# In pursuit of a better body | Matt



## Matt~ (Aug 16, 2016)

Hey guys and girls!

This will be my attempt to document my pursuit of losing weight, getting fit. I figured I'd start this up as I just last week started working with a pt who will help me with both nutrition and training. I think this first post will be pretty detailed, nutrition-plan and also the training-program I'll be following. The followup posts which I will try to do every weekend are gonna be shorter I think, containing how I'm feeling, what my weight is at and any changes to training-program or nutrition-plan.
Of course I'm also doing this to get your feedback on anything I write in here, like I said in my introduction post I'm here to learn so anything that might be obvious to you or not so obvious that you'd think I'd learn from your pointing out, go for it.

Ehm guess I throw in a "Warning, wall of text incoming".

*Currently*
Age: 19
Length: 175 cm, might be a little bit taller, I'll edit this once I get it checked.
Weight: 110 kg as of this morning before breakfast.

Using a calculator at a site called health-calc.com, I tried to link it but I'm not allowed to yet. I've calculated that I have a BMR of 2,394 kcal and a TDEE (I think it's called TDEE or TEE?) of 4040 kcal during my gym days which I do 5 times a week, I do about 20 minutes of cardio such as stairs machine or cycling about an hour before lunch and then I think my evening sessions are about 50 minutes, but I haven't done this new program that I have on my own yet so it might be longer or shorter, I'll tell you during one of my follow up posts.

So I also had my blood checked here are the results, their in Swedish but they should be similar to the English names. I did an attempt to translate all of them but I'm pretty sure I got the wrong words and most of them are similar to the English ones so I'll just leave it be. Noted should be that the glucose are quite low because I was doing a ketogenic diet at the time of the blood-test.
I tried to upload the image to this board but the image got compressed and isn't readable.
I'll put a link here hopefully I doesn't get me banned =/ 
imgur.com/a/X26Ns

These are also pictures from today, sorry about the bad lightning. Think I'm going to be taking front, side and back pics every weekend or maybe every month. We'll see.





*Nutrition*

Nutrition-plan, I kind of freaked a little when I saw this. All other "diets" or plans I've followed have been around 1800 kcal. I've been following this for about a week now and I've gone from 111.6 kg to 110 kg, not sure how? Maybe it's the water weight, but that doesn't make sense either since my pt told me drink about 4 liters of water everyday. 
But let's get down to it, I'll post the full values per day first.
Protein: 336 g
Fat: 161 g
Carbs: 65 g
Kcal: 3027.

It's divided into 6 meals, I haven't been following the order of the meals everyday but I do eat all of the meals in one day.
All the food weights are after they've been cooked.

Meal 1:
Omega 3 pill, multivitamin pill, magnesium pill (been having cramps in my calfs when I try to jogg or run).
20 g of whey, 3 eggs.

Meal 2:
60 g cashew, 250 g chicken breast no skin (I just throw it in the oven until it's done), 100 g vegetables (usually broccoli).

Meal 3:
250 g salmon (I just throw this in the oven as well), 100 g vegetables.

Meal 4:
250 g chicken breast no skin , 100 g vegetables.

Meal 5:
250 g minced beef.

Meal 6:
Alternative 1:
40 g whey + ZMA pill.
Alternative 2:
250 g Quark I think it's called or I've heard it's similar to cottage cheese?

I've also been told to drink 15 g of BCAAs before training and then 15 g after.

I guess I'll take any feedback on this, from a newbie perspective I thought eating this much would be more of a bulk?

*Training*
Training program:
The program is split into 5 days.

I'm just copying the papers I've gotten from my pt, we're going go through all the workouts together starting yesterday we did day 1 which is why I can barely sit on the toilet as I'm writing this, we're doing workout 2 and 3 tomorrow and thursday then workouts 4 and 5 next week. So I'll just be doing some of the normal workout sessions I've been doing until now so when I know how to do all the workouts he's written down for me I'll start with those.
Worth adding is that I will be doing at-least 20 minutes of cardio everyday during the morning or lunch and then do the workouts in the evening.

Day 1 - Front thigh (think this is called quads?), hamstrings and calfs. 
Day 2 - Chest, outside shoulders.
Day 3 - Back, backside shoulders.
Day 4 - Shoulders, triceps.
Day 5 - Arms, stomach. 
There's also a note saying that everyday should have a 4-5 set exercise for abs.

