each muscle.  so 50 right pec, 50 left pec, pre and post wo.

consume lots of fast carbs (dextrose or similar fast sugar) + creatine + 10g BCAA each time you pin DES.  it needs carbs/creatine/BCAA for growth


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## jyoung8j (Mar 16, 2013)

What's the mixtures on doses.. I also hear some ppl using bac and some using aa.. getting mixed reviews..


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## gymrat827 (Mar 16, 2013)

aa is for DES.  i still use bac water too.  half and half.  aa is more stable.  you can keep it in room temps, not that you would but are able.  its "tougher" per say.  


you sound like your after tes/deca/d bol type gains tho


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## jyoung8j (Mar 16, 2013)

Na I'm wanting to just get nice lean size.. guy I talked to said he used while was on test tren and it was his best cycle ever and gave him lean size and lost bf..I'm not looking to put on a bunch size just not get any smaller.. lean up persay.. idk if I'm making since.. lol


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## goodfella (Mar 16, 2013)

jyoung8j said:


> Na I'm wanting to just get nice lean size.. guy I talked to said he used while was on test tren and it was his best cycle ever and gave him lean size and lost bf..I'm not looking to put on a bunch size just not get any smaller.. lean up persay.. idk if I'm making since.. lol



Lean bulk...


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## RISE (Apr 8, 2013)

In the real world, what are the gain/benefit difference b/w DES and LR3?  I've only used LR3, might give DES and PEG MGF a run this cycle though.


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## USER (Apr 8, 2013)

In the real world IGF won't do that much for you, I've used a ton of both, I was given enough LR3 to run a full year. Which most guys go by the 4 weeks on 4 off cycling with it. 

100mcg of LR3 is usually the upper range. As doses go up you may notice some decrease in blood sugar. 
100mcg is the typical dose of DES. 

The point of IGF is its insulin like. Insulin works so well by shuttling nutrients into the muscle. IGF sorta works on the same principle granted not as well. But as noted, you will want a good amount of protein/carbs/BCAA/EAA/Glutamine/Creatine. Hopefully the IGF will force as much of this into the muscle as possible. 

Honestly I've never known anyone to make significant gains off IGF. I'm not saying its not if good use, but when someone adds it to a cycle and says its the best cycle they ever had, you have to question a few things. First how much experience with AAS does the person have?  For many, you could run the same compounds three different times, and have differing results each time. A lot is going to depend on diet, type of training, supplements, type and extent of cardio. 

Ill agree that IGF has some properties that do seen to help lean out or keep lean, but if iu are starting with a high percentage of BF, don't expect to walk away with showing abs. It also can help increase appetite, especially when BG lowers, the natural tendency is to eat, and for most it's a craving for foods, especially those high in fast acting carbs or sugars so you kinda need to watch what you consume. 

IGF in general is a controversial topic. Many day it's an important factor in muscle growth and hypertrophy, others feel that it has no specific benefit in terms of actual muscle gains. There's also the theory that by using LR3 during the same day you train, you are preventing mgf from performing its natural function and inhibiting the growth of muscle. 

There are so many differing thoughts on this that its simply confusing. Here's what I've noticed from IGF use, if you are already lean, yes it can help add size with AAS(being the cause of the majority of gains, and pretty much all the gains) and it can help give a bit of a harder more vascular look.  Des will give iu some pretty intense muscle pump used pre w/o. 

My feeling is if it helps shuttle any nutrients used then its worth while. Any help you can get at feeding the muscle is worth while. I like both lr3 and des, but I'm not sold on it causing muscle hypertrophy. I still feel its a good addition. 

LR3 is helpful in post cycle. It can help to retain some of the hard earned muscle gains, for some just knowing they are still injecting something in pct is enough to keep them mentally motivated, but it also seems to help with maintaining pumps that some lose in pct. 

As far as mixing goes. Many peptide companies maintain that AA is not necessary. I've used it both ways. IMO injecting acetic acid is not going to benefit a muscle, it will cause damage. Personally the only time I use AA, is when I make it myself. 

I also believe its correct that it may be a bit more stable, I usually will just use a 50/50 split of AA/BW. 

With mixing, it is very simple. Keep in mind that 1000mcg is equal to 1mg. Most IGF and peptide vials are 2ml vials. You determine the concentration. 

I simply add 2ml of bw to all peptides, or in this case you could use 1ml BW, and 1ml AA. So 2ml now is equal to 1000mcg. 
1ml = 500mcg
On a 1ml insulin pin, it's marked in iu, don't worry about iu, but rather the numbers and dashes between them. If 1ml is equal to 500mcg, then each line with 10 next to it is 50 mcg.  So 10- is 50mcg, 20-100mcg 30-150mcg, 40-200mcg, 50-250mcg and so on. 

Each line between 10/20/30/40 etc is equal to 10mcg.


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## gymrat827 (Apr 8, 2013)

RISE said:


> In the real world, what are the gain/benefit difference b/w DES and LR3?  I've only used LR3, might give DES and PEG MGF a run this cycle though.



not that much different.  in terms of gains.....

Lr3 should help a bit more with fatloss but theres nothing solid on that.


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## gymrat827 (Apr 8, 2013)

USER said:


> In the real world IGF won't do that much for you, I've used a ton of both, I was given enough LR3 to run a full year. Which most guys go by the 4 weeks on 4 off cycling with it.
> 
> 100mcg of LR3 is usually the upper range. As doses go up you may notice some decrease in blood sugar.
> 100mcg is the typical dose of DES.
> ...



did you use MGF along with the igf in your tests??


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## RISE (Apr 11, 2013)

Where do you guys inject when you do biceps?  I feel this would be a painful and hard spot to pin.


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## gymrat827 (Apr 11, 2013)

sub q man.


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## gymrat827 (Apr 26, 2013)

RISE said:


> Where do you guys inject when you do biceps?  I feel this would be a painful and hard spot to pin.



naw...it aint bad.  either is chest/hams/calfs... its only a slin man.


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## Devil1 (May 13, 2013)

jyoung8j said:


> Well ultimately I want more muscle size and b lean.. and from what I hear is hgh or igf helps with this.. idk I thought that's y this site was here was to inform ppl and let ppl learn.. so I'm asking questions based on experiences I hear.. didn't kno there's anything wrong with tht.. I put tons of work into this diet training etc and wanna get myself to best of its ability... so if u can give advice on igf feel free to post if not back off..



your right brother, ask away.  no reason for someone to come in and take up space flaming you for asking questions.

on the other hand will you let me know how things go, i ran LR3 years ago so i am going to do some research and might throw some in on my current cycle.

-Devil1


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