# AIs if not gyno prone



## desertrock (Mar 21, 2016)

Is there any reason for me to take AIs on a cycle if I'm not gyno prone? I've usually taken arimidex in the past just to be sure, but estrogen is anabolic too and right now I'm thinking why take more drugs than I need to. I've never gotten any gyno symptoms no matter how much test I've run. Just more bloat and acne, but then again it also increases the pump which is a good thing..


----------



## bvs (Mar 21, 2016)

Gyno is just one indicator of high E2. have you ever had bloodwork?


----------



## desertrock (Mar 21, 2016)

Yeah, for sure the E2 gets out of range if I don't take arimidex. I guess what I'm asking is if it's really necessary to keep the E2 levels down. After all, your testosterone isn't gonna be "within range" so why does E2 have to be? Based on what I've read estrogen offers some benefits like better cholesterol, higher IGF-1 levels etc.


----------



## bvs (Mar 21, 2016)

its an interesting theory but its out of my range of knowledge. hopefully one of the other bros can help out


----------



## desertrock (Mar 21, 2016)

Here's a related write-up I found on the subject:

https://www.ugbodybuilding.com/thre...e-Androgens-and-Anabolism?highlight=estradiol

I guess this is mostly mental masturbation, but what do you guys think?


----------



## Megatron28 (Mar 21, 2016)

High estradiol does more than can cause gynecomastia.  It can result in:

Edema
Prostate Issues
Bloating
High Blood Pressure
Acne
Lethargy
Crying like a girl
Wanting to cuddle and watch The Notebook
Bitchiness


----------



## DF (Mar 21, 2016)

As Mega said there are more reasons to take an AI than just gyno.  That being said some do cycle without using an AI.  So,  is it absolutely necessary?  No 

I'm an old fuk & back in the day we didn't use an AI & out pct was just tapering off.


----------



## DarksideSix (Mar 21, 2016)

Gyno prone or not you need to keep your E2 in check.  otherwise your dick may not do what it's suppose to.


----------



## Megatron28 (Mar 21, 2016)

DarksideSix said:


> Gyno prone or not you need to keep your E2 in check.  otherwise your dick may not do what it's suppose to.



I knew I was forgetting to list something hugely important!  Erectile Dysfunction!!!


----------



## DieYoungStrong (Mar 22, 2016)

I've been slowly reverting back to my old school thoughts that AI's aren't always completely necessary. 

You can get more gains out of lower dosed cycles with little to no ai. At least from a bulk and strength perspective. The more gear you run, the more ancillaries you generally need. The old timers when I started used to be against AI's unless you were cutting because 1. They used to be insanely expensive and 2. They all said they "put the breaks on gains". 

If you're not getting E2 sides, why add toxic drugs into the mix? From reading I've been doing and studying and listening to the metabolic docs podcasts, the ancillaries are worse for you then the juice itself.


----------



## ToolSteel (Mar 22, 2016)

DieYoungStrong said:


> I've been slowly reverting back to my old school thoughts that AI's aren't always completely necessary.
> 
> You can get more gains out of lower dosed cycles with little to no ai. At least from a bulk and strength perspective. The more gear you run, the more ancillaries you generally need. The old timers when I started used to be against AI's unless you were cutting because 1. They used to be insanely expensive and 2. They all said they "put the breaks on gains".
> 
> If you're not getting E2 sides, why add toxic drugs into the mix? *From reading I've been doing and studying and listening to the metabolic docs podcasts, the ancillaries are worse for you then the juice itself.*



if you have time would you mind starting a thread on this with some of what you've found?


----------



## Bro Bundy (Mar 22, 2016)

to many people think knowing 12.5mg  eod or ed is knowing how to control estrogen.


----------



## MrLeeds88 (Mar 22, 2016)

I use Hydrapharm Alchemy at the moment. Have used other stuff in the past but this seems to work well.


----------



## ken Sass (Mar 22, 2016)

dosage dependent trt no reason for it. blasting or on cycle probably need it. the less chemical's you can take the better


----------



## desertrock (Mar 22, 2016)

DieYoungStrong said:


> I've been slowly reverting back to my old school thoughts that AI's aren't always completely necessary.
> 
> You can get more gains out of lower dosed cycles with little to no ai. At least from a bulk and strength perspective. The more gear you run, the more ancillaries you generally need. The old timers when I started used to be against AI's unless you were cutting because 1. They used to be insanely expensive and 2. They all said they "put the breaks on gains".
> 
> If you're not getting E2 sides, why add toxic drugs into the mix? From reading I've been doing and studying and listening to the metabolic docs podcasts, the ancillaries are worse for you then the juice itself.



Yeah, this is basically what I'm getting at. Although AIs to my knowledge are pretty safe, I almost feel better not taking them even if my E2 is on the high side. I can get arimidex pretty cheap because I have a prescription for it, and blood tests are cheap too, so that's not an issue at all. I do get the water retention, but then again diet is also an equally large factor.


----------



## TwinPeaks (Mar 24, 2016)

I usually take low dose of ai (tamoxiver for example, or from pharmacy) during cycle, though not gyno-prone, estrogen-control is the purpose.


----------



## Megatron28 (Mar 24, 2016)

TwinPeaks said:


> I usually take low dose of ai (tamoxiver for example, or from pharmacy) during cycle, though not gyno-prone, estrogen-control is the purpose.



Tamoxifen (tamoxiver) is a SERM, not an Aromatase Inhibitor.  It does nothing to manage estrogen levels.


----------



## ToolSteel (Mar 24, 2016)

Megatron28 said:


> Tamoxifen (tamoxiver) is a SERM, not an Aromatase Inhibitor.  It does nothing to manage estrogen levels.



He just uses every chance he can to shill brands.


----------