Day 1:
Front thigh:
Leg extensions 3 x 10 reps.
Leg press 3 x 12-15 reps.
Lunges (Had to translate not sure if correct name) 20 steps, 3 sets.
Squats, tried both "normal" and front but I prefer front barbell squats for now. 3 x 10-12 reps.
Leg extensions 6 x 10 with stretching in between each set.

Hamstrings:
Lying leg curl 3 x 10 reps.
Straight leg deadlift 3x 10 reps, had trouble doing these. Might replace with "goodmornings".
Kickback 3 x 15 reps.

Calf:
Standing calf press, 10 x 10, there's a note saying that I do 10 in the machine then I exit the machine and do 10 more on the floor.

Day 2:
Chest:
Incline dumbell press 3 x 8-12 reps.
Incline flyes 3 x 8-12 reps.
Bench press 3 x 8-12 reps.
Pec Deck 3 x 8-12 reps.
Cable crossovers, doesn't say how many sets/reps but a note saying that we will do a set then stretch then another set etc...

Outside shoulders:
Side lateral raise (translated, not sure if correct name) 3 x 15 reps.
Dumbell press 3 x 15 reps.
Cable drag (Cable Rope Rear-delt row?) 3 x 15 reps.

Day 3:
Back:
Chins 3 x 8-10 reps.
Lat pull down 3 x 8-10 reps.
Bent over long bar row 3 x 8-10 reps. 
Partial deadlifts 3 x 6-8 reps.
Machine row(no idea, will have to fill in after thursday when he shows me) 3 x 8-10 reps.
Dumbbell row 3 x 12-15
Sitting row (no idea, will have to fill in after thursday) 6 x 15 reps with stretching between each set.

Back shoulders:
Reverse dumbbell flyes 3 x 15-20 reps
Facepulls 3 x 15-20 reps

Lower back:
Back extensions (I think?) 3 x 20 reps.

Day 4:
Shoulders:
Sitting side raise 3 x 8-12 reps.
Dumbbell press 3 x 8-12 reps.
Front press smith 3 x 8-12 reps.
Cable side raise 3 x 8-12 reps.
Militarypress 3 x 12-15 reps.

Triceps:
Tricep pushdown 3 x 12-15 reps.
Close grip bench 3 x 8-10 reps.
Scull crushers 3 x 8-10 reps.
Dips 2 set failure.

Day 5:
Biceps:
Barbell curl 3 x 8-10 reps.
Dumbbell curl 3 x 8-10 reps.
Reverse barbell curl 3 x 8-10 reps.
Hammer curl 3 x 12-15 reps.

Triceps:
Tricep pushdown 3 x 8-10 reps.
Dips machine 3 x 8-10 reps.
Standing tricep extension 3 x 8-10 reps.
Cable one arm tricep extension 3 x 12-15 reps.

Yeah, this is the first time I've thoroughly read through all the exercises. I have a feeling that DOMS is going to be part of my daily life starting now haha!

But yeah, that's about it. An hour of writing, sorry for the bad English and some fail translated exercise names.

See you guys around!


----------



## NbleSavage (Aug 16, 2016)

Your BMR and TDEE calculations are in-line with what I ran for you using this calculator. 

Your total Kcals then on your training days (3027 planned vs 4040 TDEE) puts you in a *MASSIVE* caloric deficit - too severe, IMO and at risk for fawking up your metabolism. I also doubt yer in full blown ketosis at 65 grams of carbs per day, but thats for another discussion. If low carb / higher fat works for you, roll with it.

What I'd do...

* Up yer total KCals on training days to 3500. This should be more than enough to induce fat loss without blunting yer metabolism / sending yer body into starvation mode.

* On off days, eat just below maintenance at yer BMR - lets say 2100 Kcals to get you started. 

Eventually, as the weight comes off, ye'll want to look into cycling yer carbs a bit - this is where having a 'high day' (not the same as a 'cheat day') can be helpful to keep making progress. Thats down the road though, Mate.

All of that said, if you've hired a pro to plan yer diet for you, have this conversation with them first. Ask about why such a significant caloric deficit, if thats just an early 'shock the system' kind of thing they do and if they'll be raising yer kcals soon or if this is intended to be sustainable over time (hopefully not). 

You're doing right by planning yer macros - yer diet will govern the lion's share of yer success in body recomp and strength gains. Good start you've made here, Mate.

- Savage


----------



## Matt~ (Aug 16, 2016)

NbleSavage said:


> Your BMR and TDEE calculations are in-line with what I ran for you using [Had to remove the link ._.]
> 
> Your total Kcals then on your training days (3027 planned vs 4040 TDEE) puts you in a *MASSIVE* caloric deficit - too severe, IMO and at risk for fawking up your metabolism. I also doubt yer in full blown ketosis at 65 grams of carbs per day, but thats for another discussion. If low carb / higher fat works for you, roll with it.
> 
> ...



That's the calculator I used! Tried to link it but 20 post limit did it's work.

Yeah I mentioned it to him the other day and he said that the carbs were just from the vegetables and that it would be fine. But yeah I've heard below 20 grams is preferable and that 50 grams it the "limit" for staying in ketosis for many.

And yeah he said that he atleast wanted to start of with a low carb/ high fat plan for now, I'll update if he tells me to change it!

And wow even more food during the on days? It's a lot of food right now since I used to eat like 2000 to try to lose weight, but I'll also ask him about the "massive" deficit and if he's going to raise the kcals soon.

Thanks for the feedback you savage!


----------



## snake (Aug 17, 2016)

Smart move on getting the blood work done.

4 Liters of water a day is good goal. That will displace room in your stomach and give you a fuller feeling. It also will help flush water from your system so it's no surprise that you lost weight. You seem to be eating lean so don't be shocked at the volume. Easy on the cashews; there's a lot of fat there. I'm not starting a war over good fats and bad fats, trust me, that could get ugly. lol I'm not big on BCAAs and certainly don't think they need to be taken before a workout. Do you like yogurt? If so, get the low fat Greek yogurt; it's the food all the Greek Gods eat.

Your training has way too much shoulder work in it. You're arms will fall off in a few months with all that work. Drop the shoulder work on day 3 & 4. Please don't do abs every day. There's nothing magical about abs; it's just another muscle. I hit abs once a week with 3 sets of one exercise; done! Day 4 you're doing tri's and then again on day 5. Never hit a muscle directly or indirectly 2 days in a row.

That handled some of the basics and I'm sure I missed something. But here's what I see; some guy who at a young age has made his mind up to turn his life around; a guy that took the time to layout a course of action and willing to do what it takes and a guy who is open to advice from other who have gone there before him. This is what will make the difference in the final outcome, not all those numbers.

Good luck and hit me up if you need anything!


----------



## Matt~ (Aug 17, 2016)

snake said:


> Smart move on getting the blood work done.
> 
> 4 Liters of water a day is good goal. That will displace room in your stomach and give you a fuller feeling. It also will help flush water from your system so it's no surprise that you lost weight. You seem to be eating lean so don't be shocked at the volume. Easy on the cashews; there's a lot of fat there. I'm not starting a war over good fats and bad fats, trust me, that could get ugly. lol I'm not big on BCAAs and certainly don't think they need to be taken before a workout. Do you like yogurt? If so, get the low fat Greek yogurt; it's the food all the Greek Gods eat.
> 
> ...



Hey Snake!

I will look into how much shoulders and triceps I'm doing and maybe try to hit abs like 2 days a week instead? (I double checked the papers I got and their correct so it isn't a typo.)
And I was also told today that we will be switching program in a couple of weeks maybe a month or two, I'll update on that when that day arrives.

Btw thanks for the info on the water, didn't realize that it flushed the system. Yeah I'm just following the plan of 60 grams cashew, I'll try not to touch on the good/bad fats topic I have a feeling someone might broscience the shit out of me haha.

About the BCAAs I normally sip on one bottle (bout 15 grams) throughout my workout but I've started following the program so the last week it's been 1 bottle of BCAAs before and 1 bottle of them after training, just water during the workout.

But thanks for the help/feedback snake, I appreciate it!


----------



## Matt~ (Aug 17, 2016)

I also got scanned in a fit3d scanner, I'll be doing that once a month as well. 
From what I hear it's pretty new tech so maybe take measurements with a grain of salt?
But here's what I got, these are all in cm, not freedom units sorry bout that.
Bust:	128.3
Waist:	120.1
Hips:	119.9
Biceps (R):	44.8
Biceps (L):	43.5
Thigh (R):	72.0
Thigh (L):	71.4


----------



## Ryand (Aug 18, 2016)

Looks like the other bros responses got everything covered. Welcome and good luck man! Stay consistent and you will have results. Subbed for progress.

This forum is proven to be just as, if not MORE effective than the 21-day beach body fix. It is proven scientifically.


----------



## Matt~ (Aug 20, 2016)

Quick update since I only posted the journal 4 days ago.
Weight still same, stepped on the scale today and it showed 110.3 kilos. Intresting enough i was at 111.7 3 or 4 days ago, the day after legday but my pt told me that it was because of the DOMS, not sure how.

Anyways I did cardio 4 days this week, going for cardio all days next week.


----------



## kiwimike (Aug 20, 2016)

Matt~ said:


> Quick update since I only posted the journal 4 days ago.
> Weight still same, stepped on the scale today and it showed 110.3 kilos. Intresting enough i was at 111.7 3 or 4 days ago, the day after legday but my pt told me that it was because of the DOMS, not sure how.
> 
> Anyways I did cardio 4 days this week, going for cardio all days next week.



hey Matt, congratulations on starting your journey to a much happier life. The guys here will be able to help you with just about anything that you need to know. good luck and have fun man.


----------



## Matt~ (Aug 20, 2016)

kiwimike said:


> hey Matt, congratulations on starting your journey to a much happier life. The guys here will be able to help you with just about anything that you need to know. good luck and have fun man.



Thanks man, yeah I've been learning a lot the past couple of days.
I'll try to have fun as well, in the end it's the journey that counts right?


----------



## Matt~ (Aug 21, 2016)

Holy ****. I did cardio for 60 minutes yesterday, 30 minutes of stairs machine and 30 minutes on a cross-trainer I think their called. Anyways it felt so different compared to a week ago, I was sweating so much more but it also felt so much better right after the session. I'm guessing this is from how consistently I'm eating food and that my metabolism has improved.

Also watched Lifting Iron, man did I underestimate that movie. I love Arnolds "I’m getting the feeling of cumming backstage; when I pump up, when I pose out in front of 5000 people I get the same feeling, so I am cumming day and night. It’s terrific, right? So you know, I am in heaven." Arnold you beast.


----------



## Matt~ (Aug 25, 2016)

Yoyo, early weekend update I guess, had the time so figured I'd go for it.

As promised photos are here, not seeing any real difference on the photos but the scale showed 108.9 kg this morning before breakfast so that's progress!

This week felt pretty good, but work starts next monday I think the real challenge is going to start then because I'll work from 1.45 pm to 11.15 pm so I'll have to squeeze in cardio and workouts but I'll work it out somehow.

Next week will be the first time I run the program from day 1 to 5 in order, these last 2 I haven't been able to because I've had sessions with my pt, 3 a week where we went through all of the days so that I wouldn't **** up the technique.


----------



## Matt~ (Aug 28, 2016)

Starting next week I'll also be working, when I started this log I wasn't working anywhere since I had just finished school.
But starting tomorrow I'll work from 1.45 pm to 11.15 pm Monday to Thursday and I have friday off. I'll have to do cardio and workouts in the morning/lunch but I've decided to walk/try to jog for an hour everyday just after I wake up and then at 11 am workout.

I've decided to not weigh myself until this Thursday so I have no idea where I'm currently at but hopefully somewhere below 109 kilos.

I've also had "sunday mealprep" today, here's a picture of that.


----------



## Franklin Yeti (Aug 29, 2016)

Good on you for wanting to get healthy.  Keep it up and don't get discouraged if things aren't moving for you as fast as you would like.  The turtle wins homey!


----------



## Chaos (Aug 30, 2016)

Matt,
Congrats on making the decision to eat healthy and workout!!! The best thing anyone can do is make a decision and follow through on it, you'll learn as you go along. Every guy on here who has worked out for years and is honest can tell you about at least one stupid thing they've done. The only comments I would make, and other guys have commented on a lot of this already is:
1. Don't cut your calories too hard, it will affect your progress and make it difficult to stay on track. I personally eat mostly the same foods every day, just makes planning easy.
2. Skip the low carb diet. You probably aren't getting into ketosis at the carb level you are eating and a keto diet isn't a great idea to begin with (I could give you all the reasons if you really want them). Try dividing your calories by 3 and that's how many calories you want to get from each of protein, carbs and fat.
3. Try hitting each muscle group only once a week (that has been mentioned before). For legs, start with squats then finish up with some other quad work and some hammies. I know guys who have massive legs and all they pretty much have ever done was squats.
4. Most of your weight loss is going to come from diet and not cardio, but the cardio will help and it will build up your heart which will help during those leg training days.
5.  Remember it will take time. No one ever became over-weight in a month so it isn't all coming off in a month.
There are guys on here with a lot more posts than me but that doesn't mean I don't have my share of mistakes you can learn from.


----------



## DieYoungStrong (Aug 30, 2016)

Good luck. Just stay the course and have some patience. Patience is the key.


----------



## Matt~ (Aug 30, 2016)

Franklin Yeti said:


> Good on you for wanting to get healthy.  Keep it up and don't get discouraged if things aren't moving for you as fast as you would like.  The turtle wins homey!



Haha thanks! Yeah I'll turtle my way to success!



Chaos said:


> Matt,
> Congrats on making the decision to eat healthy and workout!!! The best thing anyone can do is make a decision and follow through on it, you'll learn as you go along. Every guy on here who has worked out for years and is honest can tell you about at least one stupid thing they've done. The only comments I would make, and other guys have commented on a lot of this already is:
> 1. Don't cut your calories too hard, it will affect your progress and make it difficult to stay on track. I personally eat mostly the same foods every day, just makes planning easy.
> 2. Skip the low carb diet. You probably aren't getting into ketosis at the carb level you are eating and a keto diet isn't a great idea to begin with (I could give you all the reasons if you really want them). Try dividing your calories by 3 and that's how many calories you want to get from each of protein, carbs and fat.
> ...



Hey thanks for the feedback, the amount of food I'm getting in me keeps me pretty full compared to what I used to eat (1800ish) but eating around 3000 feels pretty good, are you saying that I should go higher?  (I know that NbleSavage earlier expressed that he felt the deficit was massive). But yeah Mealprep sunday worked out well, feels like a routine I'm going to keep.

About the lowcarb/keto diet I actually wouldn't mind the reasons (on here or just pm me if you feel up to telling me), just to learn I mean. Though it is what my PT insists on that I eat right now, I think I will stay with it for atleast another month and see how it pans out.

Yeah I've seen a couple of you mention that I do some musclegroups too often, when I asked my PT he said the reason we're working shoulders so much right now is because he feels that that's where I'm lacking. (He also told me that we're switching training plan, I'm but not sure when though. Actually I'll ask thursday what and when we're switching). 
Thanks for the tip about the legs, I'm currently doing front squats, they feel alot better at the moment than regular squats. 

And thanks for the other parts as well, I'm just eager to get going and to get this shit off my body haha!





DieYoungStrong said:


> Good luck. Just stay the course and have some patience. Patience is the key.



Thanks a lot! I thought I had a lot of patience, appears that I need some more!


----------



## Matt~ (Sep 1, 2016)

Quick update:
Had a meeting with the PT today, weighed in at 109.8 kilos. Measured my waist at 115 cm today with is 5 cm down from when I started so I guess slowly but surely we're getting there.
He also lowered my calories down to 2700, lowered amounts of salmon and cashew I think it was.

I also asked him about my training program, he said he wanted me to keep on doing this one for another 6 weeks ish and then he want's me to do the Y3T program by Neil Hill. Basically it's a 3 week program, first week 6-10 reps high volume, second week 12-16 reps and then third week 20-100 reps (to failure exercises I guess).

I would love to hear some thoughts on the Y3T if any one has followed it or similar before.


----------



## Chaos (Sep 4, 2016)

Figure out what your maintenance calories are and go about 600 below that. You'll lose about a pound a week. You'll have to restrict it just a little more each week, maybe 10 calories as you loss weight to maintain the same deficit.  600 always seemed pretty good to me because even the best of use miss a few calories here and there or we don't perfectly measure out a teaspoon so it gives some margin of error.

reasons the low carb is the best way to go? You workouts suffer because you don't have ready glycogen to use, and glycogen uptake fills out your muscles. Your brain suffers because its favorite source of energy is glycogen. It is a diet that can be hard on the liver and kidneys. Keeping your carbs low and getting too many calories will still result in weight gain. A guy did a study where he figured out his required calories and ate below that but ate twinkies and Big Macs and he still lost weight. The diet is too restrictive to really be a long term solution, have a piece of cake and you've wasted 3 days because now you have to get back into ketosis. Be more concerned with controlling insulin. Get a small amount of carbs in the morning, before a workout and then slightly more after your workout. Throw in some cardio to make up for any cheating and you are on your way. 

One thing I will say is that you can do a keto run. In a keto run you drop your carbs for 1-2 weeks. Over that amount of time it is easy to stay disciplined. Then once it is over, take a day to carb up, your muscles will soak it up.

You say that your trainer hits shoulders more often because he feels it is lacking but you're using your delts when you do chest and back and trust me, all that repetitive stress on the shoulders will take its tow later.

Stay the course, like everyone else there is greatness in you. You just have to be willing to put in the work and sacrifice to get there.


----------



## Matt~ (Sep 5, 2016)

Thanks Chaos 
I've written it before but my PT has me quite a bit below maintenance right now, I never really got a good and clear answer as to why. (Everyday is about 2700 calories as of this point at my TDEE should be bout 4000 during my workout days which are 5 times a week, sometimes 6.

I'll ask him next time (next meet is in friday next week) why we're doing keto. About being in ketosis I'm unsure if I am, I purchased a bunch of ketostix or whatever their called and it was negative, didn't even go slightly red or orange. But I'll keep on checking throughout the week.

I'm pretty happy with the diet at the moment even though the things I wrote above, I weighted in at 108.6 after breakfast today.  

Not sure what to comment about the shoulders, I asked about them and that's what he said, I'll have to trust him for now unless I experience discomfort or something.

But yeah I'll stay the course for sure, slowly but surely we're approaching that 100 mark!


----------



## Matt~ (Sep 10, 2016)

Current weight, 108 kg before breakfast.
Didn't train the last 3 days due to being sick but still lost some weight since last time, didn't expect that since I'm eating the same meals training days and off days. 
Still did my morning cardio all days, about 45-60 minutes of walking.

Not sure why some pics get rotated.
Pics:


----------



## Matt~ (Sep 16, 2016)

Hey guys!
Weigh in at 107.3 today, waist was 114 cm at the coach so 6 cm down since the start.

My pt/coach and I did talk for a few minutes about my testosterone during todays meeting, last time I got blood checked which was when I started this it was at 11.8 nmol/L which is 340 ng/dL.

He told me that we could raise it by doing a TRT dose(I think), probably will make a thread to get opinions on this.
We said we would talk more about it in 2 weeks which is next meeting. From what he said I think he was suggesting 1 mg everyweek from a 250mg/ml vial but then again I haven't read up to much on this topic so that's what I'll be doing tonight, haven't heard of people my age doing TRT before.
Edit, I am aware that the post in cycle part of the forums says 25 and close to genetic limit is whats being recommended, does this apply to trt aswell?

Anyways, I'm off to the gym. Ill try to explain my thought process later.
Will upload pics later tonight.


----------



## Matt~ (Sep 16, 2016)

What I was trying to say was that I'm asking because I'm trying to be cautious about it, I don't know stuff such as, what's high and low in a TRT dose, when does it go from TRT to cycle, does TRT require some form of PCT etc. I've got a lot to learn.

Edit, just now read over at the trt board that splitting 100mg per week is where to start, no wonder I thought 250 sounded a bit high, anyways. Just wanted to express that I'm really thankfull for all the info you members put on this board, saving us noobs from shooting ourselves in our foots on a daily basis.


----------



## automatondan (Sep 17, 2016)

I bet you that you will see a positive change (naturally) in your testosterone totals and production if you keep working hard, eating right, and stay the course. Give it time, and put in the hard work first. Get your weight down and then get tested. Going on a cycle down with what little you know would have devastating consequences for your health long-term... Read up, lots of info on here.


----------



## Matt~ (Sep 17, 2016)

automatonDan said:


> I bet you that you will see a positive change (naturally) in your testosterone totals and production if you keep working hard, eating right, and stay the course. Give it time, and put in the hard work first. Get your weight down and then get tested. Going on a cycle down with what little you know would have devastating consequences for your health long-term... Read up, lots of info on here.



Yeah I think so too, and yeah a cycle isn't what I had in mind when I asked, pretty set on that I will hold of on that for a couple of years if I eventually get close to some kind of limit. Need to pay my dues in the gym first before I get a piece of that cake haha.

And yeah about waiting and giving it time was/still is my original plan, I will probably still make a thread over at trt to get some other opinions on it, even if it's just for learning.

But thanks for the reply Dan, I appreciate it.

------------------

Update.

Promised pictures, forgot to take them yesterday so I took them today. 
This is pretty much the first time I see and feel some kind of difference.
Was still weighing 107.3 kg when I took these.


----------



## Matt~ (Oct 16, 2016)

Hey, long time no write haha.

Haven't been logging much but I've kept on going with the program, had a cheat day or two but nothing else.

Not a lot of progress but I see some difference from the first pics so pretty glad I took those. Going to change over my training program to Y3T starting next friday.

Last time I weighted in was last thursday and I was sitting at 106.8 kg.


----------

